Iran nuclear deal reached

thebigabd

thebigabd

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Big win for Obama.

  • Pathways to a bomb are blocked
  • Conventional arms embargo stays in place for 5 years
  • Missile sanctions stay in place for 8 years
  • Inspections of military and nuclear sites
  • Support of UK, France, Germany, Russia, and China

Israel not happy, but the only way they would be happy is if we sent our men and women in uniform to war for their security.

http://www.cnn.com/2015/07/14/politics/iran-nuclear-deal/index.html
 
Big win for pretty much the entire world other than Suadi Arabia whose wealth depends on keeping Iran out of the world economy and far right religious lunatics in Israel.

Biggest part of what you said is that the UK, France, Germany, Russia, China and the European Union were all at the table and approved the deal. This is not some unilateral deal where we went it alone or with limited allies. That has proven to be when we get it wrong.

Sad to see every republican coming out with misleading statements. Sure would be nice if just once they put peace and prosperity ahead of politics.
 
bocabull said:
Big win for pretty much the entire world other than Suadi Arabia whose wealth depends on keeping Iran out of the world economy and far right religious lunatics in Israel.

Biggest part of what you said is that the UK, France, Germany, Russia, China and the European Union were all at the table and approved the deal. This is not some unilateral deal where we went it alone or with limited allies. That has proven to be when we get it wrong.

Sad to see every republican coming out with misleading statements. Sure would be nice if just once they put peace and prosperity ahead of politics.
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I agree with that, entirely.

Saudi Arabia, the biggest sponsor of terrorism in the world, has a problem with it. Mainly for the reason you said, it hurts their oil prices.

Israel also hates it, but you are right, the current Israeli leadership is full of absolute maniacs. Israel wouldn't be happy until we put Americans in harms way to defend their interests.

I love how the Republicans stand up there and talk about our Gulf allies, like Saudi Arabia. We constantly demonize Iran for human rights violations, etc. Yet we are completely in bed with Saudi Arabia, a religious monarchy with a horrible human and civil rights record, on top of being the actual sponsor of terror in the world.
 
It's a strange dynamic. Saudi Arabia is Sunni, home of Bin Laden. Al Qaeda is Suuni. Saddam was Suuni. ISIS is Suuni. Yet like you say we cozy up to Saudia Arabia. These cold wars are nonsense. The goal should be, even though we have differences, how do we get along. Respect each other. Kerry really seems to get along with the world diplomats right now. Netanyahu is a divisive bomb thrower.

In Irans defense we armed Saddam and emboldened him. They had a right to be pissed and distrustful towards us.
 
bocabull said:
It's a strange dynamic. Saudi Arabia is Sunni, home of Bin Laden. Al Qaeda is Suuni. Saddam was Suuni. ISIS is Suuni. Yet like you say we cozy up to Saudia Arabia. These cold wars are nonsense. The goal should be, even though we have differences, how do we get along. Respect each other. Kerry really seems to get along with the world diplomats right now. Netanyahu is a divisive bomb thrower.

In Irans defense we armed Saddam and emboldened him. They had a right to be pissed and distrustful towards us.
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The history goes deeper than that.... in 1953 Iran had a democratically elected government, and the elected President of Iran (Mohammad Mossadegh) decided that he was going to nationalize the Iranian oil industry, which at the time was practically owned by British Petroleum.

The CIA then overthrew the elected government and installed a puppet dictatorship (the Shah) who was pro US in every sense of the word.

Fast forward to 1979, and the Iranians overthrew the Shah and the Islamic Revolution had begun.

Shortly after that, we armed and financed Iraq to wage war on Iran. About a quarter of a million people died in the war.

Then in 1988 the United States shot down a civilian passenger airliner, killing 290 people.

After that, the United States continued to sanction and isolate Iran from the world economy, which resulted in inflation, poverty, lack of medical equipment, etc.

Most American's don't really bother to understand the history between these two countries, but it is no surprise they don't like us. We wouldn't like them either. And it all started when we overthrew a democratically elected government because they wanted to take oil profits away from the US and the UK.
 
My issue with the agreement is when Iran, Russia, and China are "high-fiving", then that leads me to believe it was not in the U.S. best interests to move forward. Russia and China are going to profit significantly from this agreement.

Russia has already lifted sanctions, Iran continues to support Syria, and the coalition with our allies had already fallen apart before anything was signed. That is...the coalition of countries that imposed economic sanctions against Iran which included not just the the typical allies of Japan, the EC, and the West but the aforementioned China and Russia, two countries who rarely support US interests.

However, I will wait for the written agreement (and spin) and then further wait to see if the agreement holds water. And furthermore, I will wait to see if Iran follows the agreement to the letter and what we will do when Iran violates the agreement....because they will. I fear though that it is already moot as US' traditional allies in Egypt, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, and Israel will continue to make alternative plans in light of this agreement and the world will be a more dangerous place because of it.

As an example, Egyptian TV personality Tawfik Okasha called Netanyahu "our dear friend" and suggested Israel take out the Bushehr Nuclear Reactor. "Put your trust in God and bomb it," Okasha said. "We are with you and if you need fuel for the jets, we will give it to you." And a popular Emirati political commentator, Mishaal al-Gergawi, stated “A lot of the Gulf countries feel they are being thrown under the bus”. Even more surprising was a position paper by Israeli opposition leader Isaac Herzog and Tzipi Livni demanding that Washington give a green light to any military action Israel deems necessary in facing the Iranian threat.

Having said that, what this agreement provides, with the onerous restrictions on "inspectors", is a false sense of security....at least on the surface.

Again, I will read the details when they are released, but even certain democrats are expressing skeptism and reluctance with regard to this deal.
 
Nobody in the Middle East is our true allie. They are all dysfunctional. Frankly Iran might be the most functional of them all. Not sure why people act like China is our adversary. They are our most important partner in the world. Russia is a nobody.

The agreement has teeth. Iran has completely lived up to their end of the agreement throughout the entire process. It's funny to hear people who said the sanctions Obama was able to implement wouldn't work, now saying they should not be lifted. The sanctions were put in place to get this exact agreement. Obama's strategy worked. Plain and simple. His critics as usual have been dead wrong throughout the entire process. We are infinitely safer and more secure under Obama than under dumbass W where everything was unraveling, both domestically and abroad. Remarkable the progress that has been made the past 6 years. History will be very kind to the 44th President of the United States. Bush 43 chapter is closed. It was an unmitigated failure on virtually every front.
 
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Another funny thing about this deal, especially those opposing it, is it is entirely based around something (nuclear weapons and/or the pursuit of them) that they haven't proven Iran even has.

It is a "suspected" nuclear program.

Iran even waiting 5 years for sanctions, still being sanctioned in some ways, etc is strange, especially considering they just agreed not to pursue something nobody has proven they have.

It's as if the government showed up at your house and said, "give up your shotgun", when you don't have a shotgun. You then plead with the officials that you don't have a shotgun, and they decide to withhold money from your paychecks, interview your family members, prevent you from purchasing any goods from any retailer that sells shotguns, etc. Then you strike a deal with them on the basis of "if you don't show any evidence that you are going to buy a shotgun in 5 years, we will start lifting some of these penalties off you".... The entire time, you are probably thinking "but you haven't even proven that I ever owned a shotgun!"
 
thebigabd said:
Another funny thing about this deal, especially those opposing it, is it is entirely based around something (nuclear weapons and/or the pursuit of them) that they haven't proven Iran even has.

It is a "suspected" nuclear program.

Iran even waiting 5 years for sanctions, still being sanctioned in some ways, etc is strange, especially considering they just agreed not to pursue something nobody has proven they have.

It's as if the government showed up at your house and said, "give up your shotgun", when you don't have a shotgun. You then plead with the officials that you don't have a shotgun, and they decide to withhold money from your paychecks, interview your family members, prevent you from purchasing any goods from any retailer that sells shotguns, etc. Then you strike a deal with them on the basis of "if you don't show any evidence that you are going to buy a shotgun in 5 years, we will start lifting some of these penalties off you".... The entire time, you are probably thinking "but you haven't even proven that I ever owned a shotgun!"
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I guess your idea of "proof" and mine are different.

If you don't think Iran had a nuclear program, I have some beach front property in Tulsa, OK to sell you.
 
WTSooner said:
I guess your idea of "proof" and mine are different.

If you don't think Iran had a nuclear program, I have some beach front property in Tulsa, OK to sell you.
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Nuclear programs aren't illegal. Lots of countries have them.
 
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/us-disturbed-by-iranian-leaders-criticism-after-deal/ar-AAdgNd9

Is it any wonder the Iranians are laughing at us?

We capitulated on the sanctions. We threw in a "lifting of conventional weapons purchases" into a nuclear arms agreement. We allowed the Iranians to effectively hamstring any inspections (from a US perspective). We structured the agreement in a manner so that the US Congress would have no say into the approval of the deal and we put in a sunset provision. And finally, the deal states that the U.S. will train Iranians to counter any sabotage attempts on its nuclear facilities and systems.

The last time a feeble leader of a fading nation came bearing “Peace in our time,” a pugnacious controversial right-winger retorted, “You were given the choice between war and dishonor. You chose dishonor, and you will have war.” That right-winger went on to lead the United Kingdom against Hitler. I pray this doesn't turn out to be the case....but if it is a strong right-winger to confront the evil, it will be Bibi.
 
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Iran is enriching uranium. As I understand it, you only need enriched uranium for weapons. Apparently, it is not necessary for energy. That seems like absolute proof and the world pretty much concurred with that conclusion by imposing sanctions through the UN. It is not easy to get things passed in the UN.
 
Take the political crap somewhere else


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Max Power said:
The mods have actually allowed those to be the place for politics
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True. But only if the participants can find a way to discuss politics or any other topic in a civil manner from this point forward. Anything less could jeopardize the future of the Smack Talk board.
 
Signed sealed and delivered. Huge accomplishment. Great job by a great President and great administration.

Obama just keeps on racking up victories and his critics look less credible by the day, if that's even possible after them being wrong on everything for 7 years. A job well done. Obama's place in history as one of the best Presidents of all time is cemented at this point.
 
bocabull said:
Signed sealed and delivered. Huge accomplishment. Great job by a great President and great administration.

Obama just keeps on racking up victories and his critics look dumber by the day. A job well done.
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  • Iran Nuclear Deal which will prevent a war
  • 2014 was best year of job creation this century
  • Economy moving in right direction
  • End of Iraq war
  • End of Afghanistan War
  • Found and Killed Osama bin Laden
  • Obamacare
  • Dodd-Frank Wall Street Reform
  • Revived the American Auto Industry
  • Repealed Don't Ask, Don't Tell
  • Toppled Moammar Gaddafi
  • Implemented a tax on tobacco products that gave 4 million children health insurance

I am not sure if it could have gone better, given the state of the economy that he inherited. I don't like some things about Obamacare, but other than that it's been a major success.
 
lol

America....where we trust Iran but not the american civilians
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
lol

America....where we trust Iran but not the american civilians
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You obviously don't know the history behind American-Iranian relations. It's not favorable or flattering of the United States/UK.

This entire anti-Iran thing was a total sham. It has no legal, ethical, or logical basis.
 
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