Newcomers vs. Freshman early on in the Big 12

[thebigabd]

Newcomers are playing pretty well for the Big 12, despite a very heavy freshman class. Just listing Mcdonalds All-Americans for the freshman class, to see how they are doing..


Newcomers

PG: Lance Jeter (6'3'' 225-NEBRASKA) - Averaging 10 points, 3 rebounds, and 3.5 assists for the 4-1 Huskers. Is 6-8 from the 3pt line and shoots 60% from the field.

SG: David Tairu (6'3'' 188-TECH) - Averaging 11 points and 2 rebounds per game for 7-0 Texas Tech. Shoots 61% from the 3pt line, 78% from the foul line, and 55% from the field.

SF: Marquis Gilstrap (6'7'' 210- ISU) - Averaging 13.4 points and 8.3 rebounds for the 6-1 Cyclones. Shooting 43% from the 3pt line.

PF: Curtis Kelley (6'8'' 250- KSTATE)- Averaging 13.3 points, 8.5 rebounds, and 1.6 blocks per game for the 5-1 Wildcats.

C: Ekpe Udoh (6'10'' 240- BAYLOR) - Averaging 15 points, 9.3 rebounds, and 3.5 blocks per game for Baylor. Is 3-6 from the 3pt line.

Freshman

PG: Tommy Mason-Griffin (5'11'' 206- OU) - Averaging 8.8 points, 2.7 rebounds, and 5.1 assists for the 3-3 Sooners. Shoots 41% from the 3pt line.

SG: Avery Bradley (6'2'' 180 - UT) - Averaging 8.6 points and 1 rebound per game. Shoots 33% for the undefeated Longhorns.

SF: Xavier Henry (6'6'' 200 - KU) - Averaging 16.8 points, 4.4 rebounds, and 2.4 assists for the undefeated Jayhawks. Shoots 47% from the 3pt line.

PF: Wally Judge (6'9'' 220 - KSU) - Averaging 5.5 points and 4.5 rebounds for K-State. Shoots 52% from the field.

C: Tiny Gallon (6'9 296 - OU) - Averaging 12.3 points and 10.5 rebounds for the 3-3 Sooners. Shooting 60% from the field and 76% from the foul line. Double/Double in 24 minutes a game.

 

[Seymore Cox]

Hard for me to consider Udoh and Kelly "newcomers" since they've played high major division one basketball and in Kelly's case, he got to practice against multiple NBA players daily.

 

[sharp1]

Newcomers are playing pretty well for the Big 12, despite a very heavy freshman class.

Newcomers

PG: Lance Jeter (6'3'' 225-NEBRASKA) - Averaging 10 points, 3 rebounds, and 3.5 assists for the 4-1 Huskers. Is 6-8 from the 3pt line and shoots 60% from the field.

SG: David Tairu (6'3'' 188-TECH) - Averaging 11 points and 2 rebounds per game for 7-0 Texas Tech. Shoots 61% from the 3pt line, 78% from the foul line, and 55% from the field.

SF: Marquis Gilstrap (6'7'' 210- ISU) - Averaging 13.4 points and 8.3 rebounds for the 6-1 Cyclones. Shooting 43% from the 3pt line.

PF: Curtis Kelley (6'8'' 250- KSTATE)- Averaging 13.3 points, 8.5 rebounds, and 1.6 blocks per game for the 5-1 Wildcats.

C: Ekpe Udoh (6'10'' 240- BAYLOR) - Averaging 15 points, 9.3 rebounds, and 3.5 blocks per game for Baylor. Is 3-6 from the 3pt line.

Freshman

PG: Tommy Mason-Griffin (5'11'' 206- OU) - Averaging 8.8 points, 2.7 rebounds, and 5.1 assists for the 3-3 Sooners. Shoots 41% from the 3pt line.

SG: Avery Bradley (6'2'' 180 - UT) - Averaging 8.6 points and 1 rebound per game. Shoots 33% for the undefeated Longhorns.

SF: Xavier Henry (6'6'' 200 - KU) - Averaging 16.8 points, 4.4 rebounds, and 2.4 assists for the undefeated Jayhawks. Shoots 47% from the 3pt line.

PF: Wally Judge (6'9'' 220 - KSU) - Averaging 5.5 points and 4.5 rebounds for K-State. Shoots 52% from the field.

C: Tiny Gallon (6'9 296 - OU) - Averaging 12.3 points and 10.5 rebounds for the 3-3 Sooners. Shooting 60% from the field and 76% from the foul line. Double/Double in 24 minutes a game.

No Pledger on this list....this is incomplete and not finished....2nd leading scorer among freshman in the Big 12
Right now Pledger is Playing better then bradley in my opinion

 

[BigTime]

No Pledger on this list....this is incomplete and not finished....2nd leading scorer among freshman in the Big 12

Yeah I would put Pledge in over TMG at this point and just make AB a "PG"

 

[thebigabd]

Hard for me to consider Udoh and Kelly "newcomers" since they've played high major division one basketball and in Kelly's case, he got to practice against multiple NBA players daily.

They are up for newcomer of the year in the Big 12.

 

[thebigabd]

No Pledger on this list....this is incomplete and not finished....2nd leading scorer among freshman in the Big 12
Right now Pledger is Playing better then bradley in my opinion

You are right, Pledger (OU) and Burks (CU) are playing a lot better than Bradley and TMG right now, but I just listed McDonald's All-Americans for the freshman since they get so much pub preseason.

If I was going to make a list of freshman based on how they played instead of Mcdonalds hype it would be:

PG: Alec Burks (Colorado)
SG: Stephen Pledger (Oklahoma)
SF: Xavier Henry (Kansas)
PF: Wally Judge (Kansas State)
C: Tiny Gallon (Oklahoma)

Wally is not living up to hype, but I couldn't think of a freshman post player doing anything right now in the Big 12.

 

[ByronHoustonsSweatyPalms]

Maybe not a MD AA, but Ray Penn is starting at PG for the pokes and playing more minutes than even James Anderson (37 minutes last night). He doesn't have gawdy numbers but he has ran the team efficeintly and played like a veteran. He is probably as valauable to his team as any of the Big 12 newcomers.

He has performed better than I expected.

 

[FaithfulSooner]

Looks like you left a few freshman off this list. Remember tell the whole story. Your numbers are skewed. BOOMER SOONER BABY!!!

 

[gracefor24]

Looks like you left a few freshman off this list. Remember tell the whole story. Your numbers are skewed. BOOMER SOONER BABY!!!

I don't get it. Why not just say what you are inferring?

 

[Seymore Cox]

You are right, Pledger (OU) and Burks (CU) are playing a lot better than Bradley and TMG right now, but I just listed McDonald's All-Americans for the freshman since they get so much pub preseason.

If I was going to make a list of freshman based on how they played instead of Mcdonalds hype it would be:

PG: Alec Burks (Colorado)
SG: Stephen Pledger (Oklahoma)
SF: Xavier Henry (Kansas)
PF: Wally Judge (Kansas State)
C: Tiny Gallon (Oklahoma)

Wally is not living up to hype, but I couldn't think of a freshman post player doing anything right now in the Big 12.

Base the list on fact not some "McDonaldsAA" peception. You hyped the Reese kid from TT and he's been less than stellar. Same with Laron Dendy. Fact is Gallon, Henry, and Bradley are heads and shoulders better than anybody on the newcomer list with the exception of Udoh.

They are up for newcomer of the year in the Big 12.

I was aware of that when you posted it. My point is that those guys have been playing as high and maybe higher levels of college basketball before they got to the big12. Hardly newcomers when it comes to playing on this level.

 

[gracefor24]

Base the list on fact not some "McDonaldsAA" peception. You hyped the Reese kid from TT and he's been less than stellar. Same with Laron Dendy. Fact is Gallon, Henry, and Bradley are heads and shoulders better than anybody on the newcomer list with the exception of Udoh.




I was aware of that when you posted it. My point is that those guys have been playing as high and maybe higher levels of college basketball before they got to the big12. Hardly newcomers when it comes to playing on this level.

It is the definition of newcomer though. Either way it's obvious that the freshman are overall more talented.

 

[thebigabd]

You hyped the Reese kid from TT and he's been less than stellar. Same with Laron Dendy.

Dendy got hurt and has only played in 2 games. He scored 16 in their opener though...

Reese from Tech has been a little surprising... He was supposed to be a big shooter on the wing but he is only 4-16 to start the year. Maybe he will heat up as he gets more comfortable, who knows. But Tairu has been as advertised for them.

Fact is Gallon, Henry, and Bradley are heads and shoulders better than anybody on the newcomer list with the exception of Udoh.

The newcomer team would probably run the MCDAA's this year. Udoh, Gilstrap, and Kelley are all legit. Tairu and Jeter aren't stars but they are definitely guys that you bring in to make your team better right away, and they have done that for Nebraska and Tech.

I havent been too thrilled with Bradley yet... He is a great athlete and I am sure he will turn it on, but 8 points and 1 rebound per game for someone with his hype is a little disappointing.

Maybe not a MD AA, but Ray Penn is starting at PG for the pokes and playing more minutes than even James Anderson (37 minutes last night). He doesn't have gawdy numbers but he has ran the team efficeintly and played like a veteran. He is probably as valauable to his team as any of the Big 12 newcomers.

He has performed better than I expected.

Yea, looks like Penn is going to be a real good four year player for Oklahoma State.

 

[oSuJeff97]

Maybe not a MD AA, but Ray Penn is starting at PG for the pokes and playing more minutes than even James Anderson (37 minutes last night). He doesn't have gawdy numbers but he has ran the team efficeintly and played like a veteran. He is probably as valauable to his team as any of the Big 12 newcomers.

He has performed better than I expected.

Agreed.

I've been really impressed with his ball security, which is always a concern with true freshmen. He's really only had one bad game in the TO departments so far... the Bradley game (3).

He's averaging 9.0 ppg on a team where he's about the fourth or fifth scoring option.

I would like to see him get a few more assists going forward, and obviously limiting turnovers will continue to be important.

 

[Seymore Cox]

Agreed.

I've been really impressed with his ball security, which is always a concern with true freshmen. He's really only had one bad game in the TO departments so far... the Bradley game (3).

He's averaging 9.0 ppg on a team where he's about the fourth or fifth scoring option.

I would like to see him get a few more assists going forward, and obviously limiting turnovers will continue to be important.

Any opinions on Tiny Gallon or Steve Pledger?

 

[ByronHoustonsSweatyPalms]

Any opinions on Tiny Gallon or Steve Pledger?

I went to bed the other night at a point that OU was smoking Houston. At that point I thought that Gallion looked like a man among boys. What happened?

 

[21standyale]

Any opinions on Tiny Gallon or Steve Pledger?

Tiny looks like a man among boys, with some solid athleticism. Pledger could become a prolific scorer if he added a wrinkle to his game. He can shoot the three lights out and varying his game up like James Anderson or Damion James have done throughout their careers could make him unguardable.

 

[DenverSooner]

There are a lot of things to like about OU's freshman class. TMG has shown some moments that make me believe he is going to be outstanding. Tiny is averaging a double, double. Pledger's shooting cannot be called a fluke after 6 games.

Once they get it (it being you have to play outstanding defense in college because everyone can hit 3 pointers at around 50% when left wide open or dunk on you if you leave them in the paint) the defense will improve. They just don't have the desire to play defense right now. They desire to play offense and desire to win games. They just need to learn that defense is the glue that keeps offense and winning together.

TMG is also going to learn to take better care of the ball. I seriously might give a turn over limit before some of the easier games and sit him if he breaks the limit. He has to learn that turn overs in college ball are killers. Nobody expects him to be perfect, he just needs to value the basketball just as much as he values those sweet passes he makes.

 

[Seymore Cox]

My thing about OU'S class is talk to me in year three. Fitzgerald himself, has had a better start to the year than any freshman in the Capel era before this year outside of Blake and Willie. If we look at guys that have had great SR. years like AJ, they would die to begin their careers with the productivity of Fitzgerald. Right now, Pledger is having a year that rivals WW's year last year. He's probably a little bit ahead of the curve as far as shooting is concerned. Pledger, TMG, and Fitz in year three will all be starters. Probably all starters next year. That's when we'll see the true potential of this class met. You throw in a Clark, and they lack one piece of the puzzle to make them very solid.

 

[oSuJeff97]

Any opinions on Tiny Gallon or Steve Pledger?

Just based on numbers, they look very solid.

I'll have a more informed opinion once I actually see OU play.

 

[Sawyer]

My thing about OU'S class is talk to me in year three. Fitzgerald himself, has had a better start to the year than any freshman in the Capel era before this year outside of Blake and Willie. If we look at guys that have had great SR. years like AJ, they would die to begin their careers with the productivity of Fitzgerald. Right now, Pledger is having a year that rivals WW's year last year. He's probably a little bit ahead of the curve as far as shooting is concerned. Pledger, TMG, and Fitz in year three will all be starters. Probably all starters next year. That's when we'll see the true potential of this class met. You throw in a Clark, and they lack one piece of the puzzle to make them very solid.

I echo this.

It's still way too early to make any real judgments. Recruiting classes will always be graded on signing day, and after a few weeks of the season, and after the first year. But until you see how those players impact a team over a four-year span, it's pretty pointless to try to make a meaningful analysis (not that that was the goal of the thread).

There are always going to be players who just aren't quite ready yet, but have the potential to put together outstanding college careers. There are also guys who may be ready and show flashes of brilliance, but are playing behind other players with more experience. I'm sure just about every school right now who signed more than two recruits has a guy who fits into one of the two categories who fans truly believe will go on to do big things (I feel that way about both Dixon and Underwood right now... not so sure about Stone, though).