Should the NCAA ban long-term contracts in college coaching?

[thebigabd]

Perhaps the NCAA shouldnt allow coaches to sign 4,5,6,7 year (and so on) deals that both sides have little intention of honoring. It creates a situation where decisions are made based on contract length, buyout clauses, etc.

This way when a coach leaves for another job, there is no financial mess. When a coach gets fired, there is no buyout mess, etc.

Of course, I don't know that the NCAA has the authority to do something like this.. But it seems ridiculous to say that they can't hire or fire whoever they want like a regular job because he just signed a multi-year contract and they will owe him a ton of money, even if he isnt doing what he/she was hired to do (mainly, win).

Scholarships for the athletes are year-to-year, and can be taken away if they dont perform. Why isnt the same true for these multi-millionaire basketball coaches?

 

[Soonercuda]

If the NCAA did that it would be collusion between employers and would violate anti-trust laws.

The NCAA did that with the restricted earnings coach back a decade or so...the NCAA got sued and lost a multi-million dollar class action lawsuit to the affected coaches.

 

[campbest]

Perhaps the NCAA shouldnt allow coaches to sign 4,5,6,7 year (and so on) deals that both sides have little intention of honoring. It creates a situation where decisions are made based on contract length, buyout clauses, etc.

This way when a coach leaves for another job, there is no financial mess. When a coach gets fired, there is no buyout mess, etc.

Of course, I don't know that the NCAA has the authority to do something like this.. But it seems ridiculous to say that they can't hire or fire whoever they want like a regular job because he just signed a multi-year contract and they will owe him a ton of money, even if he isnt doing what he/she was hired to do (mainly, win).

Scholarships for the athletes are year-to-year, and can be taken away if they dont perform. Why isnt the same true for these multi-millionaire basketball coaches?

Absolutely not. There are means to minimze the penalties of coaches leaving (for school and coach) within the contract.

 

[Seymore Cox]

If the NCAA did that it would be collusion between employers and would violate anti-trust laws.

The NCAA did that with the restricted earnings coach back a decade or so...the NCAA got sued and lost a multi-million dollar class action lawsuit to the affected coaches.

You beat me to it. Almost like a form of communism to do so.

 

[Big Old Booger]

Perhaps the NCAA shouldnt allow coaches to sign 4,5,6,7 year (and so on) deals that both sides have little intention of honoring. It creates a situation where decisions are made based on contract length, buyout clauses, etc.

This way when a coach leaves for another job, there is no financial mess. When a coach gets fired, there is no buyout mess, etc.

Of course, I don't know that the NCAA has the authority to do something like this.. But it seems ridiculous to say that they can't hire or fire whoever they want like a regular job because he just signed a multi-year contract and they will owe him a ton of money, even if he isnt doing what he/she was hired to do (mainly, win).

Scholarships for the athletes are year-to-year, and can be taken away if they dont perform. Why isnt the same true for these multi-millionaire basketball coaches?

No, but an AD should be in serious trouble if he gives a long-term big money extension on an unproven coach.

 

[Seymore Cox]

No, but an AD should be in serious trouble if he gives a long-term big money extension on an unproven coach.

How do you define unproven, because the big12 has really only tw maybe three (Anderson) proven coaches, but about 8 long term contracts.

 

[Big Old Booger]

How do you define unproven, because the big12 has really only tw maybe three (Anderson) proven coaches, but about 8 long term contracts.

I'm not an AD.

I'd say after 5 years on the job, if you've advanced your team to postseason play every year then that warrants a possible long-term extension. I'd also say winning an NC would qualify as well.

As I look at the Big 12, the coaches in my mind who have earned long-term extensions are:

Self
Barnes
Anderson
Martin
Drew

Maybe Turgeon. Definitely if he takes aTm to the NCAA tourney again this year.

 

[MNsooner]

You beat me to it. Almost like a form of communism to do so.

It wouldn't be communism at all. It would be unregulated capitalism.

 

[OUhoops11]

No, but an AD should be in serious trouble if he gives a long-term big money extension on an unproven coach.

Why? In Capel's case, that's what all OU fans wanted 3 years ago. Everyone said he's the best young up and coming coach in the country. We were all terrified he was leaving for South Carolina, Virginia, Arizona, etc. To keep him, Castiglione had to pony up. That was the best choice at the time. It's not like he can predict the future.

 

[campbest]

I'm not an AD.

I'd say after 5 years on the job, if you've advanced your team to postseason play every year then that warrants a possible long-term extension. I'd also say winning an NC would qualify as well.

As I look at the Big 12, the coaches in my mind who have earned long-term extensions are:

Self
Barnes
Anderson
Martin
Drew

Maybe Turgeon. Definitely if he takes aTm to the NCAA tourney again this year.

Contract extensions are really good years are the norm...just how the industry works. Furthermore, Capel was vastly underpaid given a second round berth and an Elite Eight run. Joe C has to offer something.

I would put Turgeon has definitely done enough to warrant an extension, guy gets little to no respect as a coach.

 

[Big Old Booger]

Why? In Capel's case, that's what all OU fans wanted 3 years ago. Everyone said he's the best young up and coming coach in the country. We were all terrified he was leaving for South Carolina, Virginia, Arizona, etc. To keep him, Castiglione had to pony up. That was the best choice at the time. It's not like he can predict the future.

Don't say all. I didn't want it (contract extension). I was hoping he'd go to UVa or Zona.

I had a feeling after his first season he wasn't the man for the job. Then, after his 2nd season with the best player at OU since Wayman and we lost 7 conference games and had plenty of double-digit blowout losses, I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt he wasn't the guy.

Even in BG's 2nd year we played very little defense and our offense was throw it to the best player on the court and make the other team stop him.

 

[OUhoops11]

Don't say all. I didn't want it (contract extension). I was hoping he'd go to UVa or Zona.

I had a feeling after his first season he wasn't the man for the job. Then, after his 2nd season with the best player at OU since Wayman and we lost 7 conference games and had plenty of double-digit blowout losses, I knew beyond a shadow of a doubt he wasn't the guy.

Even in BG's 2nd year we played very little defense and our offense was throw it to the best player on the court and make the other team stop him.

:facepalm

 

[Big Old Booger]

:facepalm

Ask bigtime or Ada and they will tell you. I complained about Capel after year 1 and year 2. I vehemently complained and was vehemently ripped for my unpopular opinion.

 

[OUhoops11]

Ask bigtime or Ada and they will tell you. I complained about Capel after year 1 and year 2. I vehemently complained and was vehemently ripped for my unpopular opinion.

With good reason.

 

[thebigabd]

It wouldn't be communism at all. It would be unregulated capitalism.

Right.. how in the world could that possibly be communism? Unregulated capitalism is far more accurate. You arent keeping someone from being wealthy, you are just making it to where the coach and the school can make a decision without a huge contractual mess.

Why? In Capel's case, that's what all OU fans wanted 3 years ago. Everyone said he's the best young up and coming coach in the country. We were all terrified he was leaving for South Carolina, Virginia, Arizona, etc. To keep him, Castiglione had to pony up. That was the best choice at the time. It's not like he can predict the future.

Again, not restricting the AMOUNT of their contract but the LENGTH of it would prevent this from ever happening to any school in the country, ever.

It would make them MORE like most jobs and less like entitled millionaires. Also, the contract system is beyond dumb because athletes and coaches ALWAYS (100% of the time) want MORE money, MORE bonuses, etc years before their contract is up, but if they play poorly there is no way to pay them less before the contract is up. And, that coach or athlete is also free to leave whenever they want, and some other school or organization has to pay their bill to get him. Either way, the coach gets theirs.

Again, the contract only guarantees the coach to come out on top. The coach doesnt have to honor the contract, and neither does the school technically. So why have it? Why not just limit it to 12 month contracts, pay them whatever millions you want, but nothing beyond 1 year. Who would that hurt?

Think of a software developer.. he gets a job that is a 12 month contract. If he does his job correctly and they still need someone with his skills, they will renew his contract again. Would it be ok for that guy to software developer to sign an 8 year contract, then suck at his job, and get some kind of multi-million dollar buyout? The answer here is obvious, no.

 

[OUhoops11]

Right.. how in the world could that possibly be communism? Unregulated capitalism is far more accurate.



Again, not restricting the AMOUNT of their contract but the LENGTH of it would prevent this from ever happening to any school in the country, ever.

It would make them MORE like most jobs and less like entitled millionaires. Also, the contract system is beyond dumb because athletes and coaches ALWAYS (100% of the time) want MORE money, MORE bonuses, etc years before their contract is up, but if they play poorly there is no way to pay them less before the contract is up. And, that coach or athlete is also free to leave whenever they want, and some other school or organization has to pay their bill to get him. Either way, the coach gets theirs.

Again, the contract only guarantees the coach to come out on top. The coach doesnt have to honor the contract, and neither does the school technically. So why have it? Why not just limit it to 12 month contracts, pay them whatever millions you want, but nothing beyond 1 year. Who would that hurt?

Think of a software developer.. he gets a job that is a 12 month contract. If he does his job correctly and they still need someone with his skills, they will renew his contract again. Would it be ok for that guy to software developer to sign an 8 year country, then sucked at his job, and got some kind of multi-million dollar buyout? The answer here is obvious, no.

1) It would be really hard to recruit. How would you tell kids and their parents if you're going to be at that school next year or not?


2) Coaches could just skip around to whatever school they wanted to for a year then leave with no penalty. For instance, Blake's second year, Calipari could've come then left after the season because he knew we wouldn't be as good the next year.


3) It would be harder for schools to plan their athletic budget for the future.

 

[Big Old Booger]

With good reason.

Well...that's where you are wrong. He won't be here 2 years from now and I will have been proven right. After this year, I will have been proven right, but it sounds like he will get 1 more year regardless of how bad this season is.

 

[OUhoops11]

Well...that's where you are wrong. He won't be here 2 years from now and I will have been proven right. After this year, I will have been proven right, but it sounds like he will get 1 more year regardless of how bad this season is.

No wonder you want Capel fired. Nothing like being right on a message board!




And yes, you were criticized with good reason for Capel's first three years. Who did we lose to that we should have beaten? That list is very, very short.

 

[thebigabd]

1) It would be really hard to recruit. How would you tell kids and their parents if you're going to be at that school next year or not?

If every coach in the NCAA umbrella was under the system, it would be the same for everyone. That would no longer be a recruiting tool. Plus, coaches and schools NEVER honor the contracts anyway.

2) Coaches could just skip around to whatever school they wanted to for a year then leave with no penalty. For instance, Blake's second year, Calipari could've come then left after the season because he knew we wouldn't be as good the next year.

Its always no penalty for the coaches to jump around whenever they want. Its the schools and players that get penalized under the contract system.

3) It would be harder for schools to plan their athletic budget for the future.

How is year to year more difficult than planning for the next 10 years when you have no idea if that coach will leave you or if you will fire that coach sometime in that contract span?

 

[Big Old Booger]

No wonder you want Capel fired. Nothing like being right on a message board!




And yes, you were criticized with good reason for Capel's first three years. Who did we lose to that we should have beaten? That list is very, very short.

2007:
Tech in Lubbock
ISU in Ames
Mizzou in Columbia
Texas in Norman
KSU in Norman
aTm in Norman

**we did beat Chaminade that year, though.

2008:
Stephen F Austin
KSU in Norman
Texas in Norman
CU in Boulder
Nebraska in Lincoln

**we lost 9 games by double-digits. No excuse for that. None.

2009:
Arkansas in Fayetteville
OSU in OKC
KU in Norman

Most of these games are games we would win with the previous 2 coaches.