Some way-too-early practice observations

Dave Sieger was a starter on a great basketball team. Are you comparing Pledger to Sieger? He was a role player prior to that season, I agree. He was an excellent defender too. I'll offer this. Larry Bird once described himself as a role player on those great Celtic teams. He said his role was to score 25-30 points a night. If you will allow, Pledger plays a similar role on this team. None of the FR can contribute his shooting, his point avg, or offensive efficiency. We need him. Doesn't make him a great player just a very important player to this squad.

We need him but Pledger is much closer to Dave Siegar than he is to Larry Bird, as a player. I dont think there is a soul that can argue that fact. I dont think Pledger is anywhere close to the type of player that can carry a team on his back......Larry Bird WAS. Important to this team? Yes, but not a feature player on a really good basketball team.
 
None of the FR can contribute his shooting, his point avg, or offensive efficiency. We need him. Doesn't make him a great player just a very important player to this squad.

Great point there. :clap

I posted this last week, but Pledger was the 5th most efficient offensive player in the Big 12 last year. He is REALLY good at scoring the ball, and not needing a ton of shots to do it. He isn't a volume shooter. He isn't really even a scorer. He is a guy that shoots the jumper really well, and really efficiently. OU's troubles last year weren't just defensively. We were actually worse offensively. To take away one of the few offensive weapons we had, I just think that is silly.

There will be plenty of situations (end of half, end of game, etc) where we can get Pledger off the court if we need a defensive stop. Situational substituting. But if we have the ball, he needs to be out there. We need the team, the other 4 guys, to help Pledger on defense. That is what good teams do. Just like Pledger will bail them out on the offensive end from time to time.
 
We need him but Pledger is much closer to Dave Siegar than he is to Larry Bird, as a player. I dont think there is a soul that can argue that fact. I dont think Pledger is anywhere close to the type of player that can carry a team on his back......Larry Bird WAS. Important to this team? Yes, but not a feature player on a really good basketball team.

No, no, no I'm not comparing him to either guy. I thought you might be comparing him to Sieger, though. I'm just saying his role would be similar to the role Bird considered his to be, which was to produce not necessarily carry the team like you said. Larry was capable of that and Pledger isn't. I was just comparing roles not players.
 
Ok...i will admit one oversight...he admittedly didnt say he was saving himself for the offensive end.....but even you should be able to admit that Pledger is an offense first guy.....he isnt a defender (probably average to below) so he PROBABLY wasnt saving himself so he could try harder on the defensive end. Im smart enough to know he meant to just conserve his energy but my point isnt a 'bias' as you seem to think. Im not AGAINST Pledger or think he shouldnt be on the floor at all. I simply know enough about the game to know that his ppg average last year doesnt make him so great that a frosh couldnt beat him out or take minutes from him. It isnt going to hurt my feelings if Pledger starts, or even if he plays 30 minutes a game.....my post was simply an observation and you seem to think it is some kind of personal vendetta against Pledger or something. I just pointed out that we have been a mediocre team for a while now and being the leading scorer on a mediocre team doesnt make you a great player. Pledger is a fantastic shooter but if you put him on a GOOD team (Kansas, UK, UNC, UCONN, etc) he would simply be a role player...are you old enough to remember Dave Sieger?

Dont take someone else's observation so personal.

I agree with you a bit, but I just get sick of the "well, we haven't been winning games, so all of our starters must stink", argument. Gary uses that one a lot. Our biggest problems last year were two things. First, we had zero bench. Killed us. That can be seen in the number of games we lost late. We were beating KU at halftime one game, and only down three in the other. They beat us soundly in the second halves. Why? Personally, I think a lot of it was because they wore us down. KU is/was a deep team. OU's 6-7 guys simply didn't have the energy to keep us with KU's 8-9 guys. Secondly, we had really, really bad shooting from both Grooms and Cam, both of whom started and played a lot of minutes. If either of those guys just shoot the ball at an average clip, we probably win 2-3 more games. With a solid bench, another 2-3. That gives us 4-6 more wins, and boom, we're an NCAA Tournament bubble team at that point. Just my take.

As for Pledger, how does he compare to other OU players on good teams? I don't think anybody, myself included, is trying to argue that Pledger is our Hollis, or Ace, or Eduardo, or Minor, or Cory Brewer. He isn't. But I think he compares favorably, offensively especially, to a lot of the next best players. He can score it as well as Ere. Detrick. Neal. Newton. Heskett. Johnson. The list goes on. Hard to compare him to the good bigs we had (Bookout, Gray, etc), but I think he compares favorably to most other guards. If that is a role player, fine. Doesn't matter what label you give him, it's a VERY important role to have on a good team.
 
Maybe the thing to say is we need the kind of shooting Pledger provides to spread the floor, whether it is Pledge or one of the FR, or possibly Neal.
 
I think Heskett is a decent comparison.....I just think he would be a better complimentary guy than a first option. Unfortunately we would never know because he has never been on that type of team where we could see how good of a player he would be in that type of role. I think complimentary player is a better description than role player.


If I am not mistaken, was he on the same HS team as Andre Dawkins?
 
As a player, I compare him to Michael Neal or Kelley Newton. I think he is a better shooter than both. Complimentary is good. The lane has to stay open for Osby, M'Baye and Fitz to work inside.
 
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