2011 OU recruit Thomas Gispon commits to KSU

[Sam]

Another post player for Frank Martin in this class (think they just got a 6'10 kid from Florida earlier this week).
Thomas is a little undersized a 6'6 but is a load underneath. I was hoping we would become more involved with him because he plays with a nasty streak and a big motor but oh well. Good pick up for the Wildcats imo.

 

[Seymore Cox]

I liked that kid too. He'll be a good Big12 or MWC player.

 

[SoonerDAZE]

I hate to say this, but I disagree. Gip is benefiting from the overall lack of elite-level posts in this class. In a typical class, a player with his skill set and body type would be a mid-major contributor at best.

Consequently, all posts are being over-valued in the 2011 class. His contributions at K-State will largely depend on his ability to change his work ethic both in games and out of games, and on developing fundamental footwork and angle improvements.

Right now he relies 100% on his physical assets to play the game. At the major D1 level, he'll be facing many players who are his equal physically. In games where he's pitted against like-bodied or better-bodied players, he currently disappears because he doesn't have great footwork or feel for the game to find an advantage.

He'll likely find it tough to even get minutes at K-State. Unless something changes with him, look for him to ultimately transfer out, after a year or two, to somewhere mid-major or below, looking for playing time. New coach at Cedar Hill (where he plays HS) is really good. Maybe this will light a fire with Gip and he can change all this.

 

[Seymore Cox]

I hate to say this, but I disagree. Gip is benefiting from the overall lack of elite-level posts in this class. In a typical class, a player with his skill set and body type would be a mid-major contributor at best.

Consequently, all posts are being over-valued in the 2011 class. His contributions at K-State will largely depend on his ability to change his work ethic both in games and out of games, and on developing fundamental footwork and angle improvements.

Right now he relies 100% on his physical assets to play the game. At the major D1 level, he'll be facing many players who are his equal physically. In games where he's pitted against like-bodied or better-bodied players, he currently disappears because he doesn't have great footwork or feel for the game to find an advantage.



He'll likely find it tough to even get minutes at K-State. Unless something changes with him, look for him to ultimately transfer out, after a year or two, to somewhere mid-major or below, looking for playing time. New coach at Cedar Hill (where he plays HS) is really good. Maybe this will light a fire with Gip and he can change all this.

I think sometimes we evaluate people and we use an NBA evaluating scale to critique their games. Well the thing is there's a difference between the NBA and college game. Also, there is not as big a difference between the high D1 and mid major level. You can't tell me that this kid can't be as good as a Kevin Bookout, Gary Johnson, etc. And if he's not on that level, he definetely is on the Andrew Fitzgerald, CJ Washington, and Marques Hayden level.

 

[Sam]

I agree with the assesment that the lack of quality bigs has him higher than perhaps he should be like DM said Kevin Bookout had a very succesful 4 year career at OU and he was no bigger than 6'6. Thomas has a very similar bottom type to Bookout so I could see him having a similar role.

Also a lot of the national guys seem to disagree with your assements of his desire based on this past summer

Bossi of rivals on him at the GASO

Thomas Gipson, PF, Texas Bluechips- Gipson played the way he always does, with physicality and effort. A brute around the rim, he uses his long arms and desire to outwork guys on the glass and make them uncomfortable. An in the paint guy all the way, his ability to keep competing has helped him out.

Daniels of scout, during the Pangos AA camp

The Cedar Hill (Tex.) High standout works as hard as anyone in the paint. Gipson focuses on locking up the glass and he does a pretty good job of it. Using his 6-foot-7, 240-pound wide, but strong frame, Gipson gets physical inside and grabs any board in his area.

Daniels on him at the EYBL in LA

An undersized power forward, Gipson does exactly what undersized posts have to do – work hard. On both ends he gets after it and is a willing rebounder. Using his 6-foot-6, 250-pound frame he can clear space and he finishes strong around the paint.

 

[SoonerDAZE]

When you only see a player play during the summer, you miss a TON of who a player really is. That's why there are so many "misses" when recruiting these young men, and quite frankly it's an indictment on the process itself, as dictated by the idiot bureaucrats littering the NCAA law makers and all their restrictions.

I can't imagine rolling the dice on these kids and having my livelihood depend on the success of that gamble, without seeing them compete against other high-level athletes for more than a few weeks at the end of July. What a joke.

That said, these coaches are increasingly reliant on the very "national guys" you're referring to, who only see and assess these guys on the summer circuit for the most part. Contrast that with someone who has seen the player play a local schedule, for many years in some cases, where playoff games and district games can bring out more of a true indication of a player's strengths and weaknesses. The problem is most often, a gifted player can dominate the local schedule based solely on physical blessings.

Which brings us to Gip. He excels in his school games mainly because he's physically stronger and longer than most. He's excelled this summer in certain games mainly because his motor has been high and because there aren't a lot of guys on the summer circuit who want to do the hard work that rebounding and defending take.

If you guys think the Big 12 will be a similar environment to that, then you're right and I'm wrong. He's definitely proved he can do work under those circumstances.

My stance is that is NOT the case. Does he have the potential to play at that level? Sure, IF he decides to work on the things I outlined earlier. In fact, I'd bet if you asked coach Martin or Capel why they stood on opposite sides in recruiting him, I'd bet you they'd both point to the same things I've outlined. One guy is betting he'll make those changes, the other...not so much.

 

[sys]

i wish you had more encouraging things to say about gipson, daze, as i respect your thoughts and know you've seen these guys far more than most.


i don't understand kstate's recruiting this year. i don't understand it, and i don't like it.

 

[Cheno]

i wish you had more encouraging things to say about gipson, daze, as i respect your thoughts and know you've seen these guys far more than most.
i don't understand kstate's recruiting this year. i don't understand it, and i don't like it.

I don't understand it either. And I'm not hating cuz I'm a KU fan. I actually really like Frank Martin now. I do question if he's a good recruiter though. He really hasn't brought in many players. The top rated players they've received all were thru Dalone Hill and mainly his old AAU program or Huggins guys like Bill Walker. Wally Judge was DC Assault.
I just haven't been that impressed with the talent outside of what Hill has brought in and their last two-three classes have been disappointing.

 

[stoops4pres]

I don't understand it either. And I'm not hating cuz I'm a KU fan. I actually really like Frank Martin now. I do question if he's a good recruiter though. He really hasn't brought in many players. The top rated players they've received all were thru Dalone Hill and mainly his old AAU program or Huggins guys like Bill Walker. Wally Judge was DC Assault.
I just haven't been that impressed with the talent outside of what Hill has brought in and their last two-three classes have been disappointing.

Agreed. I'm holding my judgement on how Martin recruits/evaluates talent when all of the aformentioned connections you mentioned have come to pass.

 

[Sam]

When you only see a player play during the summer, you miss a TON of who a player really is. That's why there are so many "misses" when recruiting these young men, and quite frankly it's an indictment on the process itself, as dictated by the idiot bureaucrats littering the NCAA law makers and all their restrictions.

I can't imagine rolling the dice on these kids and having my livelihood depend on the success of that gamble, without seeing them compete against other high-level athletes for more than a few weeks at the end of July. What a joke.

That said, these coaches are increasingly reliant on the very "national guys" you're referring to, who only see and assess these guys on the summer circuit for the most part. Contrast that with someone who has seen the player play a local schedule, for many years in some cases, where playoff games and district games can bring out more of a true indication of a player's strengths and weaknesses. The problem is most often, a gifted player can dominate the local schedule based solely on physical blessings.

Which brings us to Gip. He excels in his school games mainly because he's physically stronger and longer than most. He's excelled this summer in certain games mainly because his motor has been high and because there aren't a lot of guys on the summer circuit who want to do the hard work that rebounding and defending take.

If you guys think the Big 12 will be a similar environment to that, then you're right and I'm wrong. He's definitely proved he can do work under those circumstances.

My stance is that is NOT the case. Does he have the potential to play at that level? Sure, IF he decides to work on the things I outlined earlier. In fact, I'd bet if you asked coach Martin or Capel why they stood on opposite sides in recruiting him, I'd bet you they'd both point to the same things I've outlined. One guy is betting he'll make those changes, the other...not so much.

I respect your opinion on this daze, you've shown in the past your are well versed in the DFW prep hoops scene so I'll trust you on your observations over the local schedule. So on your last question I ask you isn't that a sign to the coach's style and personality in this point in their careers? Frank has showed a bigger aptitude at getting the most of his physical players/question mark players like Thomas than Capel has. Look at what he did with UCONN transfer Kelly this past year, in compared to how this year played out for Capel. I just get the feeling Thomas is going to be a really good enforcer over 4 years for the Wildcats with the way Frank is going to coach him.

 

[SoonerDAZE]

I respect your opinion on this daze, you've shown in the past your are well versed in the DFW prep hoops scene so I'll trust you on your observations over the local schedule. So on your last question I ask you isn't that a sign to the coach's style and personality in this point in their careers? Frank has showed a bigger aptitude at getting the most of his physical players/question mark players like Thomas than Capel has. Look at what he did with UCONN transfer Kelly this past year, in compared to how this year played out for Capel. I just get the feeling Thomas is going to be a really good enforcer over 4 years for the Wildcats with the way Frank is going to coach him.

In my opinion, all of what you are predicting for him is based on his ability to fundamentally change his game. My statement about Gip is he's NOT shown the work ethic, to this point, to make those changes to the degree needed to make this kind of a jump, AND that his recruiting is being buoyed by the fact there is a marked drop in the number of "qualified" bigs in this class.

Again, there is a chance he makes a change when the right coach gets a hold of him; however, that doesn't change the fact he is not prepared for the game at the Big 12 level today. His skill set and his footwork is not nearly what Bookout or Fitz's were as entering freshmen. I'm using those two as examples because those are two of the names being brought up.

As it stands today, he overpowers every matchup he has success with, and I simply don't think you can "overpower" matchups on a consistent basis in the Big 12 without some knowledge of positioning and angles and how to take advantage of a defender's mistakes - when real ball is played. The guys listed above certainly had those skills in their hip pockets at the same point in their careers.

There's no way to tell what goes on in the collective mind of a coaching staff when offering a player, whether it's personality or style preference or whatever; but you can certainly glean information from trending, like that from big Gip's recruitment.

Less than 1/3 of the Big 12 offered him according to Rivals. Only one Big 10, one Big East, one Pac 10, and zero SEC schools did. That means the largest percentage of these big conferences felt he will not able to contribute to a significant-enough degree in their systems to warrant a serious offer.

There seems to be a prevailing theme with his recruitment, and that seems to back coach Capel's stance - not Martin's.

Believe me, I wish Gip nothing but the best. I'm just calling it like I see it based on my personal experiences. Perhaps he'll roll out of bed one day soon and decide to take to heart the many calls he's had over the years for him to seriously work on his game. Time will tell.

 

[Cheno]

Frank has showed a bigger aptitude at getting the most of his physical players/question mark players like Thomas than Capel has. Look at what he did with UCONN transfer Kelly this past year, in compared to how this year played out for Capel. I just get the feeling Thomas is going to be a really good enforcer over 4 years for the Wildcats with the way Frank is going to coach him.

I don't know about that. Frank got nothing out of Jason Bennett who was a highly recruited 7 foot physical big man. Luis Colon never really developed. Wally Judge was a bust as a freshmen. Yes, Kelly has turned into a very good player but he was highly recruited and came to KSU as a junior with 3 years of college experience counting his redshirt year.
Again, I really like Frank Martin but he's had some big guys that haven't panned out or developed much as well.

To me it's 75% on the player usually. They gotta want to get better.
I don't think Jason Bennett would have been a success anywhere. Just like I don't think the attitude problems OU had last year had anything to do with Coach Capel's inability to get it out of players.