How far away are we?

[OUhoops11]

There were times Saturday when you started to feel like OU could really get back into the game and have a chance to win.


Then, seconds after thinking the above, we would immediately have a weak turnover, throw up a bad shot, or give up an easy drive to the rim. Suddenly, A&M would be ahead by 8-10 again. Eventually, the route was on.


Truth is, we're just not good enough offensively or defensively to string together 4 or 5 good possessions and make a run. The guys fight hard to keep the game in single digits, which does little good when they don't have the horses to make that final push to tie or take the lead.


For instance, in the A&M game, we would have a 3 or 4 straight good offensive possessions, but then give up easy buckets on the other end. Likewise, we would have 3 or 4 straight good defensive possessions, but couldn't turn those stops into points. It's been that way all season.


To what do we attribute this to? Youth certainly plays a big part. Lack of talent some as well. And I believe even our coaches would admit that they must do a much better job, though this turnaround can't happen overnight.


I think Capel makes a good point that in every loss, save 2 or 3, we've been in a great position at the under 4timeout. The sunshine pumper in me hopes that means we aren't as dire as some suggest we are. Certainly, we have a long way to go, but the great thing about college basketball is you're only a player or two away from being a pretty good team. This team has not and hopefully, will not, quit at any time. I think that's a testament to the coaching staff. They are playing hard and have improved, and will continue to improve.

 

[Krugerfan52]

Youth and lack of size are the two issues. Both will be solved next year and the year after.

I dont understand why everybody is frieking out. Did everybody expect us to be good this year???
This is the reason Joe C is not firing Capel. He knew this would be a down year just like the experts that picked us to finish 11th. Joe C is probably just more patient than most on this board.

Now, if we are not much improved the next 2 years then we should be dissapointed. But when you have 9 new guys, most of whom are fill ins to replace TMG and Tiny after last year's disaster, you can't expect to be very good.

 

[thebigabd]

Did everybody expect us to be good this year???

This kind of crap cracks me up... First, all the sunshine pumpers predict that the team can go .500 in conference, can win games at home, has an outside shot at the NIT, etc. Others get blasted for argueing these points, and then when reality punches everyone in the face and its the main topic of discussion these same sunshine people are like, "well duh, everyone knew we were going to be the worst basketball team in the country", lol.

Hysterical.

 

[seniorsooner]

Youth and lack of size are the two issues. Both will be solved next year and the year after.

I dont understand why everybody is frieking out. Did everybody expect us to be good this year???
This is the reason Joe C is not firing Capel. He knew this would be a down year just like the experts that picked us to finish 11th. Joe C is probably just more patient than most on this board.

Now, if we are not much improved the next 2 years then we should be dissapointed. But when you have 9 new guys, most of whom are fill ins to replace TMG and Tiny after last year's disaster, you can't expect to be very good.

I certainly didn't come into this year with high expectations. However, I didn't expect us to have one of the worst teams in the history of OU basketball. We have struggled to beat some teams that are literally some of the worst in all of division 1. At this point 3 conference wins seems like a dream. This is more than a "down year". That is why people are freaking out. They should be. Everyone should be.

 

[jerry]

I certainly didn't come into this year with high expectations. However, I didn't expect us to have one of the worst teams in the history of OU basketball. We have struggled to beat some teams that are literally some of the worst in all of division 1. At this point 3 conference wins seems like a dream. This is more than a "down year". That is why people are freaking out. They should be. Everyone should be.

Absolutely agree.

 

[Big Old Booger]

I certainly didn't come into this year with high expectations. However, I didn't expect us to have one of the worst teams in the history of OU basketball. We have struggled to beat some teams that are literally some of the worst in all of division 1. At this point 3 conference wins seems like a dream. This is more than a "down year". That is why people are freaking out. They should be. Everyone should be.

:clap

 

[okcsooner83]

Youth and lack of size are the two issues. Both will be solved next year and the year after.

I dont understand why everybody is frieking out. Did everybody expect us to be good this year???
This is the reason Joe C is not firing Capel. He knew this would be a down year just like the experts that picked us to finish 11th. Joe C is probably just more patient than most on this board.

Now, if we are not much improved the next 2 years then we should be dissapointed. But when you have 9 new guys, most of whom are fill ins to replace TMG and Tiny after last year's disaster, you can't expect to be very good.

Most are not happy because this is the third losing season out of five for Capel. Everyone expected OU to be in the bottom of the big 12 but just because it is expected doesn't mean it is acceptable at Oklahoma. After five years, Capel has led OU to the bottom of the league....congrats. Capel doesn't deserve another year, he has shown he can't lead a top 25 program such as OU. Even with Goff, Osby and another year of experience OU will not have the guards or talent to compete with Kansas, Baylor, Mizzou, KState, Texas. I am tired of being patient and the talk of wait till next season.

 

[OUhoops11]

I think Joe C. probably said at the beginning of this season that Capel would get another year unless 1)the NCAA report came back and was very bad, which isn't going to happen; 2) the team had off the court issues; or 3) the team obviously quit and wasn't improving.


I'm sure Capel and Castiglione have already discussed next season, or else I don't know how Capel would be recruiting and getting those guys Saturday to visit. I really hope he gets another year and proves everyone wrong.


This team has not quit, not even close. I don't think they will. They have improved, I don't think anyone can dispute that. They will continue to get better with experience and time.

 

[Edmond_Sooner]

I think we have a couple of pieces (role players)...

but for this team to be back it has to have a couple of superstars (and i dont think Clark is one of those)...

I think guys like Pledger, Fitz, Blair, Newell, CJ, Tyler etc are all guys that can be solid players for us as a supporting cast, but none of them will ever lead us to a winning season...

And i dont know why we keep talking about Osby as our savior just because Capel says he is our best player...really? that isnt saying much...i like his athleticism but i'm not falling for the "he is the piece we are missing" talk...If anything Capel has shown us that we cant necessarily trust his evaluation of talent...

I think he can turn it around, and fast...this is college basketball...but i think the chances of him getting that 1 or 2 recruits/juco guys needed to do that are less than 10% with the current state of the program...

 

[skyvue]

They have improved, I don't think anyone can dispute that. They will continue to get better with experience and time.

Have they? I'd say Cam has started to come along, though Saturday was a step back for him, but is the team overall better than it was? I don't really see it.

Who did we lose to that we would now beat, if we were to play them again? As was pointed out above, most of our wins have been nail-biters against underwhelming (to say the least) opponents, so the mere fact that we've won some games of late doesn't necessarily indicate that we're playing better than we were.

Where are the signs of improvement?

 

[AdaSooner]

Edmond is right, OUHoops11. The players we have coming back to go with Osby and Goff are not enough to put OU among the top five in conference, much less a top twenty five nationally.

I think our front court will be better next year. But that isn't saying much. Fitz, Clark, Davis and perhaps Pledger are the only players on this year's team who might get significant minutes at any other Big 12 school, except maybe Tech. The rest would be role players, if that. Three or four players on our roster would watch from the bench. Sure, I think they'll improve between now and next season. Just not enough to take us back to where we were two years ago.

I'll take that one step further. We have a long way to go to get back to where we were five years ago. Take a look at our 2007 roster and tell me how many members of this year's team you'd trade for the players we had in Capel's first season?

I hope you're right and I'm wrong. I really do. If that is the case, be sure to remind me so I can eat crow with a lot of other fans who aren't nearly as optimistic as you and capelfan52.

 

[Sid]

Edmond is right, OUHoops11. The players we have coming back to go with Osby and Goff are not enough to put OU among the top five in conference, much less a top twenty five nationally.

I think our front court will be better next year. But that isn't saying much. Fitz, Clark, Davis and perhaps Pledger are the only players on this year's team who might get significant minutes at any other Big 12 school, except maybe Tech. The rest would be role players, if that. Three or four players on our roster would watch from the bench. Sure, I think they'll improve between now and next season. Just not enough to take us back to where we were two years ago.

I'll take that one step further. We have a long way to go to get back to where we were five years ago. Take a look at our 2007 roster and tell me how many members of this year's team you'd trade for the players we had in Capel's first season?

I hope you're right and I'm wrong. I really do. If that is the case, be sure to remind me so I can eat crow with a lot of other fans who aren't nearly as optimistic as you and capelfan52.

Since you are loaded, would you please write a check to Joe and put an end to this nightmare once and for all?

 

[SoonerDan74012]

Think of a bottomless grand canyon.

 

[Edmond_Sooner]

I think Joe C. probably said at the beginning of this season that Capel would get another year unless 1)the NCAA report came back and was very bad, which isn't going to happen; 2) the team had off the court issues; or 3) the team obviously quit and wasn't improving.


I'm sure Capel and Castiglione have already discussed next season, or else I don't know how Capel would be recruiting and getting those guys Saturday to visit. I really hope he gets another year and proves everyone wrong.


This team has not quit, not even close. I don't think they will. They have improved, I don't think anyone can dispute that. They will continue to get better with experience and time.

I think we all can dispute that...i havent seen improvment...with individuals sure, but not with the team...We still havent won a game against a Major or Mid Major Division 1 basketball team and it doesnt look good...

Not only have we not won a game of that magnitude, but we lose by so much so often we look more like one of those Low Major cupcakes than a Big XII team that has gone to the Elite 8 in the last 3 yrs...

 

[coolm]

my concern is that we're digging a whole in our reputation that's going to make recruiting harder and harder no matter who is in the HC position.

I do think they're playing better ... but there's just not enough talent to compete in a major D1 conference schedule.

 

[AdaSooner]

Excellent point about recruiting, coolm.

OU is in on some really good players in 2012. But if we continue to struggle the way we have so far, we can only hope that a few of those recruits will want to be part of putting our program back on the map again. That's a big IF with kids who pretty much have their pick of schools.

 

[DenverSooner]

My concern is with the current state of the program how do we lose TJ Taylor? He was our second best recruit and he never stepped on the court. Maybe he shouldn't have stepped on the court but why do we keep signing top 100 guys that have no business at OU?

Everyone says the front court is the problem but I think the backcourt is the problem. We don't have a good backcourt. Pledger is limited. Cade is a three, Cam Clark is a three. Newell didn't even play yesterday (I hope it is due to an injury). Blair is a transfer from a mid-major (at best). He is a guy that can help as a backup but he is not equivalent to many (if not most) of the pgs/sgs in this conference.

 

[NickZepp]

Yep next year without Cade will be real tough for our guards. I just don't see a vast improvement in our guard play with this system. Jeff needs to throw his system out and try something else. I would like to see our guards try and get to the lane more. It seems like our guards only stand outside passing and hope 3's go in.

 

[Sooner23]

How far away are we? Cade and Cam Clark are the only players on this team capable of starting on an NCAA Tournament type team. And Cade won't be back next year.

And don't fire back with Fitzgerald or Pledger, they're only scoring because they're on a bad team and have ample opportunities. Neither can defend, Fitz can't rebound, Pledge can't create (nor can he shoot really), etc. They are 10-15 minute per game role players on a tournament type team.

And, with all due respect, this team has not improved. At all. I was set for this type of year, but not like this. This team looks just as poorly coached and with no direction now as they did Game 1.

 

[Sooner23]

Everyone says the front court is the problem but I think the backcourt is the problem. We don't have a good backcourt. Pledger is limited. Cade is a three, Cam Clark is a three. Newell didn't even play yesterday (I hope it is due to an injury). Blair is a transfer from a mid-major (at best). He is a guy that can help as a backup but he is not equivalent to many (if not most) of the pgs/sgs in this conference.

This x 10. I was surprised we were bringing in another juco type like Jurick for a visit when our guards are so below average. I would go with Fitz, Goff, Osby, Washington and Thompson and use that second available ship on the best combo scoring type guard available (hopefully to go with Guerrero). Now, if a third ship opens up, then I'm fine with adding another big as long as we are also signing two guard types late.