interesting spin in Juco vs. high school debate

[NickZepp]

If there's JUCOs that are good enough to play and contribute, then we should get them. We haven't had much success there in recent years. Juan Patillo is one I would love to have on this team, but since Everett/Gray we really haven't had any good JUCOs outside of him.

 

[SoonerfanTU]

If there's JUCOs that are good enough to play and contribute, then we should get them. We haven't had much success there in recent years. Juan Patillo is one I would love to have on this team, but since Everett/Gray we really haven't had any good JUCOs outside of him.

We switched coaches about that time. Maybe Capel just doesn't evaluate them as well, or have the connections to land them. That isn't a knock, just a possible truth.

 

[Seymore Cox]

The fact that when the Juco discussion comes up and we have to reference Gray and Everett should end the debate.

 

[SoonerfanTU]

The fact that when the Juco discussion comes up and we have to reference Gray and Everett should end the debate.

Yet Capel is still recruiting them, nearly every year, and he might have to sign as many as 2 this year.

Hmmm.....

 

[NickZepp]

We switched coaches about that time. Maybe Capel just doesn't evaluate them as well, or have the connections to land them. That isn't a knock, just a possible truth.

Even in the Capel era we've gotten a few JUCOs, Cannon, Patillo, Leary and maybe one or two others. None of them have done much except Patillo, and Leary was a decent back up.

 

[Seymore Cox]

means that we missed out on the guys we were after. He's only offer Olukemi this year so far. He offered Leary in May after the signing period, and he made mistakes with Cannon and Patillo......... Obiviously Olukemi is very talented. I expect for him to offer a talented player. Now it's seems to be in scramble mode.

 

[SoonerfanTU]

Even in the Capel era we've gotten a few JUCOs, Cannon, Patillo, Leary and maybe one or two others. None of them have done much except Patillo, and Leary was a decent back up.

Unless I can't name a sucessful D1 JUCO that played elsewhere, that doesn't prove anything. And there is nothing wrong with what Patillo and Leary did on the court. Neither were stars, but that is okay. JP would be starting if he had his head on straight.

Kelvin was good at finding JUCO's for whatever role he needed. Whether that was a star, or a role player, he rarely had busts. Is it really THAT hard to believe that Capel doesn't have the experience/connections to evaluate JUCO's as well as Kelvin did?

 

[Seymore Cox]

Unless I can't name a sucessful D1 JUCO that played elsewhere, that doesn't prove anything. And there is nothing wrong with what Patillo and Leary did on the court. Neither were stars, but that is okay. JP would be starting if he had his head on straight.

Kelvin was good at finding JUCO's for whatever role he needed. Whether that was a star, or a role player, he rarely had busts. Is it really THAT hard to believe that Capel doesn't have the experience/connections to evaluate JUCO's as well as Kelvin did?

That's the point. Name ten guys from the juco ranks that you feel would be another Terrell Everett or Taj Gray over the last two year. It's hard. Give it a try.

 

[SoonerfanTU]

That's the point. Name ten guys from the juco ranks that you feel would be another Terrell Everett or Taj Gray over the last two year. It's hard. Give it a try.

I can't do it, but I bet bigabd can. I don't have the time to follow college hoops like I did 5-10 years ago, and Juco Junction sucks balls at keeping me updated. I'd bet, for a fact, that big can name that many though.

 

[Seymore Cox]

I can't do it, but I bet bigabd can. I don't have the time to follow college hoops like I did 5-10 years ago, and Juco Junction sucks balls at keeping me updated. I'd bet, for a fact, that big can name that many though.

half the guys big names suck! Their either playing for a bad high major team or a mid to low major squad. He always starts with Thorton and Weems and then throws out some average players.

 

[SoonerinNC]

Tubbs was ahead of the curve in the utilization of JUCOs and Sampson did a good job of filling needs with them. Fortunately it was a way for Tubbs to quickly elevate OUs position in the college basketball world.

Tubbs had his choice of guys. Sampson less and now there doesn't seem to be as much talent in the JUCOs and what is there is being spread on a much wider scale.

And it seems that fewer guys fail to qualify academicly. How many of them with some illegal help like Rose and possibly Wall it is hard to tell but you just don't hear about top guys going JUCO because of not qualifying the way you used to.

 

[NickZepp]

You don't see a Mookie Blaylock type player in JUCO anymore. Hell you don't see a player like Mookie in the NBA anymore.

 

[brettromar]

In my opinion, the down fall of the juco ranks came when Prep schools became big.

A lot of these kids are deciding to go to a prep school for a year and get eligible for 4 years than go to a juco and get 2 years after graduating from their.

The level of Juco's has dropped a lot. I think there are still guys out there to fill a role, but I agree there are not that many there to be a starter at a big 12 school like OU.

 

[gracefor24]

In my opinion, the down fall of the juco ranks came when Prep schools became big.

A lot of these kids are deciding to go to a prep school for a year and get eligible for 4 years than go to a juco and get 2 years after graduating from their.

The level of Juco's has dropped a lot. I think there are still guys out there to fill a role, but I agree there are not that many there to be a starter at a big 12 school like OU.

This is huge. Great post. Not only JUCO's have suffered but with early entry a lot of talent has moved up. Guys that used to be mid-majors are playing at high majors, guys who used to be low majors playing at mid-majors, guys who used to be D-2/NAIA playing at low majors, and so on.

I follow the SAC pretty closely and it's amazing how much worse the competition is since I followed it back in school in the early and mid 90's. OCU had 5-6 NCAA D-1 players on one of their title teams (I think '94).

 

[Seymore Cox]

This is huge. Great post. Not only JUCO's have suffered but with early entry a lot of talent has moved up. Guys that used to be mid-majors are playing at high majors, guys who used to be low majors playing at mid-majors, guys who used to be D-2/NAIA playing at low majors, and so on.

I follow the SAC pretty closely and it's amazing how much worse the competition is since I followed it back in school in the early and mid 90's. OCU had 5-6 NCAA D-1 players on one of their title teams (I think '94).

Ur right about the SAC. OCU had Eric Manuel and Brian Hopgood on the same team. that is the equivalent to 2 4* prospects. Also, Juco would be the first option for a guy that couldn't make the grade. Now, the eligibility aspect is taken care of in high school. If a guy looks like he won't make it, he reclassifies. Then the guy goes to prep school. If all else fails, then the guy goes to Juco. If the guy is really good, now they'll go overseas or to the NBDL. Now the Juco ranks are really filled with guys who don't get any offers whereas it use to be for good players who don't qualify. Abd has talked about Butter Hobson. Hobson went to three prep schools before going the Juco route.

 

[DenverSooner]

This is huge. Great post. Not only JUCO's have suffered but with early entry a lot of talent has moved up. Guys that used to be mid-majors are playing at high majors, guys who used to be low majors playing at mid-majors, guys who used to be D-2/NAIA playing at low majors, and so on.

I follow the SAC pretty closely and it's amazing how much worse the competition is since I followed it back in school in the early and mid 90's. OCU had 5-6 NCAA D-1 players on one of their title teams (I think '94).

I agree that prep schools have hurt jucos but I don't really buy the move up argument. How many early entries are there in the draft each year? I just don't think it is a high enough number to significantly impact all of college basketball. I think there are only 60 guys drafted each year. I could be wrong but I doubt more than 30 are early entry college players. I think the influx of foreign players more than offsets the 30ish guys that go to the NBA early (yes some go to the NBA but there are more in college too) and it is not like no one was going to the NBA early in the late 80s through 2004 (or whenever OU got Everett and Gray out of juco). Tisdale and Jordan both went early in 84 (I think that was the year - close enough).