Mug ball is back and alive

[cowboysooner]

For years, decades actually, the coaching community has talked until they are blue in the face about cleaning up the mug ball style of defense, all to no avail until the first of laat year. There was such an uproar by the legendary coaches that use the style, Mich state, Louisville, etc, that the NCAA backed the officials off of the new rules. By the end of last year, we were back to mug ball. We were great last year under the new rule and couldn't adjust back to mug ball when the official quit calling fouls on physical contact that violated the rules.

Our game tonight about as clearly as possible shows we are back to the old ways. Arm bars, reach arounds, constant body contact, slapping of hands, wrists and arms, and constant violation of the rule of verticality.

Basketball isn't golf, there is no honor in the game. If you can violate a rule that gives you an advantage, you do it. Doesn't make you a cheater. It makes you a winning coach.

Great game for us to learn from, we need to be stronger with the ball, need to maintain mental edge and not relax ever, and just do the things necessary to play this type of physical game. I think this game will make us better down the road.

Most importantly, we need to adjust to the officiating and give it back. If it is legal it is legal. In addition, you really have to talk to the kids about poise in a game like this If they find themselves thinking about not getting fouled and the injustice of it all, they will not be thinking about the game.

Tough game, but we will grow from it

And, Huggie bear (cinncinati style_) is definitely back. Tough kids, playing tough, and intimidating the officials. I have always like Huggie and its good to see him back He will get a better game from us in Norman.

 

[hoopsaustin]

I dont care if it was rough ball... half our to's were middle school soft....

 

[MercedeSooner]

it happens on the road, that's why its so important to hold home court.

 

[OKUman]

I agree with you on them backing off, this was making me so mad i turned it off and watched it later so I wouldn't shout and scream at the tv. On another not, what happen to this team, they just don't seem to be interested in playing the game it seems. Spangler just stands down around the basket and watches others rebound, we can't dribble the ball or guard any guard in the big 12, they just go right bye us and hit the layups. Our bigs are out on the circle guarding guys who can't shoot threes when they should be down low stopping those dibble drives. It is a puzzle. Are we just no good and slow?

 

[MsProudSooner]

For years, decades actually, the coaching community has talked until they are blue in the face about cleaning up the mug ball style of defense, all to no avail until the first of laat year. There was such an uproar by the legendary coaches that use the style, Mich state, Louisville, etc, that the NCAA backed the officials off of the new rules. By the end of last year, we were back to mug ball. We were great last year under the new rule and couldn't adjust back to mug ball when the official quit calling fouls on physical contact that violated the rules.

Our game tonight about as clearly as possible shows we are back to the old ways. Arm bars, reach arounds, constant body contact, slapping of hands, wrists and arms, and constant violation of the rule of verticality.

Basketball isn't golf, there is no honor in the game. If you can violate a rule that gives you an advantage, you do it. Doesn't make you a cheater. It makes you a winning coach.

Great game for us to learn from, we need to be stronger with the ball, need to maintain mental edge and not relax ever, and just do the things necessary to play this type of physical game. I think this game will make us better down the road.

Most importantly, we need to adjust to the officiating and give it back. If it is legal it is legal. In addition, you really have to talk to the kids about poise in a game like this If they find themselves thinking about not getting fouled and the injustice of it all, they will not be thinking about the game.

Tough game, but we will grow from it

And, Huggie bear (cinncinati style_) is definitely back. Tough kids, playing tough, and intimidating the officials. I have always like Huggie and its good to see him back He will get a better game from us in Norman.

I agree that mug ball is back and I'm sorry to see it. Officals are paid to call the game not spectate. And I also agree that we didn't adjust to it well. The NCAA must have a hard drive full of disputed calls sent to them by WVU opponents. As long as WVU gets favorable officiating at home, they will prosper at home.

I watched a few minutes of one of their games earlier this year and the commentator said they reminded him of OU under Billy. I remember lots of trapping and double teams. I remember Mookie was a magician at stealing the ball but I don't remember other teams getting mugged.

 

[sperry]

The comment about home vs. away is spot on. Officials will basically always officiate the game the way the home team's coach wants it to be officiated, and it's why home court advantage is more important in CBB than probably any other sport.

 

[tycat947]

I agree that mug ball is back and I'm sorry to see it. Officals are paid to call the game not spectate. And I also agree that we didn't adjust to it well. The NCAA must have a hard drive full of disputed calls sent to them by WVU opponents. As long as WVU gets favorable officiating at home, they will prosper at home.

I watched a few minutes of one of their games earlier this year and the commentator said they reminded him of OU under Billy. I remember lots of trapping and double teams. I remember Mookie was a magician at stealing the ball but I don't remember other teams getting mugged.

Yes, after all that trouble to try and return basketball to the game it was previously! Naismith probably rolling in his grave!

I'm sure other teams might have thought they were being mugged during Billy's days but compared to today, it would be like a church service.

Sad that TV dictates the rules! People just want to see people get beat up, whether it's football, basketball, hockey, reality TV, etc, etc. Violence sells!

 

[scrybe]

Did you notice that the WV players were just incredulous when the officials finally started calling a few fouls on them at the start of the second half? It was like, "Why are you suddenly blowing your whistles when you swallowed them for the entire first half." Well, it didn't take the officials long to revert back to their "anything goes" mentality.

I don't really blame Huggins and his players for doing whatever they can get by with. Like others have said, the officials are the ones responsible for keeping the games under control.

 

[SilliSooner]

I liked Hugs defense and felt like if it would work for them, why wouldn't work for us? In other words, when necessary, turn up the zone press.

It might have worked against KSU. At the minimum it would have forced them to up the pace. We're supposed to be one of the more athletic teams in that we don't have the heft or the stiffs. I could see Lattin being a disrupter in a zone press with length and speed to enforce the trap.

As far as breaking the zone press, pass the ball... meet the passes and set hard screens. Plus have the guy bringing it up court be big enough he can see the outside lanes.

 

[usedtobe1]

I liked Hugs defense and felt like if it would work for them, why wouldn't work for us? In other words, when necessary, turn up the zone press.

It takes a lot of stamina and depth to run that defense. Quite frankly, we don't have the depth to run it.

 

[cowboysooner]

when I started this thread, it wasn't to be critical of Huggie. Just to state a fact of how he has returned to his roots. Mug Ball can, and for some, does work. You have to be completely committed to it. It can and has worked in the NCAA tournament. Sometimes however, you run into officials that just won't allow it and you find your kids don't really know how to play defense without fouling. You are then in trouble.

I like the way Lon coaches defense. Just work at keeping a defender between every offensive player and the goal. Some Capel haters will cringe at this statement, but Lon's style is similar to Capels, just with more switching.

I think we are a really good defensive team. But for the turnovers, WV wouldn't have scored 70 points IMO.

Mug Ball is why I have always like to watch girls basketball at the college level. It is, or at least used to be, much closer to real or true basketball. JMO, but the Gary Blairs and MUlkeys of the world that are getting their girls to play mug ball, like the boys, will, in the long run, ruin the girls game, at least for me.

Until recently, the girls game was about anticipation, footwork, teamwork and passing. Hopefully, it will stay that way and not devolve into what the boys game is about. That way we can watch both and enjoy.

 

[MsProudSooner]

when I started this thread, it wasn't to be critical of Huggie. Just to state a fact of how he has returned to his roots. Mug Ball can, and for some, does work. You have to be completely committed to it. It can and has worked in the NCAA tournament. Sometimes however, you run into officials that just won't allow it and you find your kids don't really know how to play defense without fouling. You are then in trouble.

I like the way Lon coaches defense. Just work at keeping a defender between every offensive player and the goal. Some Capel haters will cringe at this statement, but Lon's style is similar to Capels, just with more switching.

I think we are a really good defensive team. But for the turnovers, WV wouldn't have scored 70 points IMO.

Mug Ball is why I have always like to watch girls basketball at the college level. It is, or at least used to be, much closer to real or true basketball. JMO, but the Gary Blairs and MUlkeys of the world that are getting their girls to play mug ball, like the boys, will, in the long run, ruin the girls game, at least for me.

Until recently, the girls game was about anticipation, footwork, teamwork and passing. Hopefully, it will stay that way and not devolve into what the boys game is about. That way we can watch both and enjoy.

I don't blame a coach for coaching mug ball. When Blair first went to A&M, he had little offensive talent so that was the only way he could win games. I found it interesting that he was much less aggressive defensively when he had better offensive players - and had much more success in the NCAA tournament.

My gripe has always been with officials who refuse to call the fouls.

 

[scrybe]

I don't really blame the coaches, either. But to me, what you guys are calling "mug ball" is not the way basketball was meant to be played, either in the women's game or the men's.

 

[DenverSooner]

Did the NCAA officially back off the rule emphasis from last season? I think they clearly have in calling games. It is sad because if they had just stuck to it, the game would be cleaned up a lot by now.

 

[SoonerinNC]

Part of the strategy employed by Blair and now by Huggins is to go nuts on every call against you and that along with a ton of fouls will infleunce the officials to back off and let the mayhem continue. Also the home coach gets a lot of leeway from the officials.

Also it seemed that we were called on a lot of touch fouls.

 

[SilliSooner]

It takes a lot of stamina and depth to run that defense. Quite frankly, we don't have the depth to run it.

I wasn't thinking of this year so much as I was the next.

You'll have three rim protectors in Manyang, McNeace and Lattin. Two aggressive off side rebounders in Spangs and Buford and some pretty long guards in Cousins, Hield, Odomes, Booker and James. I can see a zone press in situational use working especially against a slow down team.

We should have the depth (you'll notice I listed ten players above and never even got to Woodard or Walker) next year to zone press and then morph back into a Syracuse type zone if we wanted to with Lattin patrolling the top of the key.

You can call it mug ball if you want but the trapping zone press if you've got the athletes can be super effective.

 

[snydrosooner]

You can call it mug ball if you want but the trapping zone press if you've got the athletes can be super effective.

I wouldn't call a straight press with trapping mug ball. You can press without all the slapping as you are blocking the dribbler and passing lanes. I wouldn't characterize Syracuse ( most of the time) or Baylor's Zone mug ball.

A little reaching to knock the ball away will not cause most to call it Mug ball. Slapping at arms on purpose does. WV would slap our rebounders arms and not get close to the ball to try to make them loose the ball that is mug ball. And I wouldn't classify every time WV pressed mug ball either. It was the overall experience that would call it mug ball.

 

[tycat947]

Part of the strategy employed by Blair and now by Huggins is to go nuts on every call against you and that along with a ton of fouls will infleunce the officials to back off and let the mayhem continue. Also the home coach gets a lot of leeway from the officials.

Also it seemed that we were called on a lot of touch fouls.

Don't forget Sulkey Mulkey! But she just flat out scares the officials! They dare not cross her!!!