Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA wins?

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Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA wins?

http://newsok.com/article/5407001?slideout=1


SMH!

The guy who commented about the OKC-area media's OU grads bending over backwards to appease OSU people really nailed in the comments below. I never even considered how some of those 70's teams, which owned OSU too, were discounted because they didn't get to play in the NCAA. Two of the teams that Alvan Adams played for probably would make it in there now, along with Bliss' 1977 team that went 18-10 and tied for second in the Big 8.

I guess the 39-game edge that OU holds doesn't matter.....?????
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

NCAA Tournament record should be a criteria, not THE criteria. OSU should not be ranked higher than us just because they haven't had as many March choke-jobs. They also should not be ranked higher because of a HOF coach who led them to two titles back in WWII time frame. Conversely, I wouldn't rank us ahead of them strictly on a significant head-to-head advantage for us. If we do that, then Texas should be ranked higher than us in football. Hell will drop below the freezing point before I concede to that.

My reasoning for ranking OU slightly ahead (it really is slightly, since both would be in the 20s) is because we seem to finish higher than them in the conference standings almost every year. The fact we seem to compete in conference play at a higher level almost year-in and year-out are valid reasons to rank us higher. Finally, what clinches it for me is that Travis Ford is considered their third most successful head coach of all time.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

I don't think he thought this statement through:

A school that's 5-4 in the NCAA Tournament shouldn't be considered equal to a team that's 10-8 in the NCAAs. The 10-8 school has been to twice as many NCAAs.

Just because one team has played 9 games and the other 18 doesn't mean the team with 18 has been to twice as many NCAAs. It depends on the records of any ONE tournament. It does mean the team with 18 has been to more, but not necessarily twice as many.

The top 10 or so on his list is 'no brainer' area. Bottom line is OU has been a solid BB program for quite a while now!
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

When OU has more total wins that article win turn to winning percentage. When OU has the higher winning percentage that will no longer be the measuring stick and the championships from the 50s.
 
Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA wins?

Outside of number tournament wins and national titles, OU has a significant advantage in almost any other measure. Getting tired by the comparisons bc there is no comparison as far as which state program is the best, IMO.


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Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

Ugh. Tramel couldn't have spent more than ten minutes on that story; such sloppy logic.

He wrote, "wins in the last 30 years should mean more than wins in 1954." He then, of course, goes on to ignore his own statement and focus solely on all-time wins. For the record, here are the two schools' respective tourney records over the past 30 years:

OU: 28-22
oswho: 23-18
 
razmataz said:
I don't think he thought this statement through:

A school that's 5-4 in the NCAA Tournament shouldn't be considered equal to a team that's 10-8 in the NCAAs. The 10-8 school has been to twice as many NCAAs.

Just because one team has played 9 games and the other 18 doesn't mean the team with 18 has been to twice as many NCAAs. It depends on the records of any ONE tournament. It does mean the team with 18 has been to more, but not necessarily twice as many.

The top 10 or so on his list is 'no brainer' area. Bottom line is OU has been a solid BB program for quite a while now!
Click to expand...


Umm it does mean twice as many. Neither team has won it all so the loss column is how many times they've gone


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Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

The two schools are about as even as two schools you could compare in terms of hoops.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

SoonerBounce13 said:
Umm it does mean twice as many. Neither team has won it all so the loss column is how many times they've gone


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Click to expand...

Oops! Thanks for the correction. Not enough coffee before posting I guess.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

WTSooner said:
The two schools are about as even as two schools you could compare in terms of hoops.
Click to expand...

It seems to me that it is easy to compare two teams head-to-head when they have played each other so many times.

OU Leads 134-95 (All-Time .. Long Term History)
OU Leads 17-8 (Last 25 Games .. Most Recent 10-Year History)

***

Barry Tramel's list (excerpt below) is based on TOTAL WINS in the NCAA Tournament. Ties are then broken by total tournament appearances. With another Sweet-16 (or better) run next season, OU will likely pass by OSU using this measurement criteria. Then we can watch Tramel write another article in a year or two using some other measuring-stick which favors OSU.

18. Florida 42-17.
19. Arkansas 41-30.
20. Illinois 40-31.
21. Oklahoma State 38-26.
22. Maryland 38-23.
23. Utah 37-31.
24. Oklahoma 37-29.
25. North Carolina State 37-25.
26. Texas 35-35.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

More importantly OU has a 59% winning percentage against OSU with a 134-95 record. This current decade (2011-20) OU is 8-3. Last decade OU 21-10. The decade before that (90s)was 9-13. 1981-1990 was 16-5. 1971-1980 was 19-5.

Since 1970 OU is 65-37 yet the media and OSU people say OU has the series advantage due to domination in the early part of the 20th Century. That is simply not true. OU has a better winning percentage against OSU since 1970 than it does all time and it is a notable 5%.

Barry Trammel will say anything to make OSU look better than OU.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

DenverSooner said:
...

Barry Trammel will say anything to make OSU look better than OU.
Click to expand...

Some truth in that. Also, Tramel knows how to stir the pot. Look what he has done here.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

SoonerTraveler said:
It seems to me that it is easy to compare two teams head-to-head when they have played each other so many times.

OU Leads 134-95 (All-Time .. Long Term History)
OU Leads 17-8 (Last 25 Games .. Most Recent 10-Year History)

***

Barry Tramel's list (excerpt below) is based on TOTAL WINS in the NCAA Tournament. Ties are then broken by total tournament appearances. With another Sweet-16 (or better) run next season, OU will likely pass by OSU using this measurement criteria. Then we can watch Tramel write another article in a year or two using some other measuring-stick which favors OSU.

18. Florida 42-17.
19. Arkansas 41-30.
20. Illinois 40-31.
21. Oklahoma State 38-26.
22. Maryland 38-23.
23. Utah 37-31.
24. Oklahoma 37-29.
25. North Carolina State 37-25.
26. Texas 35-35.
Click to expand...

Head to head in basketball is probably the least important factor. I'd use it as a tie-breaker type deal, but Big 8/Big 12 results, and NCAA Tourney results, are MUCH more important.

Like I said, if you look at the two schools over a very long period of time, or if you break it down to something smaller like 25 year periods, either way, most of the time, the results are going to be relatively equal.

Both schools have been pretty consistent over a long period of time, but both have had their struggles doing much in terms of NCAA Tourney successes.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

One more thing, why does he say it is surprising that either school has done better than 50%. If he likes to do this every so often he shouldn't be surprised at all by the results. If his worthless sports page was properly educating the people of Oklahoma about the strength of the two programs, the readers shouldn't be surprised by the wins.
 
WTSooner said:
The two schools are about as even as two schools you could compare in terms of hoops.
Click to expand...


True to a degree but, whether you want to use the last 50 years or the last 10, it has not been close since the mid 60's. They had a good run with Eddie but now they've settled back to where they have almost always been.


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Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

WTSooner said:
The two schools are about as even as two schools you could compare in terms of hoops.
Click to expand...

They really are. It's not ridiculous to say either team's history is better but neither is it obvious which team's history is better.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

OU leads in every category except NCAA Wins and national titles from the 40s and there is a 1 win difference. They are not equal. That is an argument a worthless Aggie should make not an OU fan.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

WTSooner said:
...

Both schools have been pretty consistent over a long period of time, but both have had their struggles doing much in terms of NCAA Tourney successes.
Click to expand...

I am not really disagreeing with you. Once you get past the top-10 on Tramel's list, you can say that all teams have had their struggles doing much in terms of NCAA tournament success. Only an elite few can say their average record in the tournament is 2-1 over the years.

I just enjoy the fact that head-to-head, OU generally kicks their a$$. A 58% to 42% winning percentage over a "traditional basketball power" is sweet, so sweet.
 
Re: Ridiculous: OSU's tradition "better" (DOK) only because of total NCAA w

lol @ touting your national titles from a time when Adolf Hitler was still leading Germany.

Date of OSU National Championship: March 27th, 1945
Date of German Surrender in WW2: May 7th, 1945
 
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