Thunder -130 to win series

AdaSooner said:
Martin doesn't suck, he's just inconsistent. He's also young. If you want to apply the word suck to someone, I think Kendrick Perkins is a much better choice.

I can't believe he hasn't been mentioned as a total bust on this thread. He was too slow to keep up with the run and gun Rockets, so he didn't play much. Everyone seemed to think that the Grizzlies would be a better match up, but he has been awful in the first two games. Heck, he can't even hold on to loose balls and rebounds when he gets both hands on the ball. It's like he's playing with mittens on his hands.

Perkins would be a good role player on any team. But he is definitely not a starter. IMO, the Thunder will never win a NBA championship him in the starting lineup. I'll be shocked (and disappointed) if they don't trade him in the off season.
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I didn't say he sucked overall, but he sure did last night. OKC can't win when he shoots 2-11.

As for the Thunder's low post presence, they don't have one. Ibaka has no back to the basket game and can't defend a back to the basket player.

Collison is probably their best post defender.
 
Smash Williams said:
30 years old isn't "young" in the NBA.
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30 years old is young to me. :ez-laugh:

Seriously, I didn't realize Martin was that old. He definitely looks younger. Clearly, I was wrong in using the term young as an excuse for his performance.

I don't spend much time watching NBA games or studying team personnel anymore. That's especially true since my favorite team for more decades than I want to mention, the Lakers, have been about as close as one can get to defining the word "suck" lately.
 
AdaSooner said:
Martin doesn't suck, he's just inconsistent. He's also young. If you want to apply the word suck to someone, I think Kendrick Perkins is a much better choice.

I can't believe he hasn't been mentioned as a total bust on this thread. He was too slow to keep up with the run and gun Rockets, so he didn't play much. Everyone seemed to think that the Grizzlies would be a better match up, but he has been awful in the first two games. Heck, he can't even hold on to loose balls and rebounds when he gets both hands on the ball. It's like he's playing with mittens on his hands.

Perkins would be a good role player on any team. But he is definitely not a starter. IMO, the Thunder will never win a NBA championship him in the starting lineup. I'll be shocked (and disappointed) if they don't trade him in the off season.
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Sorry Ada, but he is in his 9th NBA season. That is not young. That said you are completely right that Perkins should be nowhere near a starter on a Championship caliber team in 2013.
 
colston15 said:
I didn't say he sucked overall, but he sure did last night. OKC can't win when he shoots 2-11.

As for the Thunder's low post presence, they don't have one. Ibaka has no back to the basket game and can't defend a back to the basket player.

Collison is probably their best post defender.
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I know you didn't say he sucked overall, which is why I added that he is inconsistent.

I agree 100% with your appraisal of the Thunder's low post presence. That's one of the reasons I said that OKC will never win a NBA title with Perkins at the starting five spot.

Ibaka can be really good at times. But "really good" is a term I would never use in describing Perkins. If someone asked me what he does well, I would scratch my head for about two seconds and reply: "complain about the officiating and get a mean look on his face." He has his moments from time to time. Just not nearly enough of them to contribute to the Thunder's success in a meaningful way.
 
AdaSooner said:
I know you didn't say he sucked overall, which is why I added that he is inconsistent.

I agree 100% with your appraisal of the Thunder's low post presence. That's one of the reasons I said that OKC will never win a NBA title with Perkins at the starting five spot.

Ibaka can be really good at times. But "really good" is a term I would never use in describing Perkins. If someone asked me what he does well, I would scratch my head for about two seconds and reply: "complain about the officiating and get a mean look on his face." He has his moments from time to time. Just not nearly enough of them to contribute to the Thunder's success in a meaningful way.
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That's not fair, he is also good at fumbling rebounds and having dunks blocked
 
Max Power said:
Sorry Ada, but he is in his 9th NBA season. That is not young. That said you are completely right that Perkins should be nowhere near a starter on a Championship caliber team in 2013.
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Yeah, I left myself wide open on that one, didn't I Max? :facepalm

As I said above, I don't follow the NBA nearly as much as I did a few years ago. All I knew about Martin is that he was new to the team, and he looked young. I should have checked his profile before making that observation. My bad.
 
AdaSooner said:
Yeah, I left myself wide open on that one, didn't I Max? :facepalm

As I said above, I don't follow the NBA nearly as much as I did a few years ago. All I knew about Martin is that he was new to the team, and he looked young. I should have checked his profile before making that observation. My bad.
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its all good, i didn't see your response to another poster before i sent that and it wouldn't let me delete it. I certainly wasn't trying to pile on you. But the bottom line is Martin has to find some consistency fast or the thunder will be back for game five down 3-1
 
AdaSooner said:
Martin doesn't suck, he's just inconsistent. He's also young. If you want to apply the word suck to someone, I think Kendrick Perkins is a much better choice.

I can't believe he hasn't been mentioned as a total bust on this thread. He was too slow to keep up with the run and gun Rockets, so he didn't play much. Everyone seemed to think that the Grizzlies would be a better match up, but he has been awful in the first two games. Heck, he can't even hold on to loose balls and rebounds when he gets both hands on the ball. It's like he's playing with mittens on his hands.

Perkins would be a good role player on any team. But he is definitely not a starter. IMO, the Thunder will never win a NBA championship him in the starting lineup. I'll be shocked (and disappointed) if they don't trade him in the off season.
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i think he was just saying that IF martin sucks in a game, chances are the thunder will lose that game.

As far as Perkins goes....he sucks offensively but is still very good defensively
 
AdaSooner said:
If someone asked me what he does well, I would scratch my head for about two seconds and reply: "complain about the officiating and get a mean look on his face."
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He does a lot for the offense in taking up space and setting screens but he shouldn't touch the ball at all really.

I personally think he is worth 6-8 mil and is a big piece to a championship team if the coach manages him right...like not playing him much when he doesn't match up well.

I like collision but not sure how you can say he is our best post defender when he fouled out in like 10 minutes or something like that
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
As far as Perkins goes....he sucks offensively but is still very good defensively
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His defense, especially in OKC, is vastly overrated.

He certainly hasn't slowed down Gasol much in this series. Couldn't defend anybody on Houston, thus didn't play many minutes.
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
disagree
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Kendrick never shuts down a post player. Solid offensive posts look like all stars when Kendrick defends them. The numbers support this. I believe Bill Simmons has given Kendrick Perkins the "Charlie Ward Award" for the player who plays too many minutes for seemingly no reason.
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
He does a lot for the offense in taking up space and setting screens but he shouldn't touch the ball at all really.

I personally think he is worth 6-8 mil and is a big piece to a championship team if the coach manages him right...like not playing him much when he doesn't match up well.

I like collision but not sure how you can say he is our best post defender when he fouled out in like 10 minutes or something like that
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You kinda made my point that Perkins should be a role player, not a starter. Most of the teams the Thunder plays are a match up problem for him. To me, the starting center for one of the best teams in the NBA has to be good enough to score, defend and rebound against every team on the schedule. Some better than others, of course. But he has to find a way to contribute somehow.

It's true that Perk had the reputation of being an elite defender when he came to OKC. Maybe the nine or ten years he has been in the league is beginning to take a toll on his body? That would not be unusual for a guy his size.
 
TheGimper said:
Kendrick never shuts down a post player. Solid offensive posts look like all stars when Kendrick defends them. The numbers support this. I believe Bill Simmons has given Kendrick Perkins the "Charlie Ward Award" for the player who plays too many minutes for seemingly no reason.
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REally? If numbers support this where are they? I would seriously like to look at them
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
He does a lot for the offense in taking up space and setting screens but he shouldn't touch the ball at all really.

I personally think he is worth 6-8 mil and is a big piece to a championship team if the coach manages him right...like not playing him much when he doesn't match up well.

I like collision but not sure how you can say he is our best post defender when he fouled out in like 10 minutes or something like that
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If he doesn't match up well with the Grizzlies, then who does he? They don't play small ball. They actually lean on two "old fashion" bruisers and he got owned by them.
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
REally? If numbers support this where are they? I would seriously like to look at them
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Numerous basketball stat sites. Look at traditional centers in the league and notice how there points, fg %, and rebounds are better or at least at their average when Kendrick guards him.
 
Sam said:
If he doesn't match up well with the Grizzlies, then who does he? They don't play small ball. They actually lean on two "old fashion" bruisers and he got owned by them.
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I don't think I said he didn't match up well with the grizzlies. If I did I didn't mean to.
 
TheGimper said:
Numerous basketball stat sites. Look at traditional centers in the league and notice how there points, fg %, and rebounds are better or at least at their average when Kendrick guards him.
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link? if it's obvious and plenty of data to support it....support it
 
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