Seymore Cox
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We've gone back and forth on this board whether OU should recruit Juco players or not. My stance has always been that for OU to build a program, it needs to recruit as many high level prep players as possible. Outside of getting the most high level prep players as possible, you need to fill a need. If their is a juco player good enough to fufill thta need, than get him. However the juco ranks haven't been filled with players good enough to fill that need on a high level.
So I searched out some of the top juco players from last year, and as more often than not, statistics a referenced on this board to propagate a philosophy that one player is better than the next, so I'd thought I would play along. I researched the top level juco players(juco first team AAs mostly) from last year and looked at the impact they are having on their teams this year.
By far the biggest impact is being had by Jarrid Famous. He's averaging nearly 12pts and 7rbs. Not bad. He has played against bad teams, but I still won't discredit his production. However in contrast to the top three post players Cousins, Gallon, and Favors, the numbers pale in comparison. These three players average more points and rebounds on teams where they are the second and third options. Cuz and Favors average 14pts and 8rbs respectfully on talented teams adn Gallon averages 12 and 10. Famous is however performing better statisically than John Henson and Wally Judge.
The second best Juco post forward is Chris Hines, a 6'8 PF who is playing for Alabama. Hines is averaging 2.5pts per game and 2.8 rebounds. Very poor numbers for a guy who has now 1 1/2 years to be productive. The top Oklahoma prospect, Wayne Runnels is averaging 5pts and 5rbs for a very bad Creighton team. The top juco forward in the big12, Marquis Gilstrap is averaging 13pts and 7rbs for a ISU team that really had a need for post help for Brackins.
Now Juco guards have been renowned for being instant offensive productivity players and in some cases that is still prevalent. Marvin Roberts is averaging 15pts at FIU and Rico Pickett, the consensus top juco pg is averaging 13pts at Manhattan. But both Manhattan and FIU are very bad teams. But more often, even that modest prodcution is not the case most times. Deandre Brown, the first team juco PG is averaging under 9pts a game and three assist. Casey Mitchell, a Bob Huggins recruit as WVU may have been the top consensus juco player last year. Mitchell started off well averaging 13pts in his first three games, but combined for 9 in the next 3. Mitchell is averaging 8.8pts per game and shooting a very bad 25% from the field. Dwight Buycks another juco aa for Marquette has been less than stellar statisically. Ridge McKeither averages 11.6pts for a Chattanooga team that is not very good. It's decent production, but for a mid major team.
So I know this isn't an exact science and in other spins their might be stats that may spin it a different way if you use guys like Michael Snaer's stats vs. David Tairu's. But there definetely is a trend of juco players underacheiving when it comes to high major programs and being somewhat productive to non productive when it comes to mid major programs. I also find it interesting how few Juco players were signed in the big12. This is a region where the best juco ball is played. Especially if you talk about the Juco colleges in Idaho, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, and Missouri.
I still believe you get the best players available. But I strongly believe juco players should have instant impacts. I don't see the instant impact trend happening for most of these players. BTW, OSU recruit Karron Johnson is averaging 22pts so far at Moberly.
So I searched out some of the top juco players from last year, and as more often than not, statistics a referenced on this board to propagate a philosophy that one player is better than the next, so I'd thought I would play along. I researched the top level juco players(juco first team AAs mostly) from last year and looked at the impact they are having on their teams this year.
By far the biggest impact is being had by Jarrid Famous. He's averaging nearly 12pts and 7rbs. Not bad. He has played against bad teams, but I still won't discredit his production. However in contrast to the top three post players Cousins, Gallon, and Favors, the numbers pale in comparison. These three players average more points and rebounds on teams where they are the second and third options. Cuz and Favors average 14pts and 8rbs respectfully on talented teams adn Gallon averages 12 and 10. Famous is however performing better statisically than John Henson and Wally Judge.
The second best Juco post forward is Chris Hines, a 6'8 PF who is playing for Alabama. Hines is averaging 2.5pts per game and 2.8 rebounds. Very poor numbers for a guy who has now 1 1/2 years to be productive. The top Oklahoma prospect, Wayne Runnels is averaging 5pts and 5rbs for a very bad Creighton team. The top juco forward in the big12, Marquis Gilstrap is averaging 13pts and 7rbs for a ISU team that really had a need for post help for Brackins.
Now Juco guards have been renowned for being instant offensive productivity players and in some cases that is still prevalent. Marvin Roberts is averaging 15pts at FIU and Rico Pickett, the consensus top juco pg is averaging 13pts at Manhattan. But both Manhattan and FIU are very bad teams. But more often, even that modest prodcution is not the case most times. Deandre Brown, the first team juco PG is averaging under 9pts a game and three assist. Casey Mitchell, a Bob Huggins recruit as WVU may have been the top consensus juco player last year. Mitchell started off well averaging 13pts in his first three games, but combined for 9 in the next 3. Mitchell is averaging 8.8pts per game and shooting a very bad 25% from the field. Dwight Buycks another juco aa for Marquette has been less than stellar statisically. Ridge McKeither averages 11.6pts for a Chattanooga team that is not very good. It's decent production, but for a mid major team.
So I know this isn't an exact science and in other spins their might be stats that may spin it a different way if you use guys like Michael Snaer's stats vs. David Tairu's. But there definetely is a trend of juco players underacheiving when it comes to high major programs and being somewhat productive to non productive when it comes to mid major programs. I also find it interesting how few Juco players were signed in the big12. This is a region where the best juco ball is played. Especially if you talk about the Juco colleges in Idaho, Kansas, Oklahoma, Texas, and Missouri.
I still believe you get the best players available. But I strongly believe juco players should have instant impacts. I don't see the instant impact trend happening for most of these players. BTW, OSU recruit Karron Johnson is averaging 22pts so far at Moberly.