Measuring tmg's loss

[BigTime]

I think with TMG at the point we should have been running and gunning...trying to outscore teams...he could create alot in the open court....if he somehow does come back I think he needs to run and gun next year.....

He was the best open court ball handler in CBB this year imo.

 

[152219]

It hurt his offense quite a bit actually. Look at his shooting percentages for the final 6 games of the conference season. He was hurt and worn down. His shots were short.

As for why he was late, it involved the weather. Coach Capel had already set down a no excuses policy in light of the recent discipline problems (Warren skipping practice in Alaska), so he suspended him one half against Baylor.

I don't know all the circumstances, but I do know that TMG was not the main problem on this team (far from it), and losing him is going to sting like hell.

So, what explains the poor defense before the final 6 games? There is no doubt he wore down, but he didn't play defense before that.

And the fact that he didn't beat the expectant weather (like the rest of the team did) and stayed in Houston

I posted this on the board weeks ago...TMG looked like a guy who thought he had "won" if he scored 23 points and the guy he was guarding scored 21.

 

[Sooner23]

Everything will be OK guys. Watch and see!

Signed,

FaithfulSooner

 

[AdaSooner]

BigTime -- No offense, but did you ever play team sports?

I did, and players who only played on one end of the floor are considered selfish and not a good teammate.

Now, he may have been well liked by everybody off the floor and been a good guy, but on the floor he seemed very selfish because he would not play defense, and was a bit of a ballhog on the offensive end.

Maybe it's not fair to say "bad teammate", instead maybe we should say he wasn't a team player.

Tommy wasn't the only one who didn't play good defense. We had more than our share of weak links on the defensive end this year. I guess you could say it was a team "effort."

I use the word team lightly. I'm not sure anyone outside of Cade and Tony knew what it meant or how to go about playing as one unit. OUr entire season was defined by poor defense and poor team chemistry.

 

[luckyc1423]

He was the best open court ball handler in CBB this year imo.

I completely agree...I think that is were capel made a huge mistake, not letting this kid be a fast break style guy, steve nash style

I understand we could not sub him out so we wanted to reserve his energy. But we could have done it at times when we knew there was a TV timeout coming, or coming could have used his timeouts wisely to give him a break

 

[BigTime]

So, what explains the poor defense before the final 6 games? There is no doubt he wore down, but he didn't play defense before that.And the fact that he didn't beat the expectant weather (like the rest of the team did) and stayed in Houston

I posted this on the board weeks ago...TMG looked like a guy who thought he had "won" if he scored 23 points and the guy he was guarding scored 21.

I will disagree with you on that. I thought there was a nice stretch for the first half of the conference season where TMG played some pretty good defense (at least effort-wise). He is never going to be a lockdown defender and he will always have to deal with being short, but I think he could be decent as he progresses as PG.

 

[Edmond_Sooner]

Quit making things up. Where did you hear that TMG was a bad teammate? From his quoted song lyrics on his facebook? Some of you guys amaze me.

No one can say one way or the other if he is a bad teammate or if the Team chemistry will improve, but as much as i thought he was an amazing player individually i also felt he was selfish and didnt play "point" very good...i thought some stemmed from the team being so bad and him feeling like he had to be the guy to score, also some from just being young...

I think he had tremendous upside and even if i didnt think he was as much of a positive as some people did, i think losing him will have a far greater negative impact than keeping would have been...

I hate to see kids leave schools when there is some adversity, probably because i did the same thing and it ruined my career...i wish the best for TMG if he is indeed gone...

 

[Big Old Booger]

Tommy wasn't the only one who didn't play good defense. We had more than our share of weak links on the defensive end this year. I guess you could say it was a team "effort."

I use the word team lightly. I'm not sure anyone outside of Cade and Tony knew what it meant or how to go about playing as one unit. OUr entire season was defined by poor defense and poor team chemistry.

I agree, except this thread is about TMG and not the other players.

Pledger didn't play defense much either, and neither did Tiny and a number of others. However, that doesn't mean TMG didn't have to play defense.

I also agree with the other poster that when your 3 days late from Christmas break, that's pretty selfish. Obviously, I don't know the issues why he was late so I can only comment that he was late. If he had a family member who passed away or was deathly ill and it was never reported, I obviously don't know about it.

BOB/Jud,

No offense but I could really care less about what you say or think and can't wait until you go back to owen field. Shouldn't be long now....

BigTime -- I'm really hurt...to quote Michael "Tito, I need a tissue". Sorry to disappoint, but I'll be hanging around here quite a bit. The program needs me in times like these...

 

[Big Old Booger]

I will disagree with you on that. I thought there was a nice stretch for the first half of the conference season where TMG played some pretty good defense (at least effort-wise). He is never going to be a lockdown defender and he will always have to deal with being short, but I think he could be decent as he progresses as PG.

Short is no excuse when you are guarding someone of equal height. It's not like he was guarding Ralph Sampson or Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Defense is about effort and frankly, TMG didn't put out very much.

 

[HoHum]

Kid could have been an absolute monster at the point by his junior and senior year. Heck, he was a mini-monster this year.

If Capel could have figured out what buttons to push (or maybe nobody could) and got him to put more effort into defense....yeesh.

 

[BigTime]

Short is no excuse when you are guarding someone of equal height. It's not like he was guarding Ralph Sampson or Kareem Abdul-Jabbar.

Defense is about effort and frankly, TMG didn't put out very much.

I didn't say it was an excuse.

 

[Big Old Booger]

I didn't say it was an excuse.

No, but your making excuses for him.

Hopefully the other thread is right and he's coming back to Norman today to meet with Capel. Maybe Capel can convince him to come back and work on his defense and better understand that stats aren't as important as wins. I'm sure all the losing was wearing on him, too.

If he came back and turned it around and was a better teammate, he wouldn't be the first to do so.

 

[AdaSooner]

I agree, except this thread is about TMG and not the other players.

I had no idea, thanks for telling me.

What I'm saying is that it's not fair to point the finger at one player for a multitude of faults on defense and ignore his teammates. We had so many breakdowns on defense this season, I wouldn't know where to begin in applying the blame? Maybe it starts (and ends) with the coaching staff. I only know that TMG wasn't the only one who was at fault.

To be honest, I didn't think his defense was all that bad. He got beat a few times. But so did everyone else. Our biggest problem, aside from a lack of foot speed, was on the help side and in transition. Tommy started out strong in most games, and then began to pace himself as the game wore on. I don't know if it was physical or mental fatigue or both? But if anyone needed time to catch his breath and collect his thoughts at the end of the season, it was him. Pressures are greater at the point than any other position. It's especially difficult for someone his age.

As for TMG's offense, I didn't think he had much choice but to turn into more of a scorer when his teammates weren't making shots. I'll bet if the truth was known, Coach Capel was calling plays for him from the bench. What other options did Jeff have when Tiny and Willie weren't on the floor, and our best shooters were bricking nearly every shot they put up?

 

[OU84]

This is a terrible loss for our program.

 

[MercedeSooner]

Said it before I read the other thread, but he ll be an All American by his Junior year. And OSU Jeff said it but there are hardly any freshman who are good defenders, and TMG has nowhere to go but up.

This board and OU fans in general just put way too much stock in this past incoming class as being almost saviors for this program when the truth is all freshman, no matter how good, have faults and have to go through a pretty big learning curve. Its just sad if Tiny and TMG dont come back because we re talking about 2 really talented guys who could lead this team pretty far if they stayed at OU.

 

[152219]

I will disagree with you on that. I thought there was a nice stretch for the first half of the conference season where TMG played some pretty good defense (at least effort-wise). He is never going to be a lockdown defender and he will always have to deal with being short, but I think he could be decent as he progresses as PG.

Well, we will have to agree to disagree then. I thought he was a poor defender the entire season.

 

[playmakr]

I think it is a coping mechanism for some.

Then what is the Warren bashing?

 

[cfin5256]

Then what is the Warren bashing?

Stupid.

 

[j2d2]

It was widely reported, including here, that he didn't work out with (most ) of the team before the season and (I think) during the summer. It seems clear that he was one of the guys Capel was referring to in his remarks about egos on the team. Not going to class. Now, YOU might think that shows good team dedication, I dont-not even a little. Must have hit a sore spot with someone. And I dont blame him alone for the troubles this year, but to argue that he was not a part of them doesn't make sense.

 

[cfin5256]

And I dont blame him alone for the troubles this year

That's exactly where I'm at; to single out any one of the three for full blame is stupid. IMO, they all are at fault. We started this season with three supposedly top shelf talents, and they are all three talented. All three have NBA aspirations, but we needed them to realize that putting aside the ego and petty disagreements would help them realize their aspirations as much as it helped the team. In that, they all three failed.