Shaka Smart turns down Illinois.....

[WTSooner]

Interesting. Just how nice a job is he holding out for?

 

[bocabull]

Why not just build VCU into a Gonzaga like Mark Few? Be the big fish in a small pond instead of a medium fish in a big pond.

Butler, Gonzaga, VCU, there is room for them every season. It only takes a few players who like winning.

 

[WTSooner]

Why not just build VCU into a Gonzaga like Mark Few? Be the big fish in a small pond instead of a medium fish in a big pond.

Butler, Gonzaga, VCU, there is room for them every season. It only takes a few players who like winning.

How often does that happen? Do you know how hard it is to build a school that size into a team that goes to the Dance every season? Outside of Gonzaga, I can't think of another team that currently fits that description.

He is the hot name right now, what happens two years from now when he misses the tournament a few times? Just like the Butler coach, or the Northern Iowa coach (I think), those top tier jobs disappear.

And I wouldn't call Illinois a medium fish. They have a chance to be as good year in and year out as anybody not named Kentucky/NC/Duke.

 

[thebigabd]

Jeff Capel: Went to Oklahoma from VCU and failed.

Lon Kruger: His UNLV team was in the top 25 all year and went to the NCAA Tournament, his OU team was under .500

Billy Kennedy: Left Murray State and they went 31-2 this year. A&M was awful.

Doc Sadler: Went 47-15 at UTEP, went to Nebraska and was average for awhile and got fired.

Jeff Bzdelik: Bzdelik went 50-16 at Air Force, went to Colorado and was average, left Colorado who won the Pac 10 and went to the NCAA Tournament. Wake Forest was horrific.

Leaving a safe job is VERY risky. A lot of coaches end up in the ****ter because they leave a good mid-major job. I would rather go 50-16 in 2 years at Air Force, or 47-15 in 2 years at UTEP, then go play in front of an empty gym in Boulder, Lincoln, etc and have a bad team and bad programs.

Good move by Shaka... hold out for a guaranteed winner. Dont make the same mistake a lot of coaches make. He makes plenty of money, no urgency.

 

[WTSooner]

I wouldn't compare Illinois to Colorado or Nebraska though. I really think Illinois is very high on the 2nd tier job list. If he is holding out for tier 1, that offer may never come.

Maybe he is content where he is. That's cool. I get and respect that. I just thought this might be a good opportunity for him.

 

[mattham4]

Illinois has been to 5 Final Fours and they have won the Big 10 regular season championship 17 times.

Remind me again how Illinois compares to Nebraska and Colorado...

 

[sperry]

Illinois has been to 5 Final Fours and they have won the Big 10 regular season championship 17 times.

Remind me again how Illinois compares to Nebraska and Colorado...

abd believes that Nebraska and Colorado are premiere basketball programs. It's just been an 80 year succession of poor coaching hires that's holding them back. I mean look at all the JUCOs they're bringing in this year.

 

[bocabull]

VCU has a larger enrollment than OU in both total and undergraduate students.

I would hardly call 32,000 students a small school and there is an abundance of talent in the Richmond - DC - Baltimore area. They play in a relatively new arena built in 1999 that holds 7,500.

Illinois has been to 2 final 4s. 1989 and 2005. They are basically OU. Shaka is smart to stay put.

 

[mattham4]

VCU has a larger enrollment than OU in both total and undergraduate students.

I would hardly call 32,000 students a small school and there is an abundance of talent in the Richmond - DC - Baltimore area. They play in a relatively new arena built in 1999 that holds 7,500.

Illinois has been to 2 final 4s. 1989 and 2005. They are basically OU. Shaka is smart to stay put.

Illinois Basketball History

First Year of Basketball ............................................. 1906
All-Time Record....................................................... 1,650-882 (.652)
All-Time Big Ten Record ............................................ 880-635 (.581)
NCAA Tournament Appearances / Last........................... 29 / 2011
All-Time Record in NCAA Tournament............................ 39-30 (.565)
NCAA Final Four Appearances / Last...............................5 / 2005
Big Ten Championships / Last ..................................... 17 / 2005
Big Ten Tournament Championships / Last .................... 2 / 2005


Source: http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/ill/sports/m-baskbl/auto_pdf/2011-12/quick_facts/quick_facts.pdf

 

[bocabull]

The final 4 started in 1979. LOL @ counting a "Final 4" when the tournament was 16 teams and playing second fiddle to the NIT.

 

[thebigabd]

abd believes that Nebraska and Colorado are premiere basketball programs. It's just been an 80 year succession of poor coaching hires that's holding them back. I mean look at all the JUCOs they're bringing in this year.

I also included Wake Forest, Oklahoma, Texas A&M, etc on that list.

Lots of coaches leave golden jobs to go to a "bigger school" and fail miserably. Its a big risk.

 

[mattham4]

The final 4 started in 1979. LOL @ counting a "Final 4" when the tournament was 16 teams and playing second fiddle to the NIT.

I didn't realize that math was different before 1979.

I, stupidly, thought that the last 4 teams in the tournament were probably the "final four"...regardless of when the NCAA trademarked the phrase.

I'm not here to defend the Illinois SID's interpretation of their success over the years, but I did feel the need to immediately squash any comparison whatsoever to Colorado and Nebraska.

 

[WTSooner]

Lots of coaches leave golden jobs to go to a "bigger school" and fail miserably. Its a big risk.

So they shouldn't do it? There are lots of coaches at small schools that have a good year or two, pass up opportunities at larger schools, then fall off the map, and get fired in a couple of years. There is that risk too. Illinois is a good job. You get to recruit Chicago. You get a conference that isn't overly tough to win, but has enough good teams to not kill your RPI.

 

[seniorsooner]

So they shouldn't do it? There are lots of coaches at small schools that have a good year or two, pass up opportunities at larger schools, then fall off the map, and get fired in a couple of years. There is that risk too. Illinois is a good job. You get to recruit Chicago. You get a conference that isn't overly tough to win, but has enough good teams to not kill your RPI.

Not to mention the worst case scenario is you are set for quite some time (if you manage your money well) even if you totally flame out and are fired after 3-4 years.

 

[WTSooner]

Not to mention the worst case scenario is you are set for quite some time (if you manage your money well) even if you totally flame out and are fired after 3-4 years.

Yep. And getting fired from a big school usually doesn't keep you from getting a job at a smaller school. Mike Davis from Indiana to UAB. There is talk of Weber from Illinois to Northern Illinois, I think.

 

[seniorsooner]

Yep. And getting fired from a big school usually doesn't keep you from getting a job at a smaller school. Mike Davis from Indiana to UAB. There is talk of Weber from Illinois to Northern Illinois, I think.

Also, Stan Heath flamed out at Arkansas and immediately got the South Florida job. It's not like you're exiled on an island or something.

 

[Sawyer]

Chris Lowry at SIU-C is another example of a mid-major coach staying too long. He probably could've moved on to a bigger school and now he's an afterthought in his own conference.

That said, I would be shocked if Smart stops winning at VCU. He doesn't strike me as a guy who just happened to get lucky. And he's being paid pretty well there already. He could make more at a bigger school, but he's already earning over a million per year. He can wait for the perfect job if he wants, and if it never comes he'll still be set for a very long time (absolute worst-case scenario for him would be taking a job as a TV guy and getting paid big bucks for a very low stress position at ESPN).

Illinois is a good job, but everything I've read suggests you've got to be willing to get your hands a little dirty to really tap into the Chicago recruiting hotbed. Weber apparently wasn't, which led to his demise. Self had no problem with it. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Kruger left Illinois for an NBA job in part because he didn't want to deal with it. Illinois, for all it's positives, isn't a job for everyone.

 

[Salt City Sooner]

Yep. And getting fired from a big school usually doesn't keep you from getting a job at a smaller school. Mike Davis from Indiana to UAB. There is talk of Weber from Illinois to Northern Illinois, I think.

The rumors are actually BW to Southern Illinois, which is where he was when Illinois hired him.

http://espn.go.com/chicago/ncb/story/_/id/7713132/source-southern-illinois-offers-job-bruce-weber

 

[sdcloud9]

Smart makes $1.3 million at VCU and his wife reportedly loves it there.

I think it's great that he is not chasing the money, he apparently is his own man with his own plans and goals.

 

[stoops4pres]

Chris Lowry at SIU-C is another example of a mid-major coach staying too long. He probably could've moved on to a bigger school and now he's an afterthought in his own conference.

That said, I would be shocked if Smart stops winning at VCU. He doesn't strike me as a guy who just happened to get lucky. And he's being paid pretty well there already. He could make more at a bigger school, but he's already earning over a million per year. He can wait for the perfect job if he wants, and if it never comes he'll still be set for a very long time (absolute worst-case scenario for him would be taking a job as a TV guy and getting paid big bucks for a very low stress position at ESPN).

Illinois is a good job, but everything I've read suggests you've got to be willing to get your hands a little dirty to really tap into the Chicago recruiting hotbed. Weber apparently wasn't, which led to his demise. Self had no problem with it. I wouldn't be surprised at all if Kruger left Illinois for an NBA job in part because he didn't want to deal with it. Illinois, for all it's positives, isn't a job for everyone.

Basically stated everything I was about to. For all it's potential, Smart has the resources and system to keep VCU a stable program. He runs the risk of not capitalizing on an opportunity to get a top job, but I think he can wait and see if there are more promising opportunities than Illinois.