Are these the facts?

[CoachTalk]

• Under .500 in conference play since Capel arrived
• Losing record without Blake Griffin
• 9 straight conference losses (with games at Baylor and at Texas coming)
• 3 out of 5 years with no post-season at all
• Under Capel, OU loses by double digits every 3.6 games
• The worst seasons for OU basketball in decades
• OU will not be favored in any conference game this year, except perhaps Tech at home

These are things I have gathered from around the board in different threads... Are these all accurate? If so, my goodness.

Blake Griffin Played for CAPEL, you cant name his stats with a player that played for him. Regardless...Its not fair to take credit away for those wins.

 

[61sooner]

Trying to compare Capel's situation with the end of the John Blake disaster. Blake couldn't coach but wasn't a bad recruiter. He did leave some talent Stoops could use. BUT he couldn't win. OU lost game by huge numbers.
OU basketball is getting blown out in most games against D1 foes. It's hard to get excited about any team they have beaten this year. Would you be upbeat if the OU football team beat Drake, Pitt State of Kansas, Central Ok and lost to KU, Tex Tex?
If a new BB coach came in for next year and could just sweep out any player he could and start from scratch, who would he keep? Fitz, Cam who? The talent level according to most posts is just above bare?
Tine for Capel to leave. Buy him out!

 

[schoonerdriver]

• Under .500 in conference play since Capel arrived
• Losing record without Blake Griffin
• 9 straight conference losses (with games at Baylor and at Texas coming)
• 3 out of 5 years with no post-season at all
• Under Capel, OU loses by double digits every 3.6 games
• The worst seasons for OU basketball in decades
• OU will not be favored in any conference game this year, except perhaps Tech at home

But he did win the gold medal at the U18 World Championships. :facepalm

This list will only get longer by season's end and if it is decided that Capel gets another year, there will have to be some changes on his staff. That is if he can attract any good coaches at this point.

 

[21standyale]

Blake Griffin Played for CAPEL, you cant name his stats with a player that played for him. Regardless...Its not fair to take credit away for those wins.

Blake Griffin played with Taylor Griffin. He was going whereever Taylor went don't claim that as Capels doing.

 

[CoachTalk]

Blake Griffin played with Taylor Griffin. He was going whereever Taylor went don't claim that as Capels doing.

Who the hell cares if he came bc of dating beau's sister... HE came to OU. That counts for capel.

Im not saying he is a world beater, i know we will struggle to win some games, etc.... I dont have OU contacts in today!

 

[Big Old Booger]

Who the hell cares if he came bc of dating beau's sister... HE came to OU. That counts for capel.

Im not saying he is a world beater, i know we will struggle to win some games, etc.... I dont have OU contacts in today!

Then why do you want him as our coach? How can you admit he "will struggle to win games" in one breath and then in another say he shouldn't be fired? :facepalm

 

[CoachTalk]

Blake Griffin played with Taylor Griffin. He was going whereever Taylor went don't claim that as Capels doing.

So huggins cant count the wins with beasley? Barnes cant count KD's wins?
They both came bc of assistant coaches correct?

 

[CoachTalk]

Then why do you want him as our coach? How can you admit he "will struggle to win games" in one breath and then in another say he shouldn't be fired? :facepalm

I think he deserves to fix what has happened. ie TMG, tiny debacle... Every coach is going to struggle. 2 yrs removed from elite 8, defects from the program. if he doesnt fix it next year, or at least a huge improvement then its time to move on...

 

[Big Old Booger]

So huggins cant count the wins with beasley? Barnes cant count KD's wins?
They both came bc of assistant coaches correct?

Huggins cannot count Beasley's wins because Beasley never played for Huggins.

Its laughable you question if the same applies to Barnes with KD when Barnes had been the coach at Texas for 10 years before Durant ever arrived on campus. I can assure you if Penders were still the HC at Texas, they wouldn't have signed Durant.

 

[oSuJeff97]

So huggins cant count the wins with beasley? Barnes cant count KD's wins?
They both came bc of assistant coaches correct?

The difference, of course, is that both of those coaches have shown that they can field teams that compete at a high level without having the #1 overall player taken in the draft on their teams.

So far, Capel has not shown the same.

And let's not go down the "all coaches need talent to win" path either.

The question is not "does Capel need talent to win".... the answer is obvious. Every coach needs talent to win.

The question is, "does Capel need a once-in-a-generation freak talent to win"?

The obvious issue is that once-in-a-generation freak talents like Griffin only come along once in a generation.

 

[NickZepp]

Texas has been a top half Big 12 team since Barnes got there. Outside of the Blake years OU's been a bottom half Big 12 team. That's not comparable, take away KD and Barnes record is still great.

Here's Barnes win total by year since he's taken the Texas job. 19, 24, 25, 22, 26, 25, 20, 30, 25, 31, 23, 24.

Guess which one was the KD year? It's the one in between the 30 and 31 year. That's right he won less games with KD than the year before and the year after KD!

And he's won at least 20 every year but his first year. More than 25 5 times.

I hate Texas and I hate that they are so good in basketball on a consistent basis. The fact is that a talented freak doesn't make Barnes successful like it did for Jeff Capel.

 

[thebigabd]

The difference, of course, is that both of those coaches have shown that they can field teams that compete at a high level without having the #1 overall player taken in the draft on their teams.

So far, Capel has not shown the same.

And let's not go down the "all coaches need talent to win" path either.

The question is not "does Capel need talent to win".... the answer is obvious. Every coach needs talent to win.

The question is, "does Capel need a once-in-a-generation freak talent to win"?

The obvious issue is that once-in-a-generation freak talents like Griffin only come a long once in a generation.

This! Finally! Someone gets it!

Texas has been a top half Big 12 team since Barnes got there. Outside of the Blake years OU's been a bottom half Big 12 team. That's not comparable, take away KD and Barnes record is still great. Here's his win total by year since he's taken the Texas job. 19, 24, 25, 22, 26, 25, 20, 30, 25, 31, 23, 24. Guess which one was the KD year? It's the one in between the 30 and 31 year. That's right he won less games with KD than the year before and the year after KD. And he's won at least 20 every year but his first year. More than 25 5 times. I hate Texas and I hate that they are so good in basketball on a consistent basis. The fact is that a talented freak doesn't make Barnes successful like it did for Jeff Capel.

Outstanding post, Zepp.

Its laughable you question if the same applies to Barnes with KD when Barnes had been the coach at Texas for 10 years before Durant ever arrived on campus. I can assure you if Penders were still the HC at Texas, they wouldn't have signed Durant.

Thank you.

 

[DenverSooner]

So huggins cant count the wins with beasley? Barnes cant count KD's wins?
They both came bc of assistant coaches correct?

Barnes and Huggins have more than proved themselves without the above named players. People are not upset with Capel because he had a good season with Blake Griffin on the team, they are upset because he only had an acceptable season in Blake's first year (one win above .500 in conference play - 9-7) and has had three unacceptable seasons without him. It is weak to try and change this argument into something it isn't to support the position that Capel is a good coach. Everyone admits that Blake's sophomore season was a great year and that his freshman season was acceptable to good. (The NCAA win pushes it towards good but 9-7 is not all that great in conference play).

 

[NickZepp]

Huggins never coached Beasley. He left for WVU. I think you mean Frank Martin, his win total at KSU is 21, 22, and 29 and this year he's got 9 wins so far.

So far the year he had the least amount of wins was the year with Beasley, again bad comparison.

 

[CoachTalk]

my bad on huggins and beasley...It was the asst. coach comparison... Im just saying that you cant take away a coaches wins bc he had a great home kid.

 

[NickZepp]

my bad on huggins and beasley...It was the asst. coach comparison... Im just saying that you cant take away a coaches wins bc he had a great home kid.

Including Capel's Griffin years he's 32-33 in conference and 61% of his overall games. The last coach to have a losing conference record in 5 years as a coach was Bob Stevens back in the 60s. He was fired after his 5th year. Dave Bliss won only 59.4% of his overall games. But if we win 2 or 3 games I think Jeff's record will be in that area. Maybe even below 59% which would be the worst since John MacLeod in the late 60s early 70s. This is historically bad for OU.

 

[NickZepp]

Just a little more on these numbers.


Let's say we go 10-20 on the year like was posted on the projections someone linked earlier. Capel's will be at 56.4% win% for his career. That's below John MacLeod at 56.6%. Since 1968 we've never had a 5 year span this bad with one coach.

 

[DenverSooner]

Just a little more on these numbers.


Let's say we go 10-20 on the year like was posted on the projections someone linked earlier. Capel's will be at 56.4% win% for his career. That's below John MacLeod at 56.6%. Since 1968 we've never had a 5 year span this bad with one coach.

When you consider that Blake Griffin played for OU during that time period it is horrific. How do you have a guy as dominant as Blake Griffin in two of your five seasons and post a losing conference record. Add to that list TMG, Tiny and WW and it is unbelievable you could lose so much. Those four guys are four of the better players to have played in this conference over the last 4 years. People can bash TMG all they want but the fact of the matter is he was an outstanding basketball player if not an outstanding person.