Is This Rock Bottom For the Program?

hoopsaustin said:
Such a tired argument. You really think we make the tournament if we had good fans? Moser would lose all the same
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Did I say that? No. I just said that it would be disappointing as a player to be 13 and oh playing a top 10 team and show up to a half empty home arena. If you don’t think that’s the case you’re nuts.
 
IndySooner said:
Did I say that? No. I just said that it would be disappointing as a player to be 13 and oh playing a top 10 team and show up to a half empty home arena. If you don’t think that’s the case you’re nuts.
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Disappointed, sure. Going out and blowing wins so we miss tourney 4 years in a row bc of the crowd? No
 
I just saw someone mention on Twitter that they apparently recognized Sooner hoops alumni yesterday, but hadn’t advertised it at all and no one knew it was going to happen. Is that true? Is the program THAT incompetent?
 
IndySooner said:
They were 13-0 and highly ranked at the time. Imagine how much of a letdown it was to see that crowd.
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not exactly sure which game you're referring to
are you referring to the prairie view a&m game that was a win?
or the texas a&m game? if so...when exactly was the team letdown by the crowd? when they were up 20 pts in the second half....or after they pissed it away and lost?
 
People are arguing either/or, but the answer is “both.”

—Moser has done a poor job and his failure to elevate the program in any way is ultimately on him and will likely (deservedly) cost him his job.

—The fanbase is completely apathetic; the atmosphere is drab; and even when the team has had a good/decent season over the past 20 years or so it is STILL a struggle to get people to show up or care— especially when compared to other comparable fanbases. I mean just look at the baseball attendance side by side for opening weekend with the other SEC schools (there is always an excuse for why OU fans don’t roll out).

Both of the above are true and this is why I think the program is at such a low right now. I do not think it is a particularly attractive job other than the fact that there still aren’t many of these jobs available. But any coach with options I would think would look elsewhere first. We are likely going to need to overpay or give a coach another chance that no one else is offering or take a real flier on a young/unproven coach that isn’t on the radar much yet.

It’s a program that is failing on all levels.
 
OUSKINS said:
People are arguing either/or, but the answer is “both.”

—Moser has done a poor job and his failure to elevate the program in any way is ultimately on him and will likely (deservedly) cost him his job.

—The fanbase is completely apathetic; the atmosphere is drab; and even when the team has had a good/decent season over the past 20 years or so it is STILL a struggle to get people to show up or care— especially when compared to other comparable fanbases. I mean just look at the baseball attendance side by side for opening weekend with the other SEC schools (there is always an excuse for why OU fans don’t roll out).

Both of the above are true and this is why I think the program is at such a low right now. I do not think it is a particularly attractive job other than the fact that there still aren’t many of these jobs available. But any coach with options I would think would look elsewhere first. We are likely going to need to overpay or give a coach another chance that no one else is offering or take a real flier on a young/unproven coach that isn’t on the radar much yet.

It’s a program that is failing on all levels.
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I agree with this, by the way. Not suggesting that our fans are worth a darn. They have been for decades. But that’s actually why I don’t think it’s accurate to say that’s a reason Moser has failed. We have had multiple coaches succeed despite crappy fan support. I remember being embarrassed every year I went to the Big 12 tournament to see the terrible turnout, and that’s even when we won the thing three straight years. Same with NCAA tournaments and FFs. Ditto the turnout in Omaha three years ago. And our football fans are notorious for whining about start times, heat, cold, etc.

Lots of issues on many fronts, but I am in the camp that thinks that a good coach can still come in and turn things around quickly. The question is if Joe can identify and hire a good coach.
 
WichitaSooner said:
I agree with this, by the way. Not suggesting that our fans are worth a darn. They have been for decades. But that’s actually why I don’t think it’s accurate to say that’s a reason Moser has failed. We have had multiple coaches succeed despite crappy fan support. I remember being embarrassed every year I went to the Big 12 tournament to see the terrible turnout, and that’s even when we won the thing three straight years. Same with NCAA tournaments and FFs. Ditto the turnout in Omaha three years ago. And our football fans are notorious for whining about start times, heat, cold, etc.

Lots of issues on many fronts, but I am in the camp that thinks that a good coach can still come in and turn things around quickly. The question is if Joe can identify and hire a good coach.
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Joe C will fall back to what he knows. The "Hot Name" failed, like it did with Capel. Now he'll go get a safe experienced name like LK.
 
daqman said:
not exactly sure which game you're referring to
are you referring to the prairie view a&m game that was a win?
or the texas a&m game? if so...when exactly was the team letdown by the crowd? when they were up 20 pts in the second half....or after they pissed it away and lost?
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I’m specifically referring to the game that a player‘s dad tweeted about. You can take it up with the players’s dad.

Also, do you think maybe a better crowd might’ve helped hold off the rally? If you don’t, you know nothing about college basketball.
 
IndySooner said:
I’m specifically referring to the game that a player‘s dad tweeted about. You can take it up with the players’s dad.

Also, do you think maybe a better crowd might’ve helped hold off the rally? If you don’t, you know nothing about college basketball.
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In other words, you don’t actually know what you’re talking about and are just parroting false info from his dad.
 
IndySooner said:
I’m specifically referring to the game that a player‘s dad tweeted about. You can take it up with the players’s dad.

Also, do you think maybe a better crowd might’ve helped hold off the rally? If you don’t, you know nothing about college basketball.
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so that was the texas a&m game.
they claimed the lnc was "65% full".
what capacity level do you think the players need to not blow at 20 pt second half lead?

i agree loud/enthusiastic crowds boost home court advantage. problem is....moser has shown he can't win at home even when there are large/loud crowds.
each of the last 3 seasons the fan momentum was building..only to see it smashed by moser and his team pissing down their legs and losing at home.
fans have given up and i don't blame them at all.

it's a new era in college basketball. players get paid big money to play this game....if they need fans to motivate them to play with effort....they're going to be disappointed....especially when they lose games they shouldn't.

i don't follow the nba....do highly paid players often complain about fan support when their teams suck/lose?
 
So, I’ve really pondered this in the weeks since I posted it. And on the surface, considering how we played down the stretch and wound up making the tourney with room to spare… I think the most reasonable answer to the question I posed in the title is “No.”

It would be hard for me to argue that this is lower point that after Capel final season. That was a horrible season, we were facing sanctions, and the roster was depleted with nothing on the horizon. It was definitely a “worse place” than where we are now.

But what nags at me is that back then I think it was reasonable to pretty much blame it ALL on Capel getting in way over his head. I really don’t recall being nervous about the state of the program overall. Figured it was just a hire that didn’t work out and we move on. Once Lon was brought in I think the optimism essentially returned immediately. And two years later they were back in tournament and on a march to a F4.

Now, they way I view it, is that is has been NINE years since OU basketball had a legitimately “good” team. The 2014 team was good. As was the 2015 team. The 2016 team was approaching great. Since? I’d call our BEST team in those 9 years “solid.” But we haven’t been good in almost a decade now. Our ceiling over this period has been adequate. That’s it.

So despite the fact that the team played significantly better over the final 3-4 weeks of season; I find myself more or less in same place. I certainly enjoyed watching them more over this stretch, but my macro view is the same as it was a month ago. It’s just very hard to see where we go from here and how we get better.

All teams have to remake their roster year to year now to one extent or another. But it feels like we are “remaking” the roster in a desperate attempt to be decent— not to actually be good or compete near the top of the conference. It’s like a mad scalable to piece together a team that can MAYBE eyeball .500 in conference (even though we pretty much always fall short of that modest goal).

During the previous rock bottom I mentioned there was a clear and obvious problem to solve. Now, it’s much more complicated and there are no easy answers.
 
Hecubus said:
The current problem isn’t the coach, it’s the guy who runs the department. We need someone who isn’t content with their legacy running the AD. It will not get better until that happens.
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Yes, by all means, it all comes down to one man. There are no other contributing factors or obstacles to overcome. Fire that man and in no time we'll have a brand new arena fully paid for by BMDs, a packed house for every game, NIL the equal of blue blood programs and McDonald's All-Americans lining up to compete in crimson and cream.
 
skyvue said:
Yes, by all means, it all comes down to one man. There are no other contributing factors or obstacles to overcome. Fire that man and in no time we'll have a brand new arena fully paid for by BMDs, a packed house for every game, NIL the equal of blue blood programs and McDonald's All-Americans lining up to compete in crimson and cream.
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Leadership matters. It’s hard earned knowledge to anyone who had to lead people (whether 10 or thousands).
 
Looking ahead to next season, is there any one on the current roster who might return that OU can build a team around?
Fortunately we can only sink 2 places in the SEC to dead last in '25-'26. So our rock can't sink too far anymore than it has.
 
61sooner said:
Looking ahead to next season, is there any one on the current roster who might return that OU can build a team around?
Fortunately we can only sink 2 places in the SEC to dead last in '25-'26. So our rock can't sink too far anymore than it has.
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Sure. More the retain the better. Process luke, Cole maybe 1 more out.

Keep everyone else. Add 3-4
 
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