Big 12 v SEC

[Sawyer]

For most of that time, there were at least two between the SEC and Big 12 (Cotton and Independence bowls).

The SEC has faced several Pac and Big 12 teams in BCS games, as well. If I'm not mistaken, they've done pretty well in those games.

But you're granting that the Big 10 and ACC are weak. The Big 12 isn't as strong overall now as it was a few years ago after replacing Nebraska (8-4), A&M (8-4) and Mizzou (11-1) with TCU (4-8) and WVU (4-8), and the teams at the top aren't as good as they have been. The PAC gets plenty of attention for Stanford, Oregon, USC (when they're good), etc.

 

[skyvue]

The conference still has the best bowl record of all the major conferences over the past 15 years. That isn't just being propped up by 3-4 teams.

Bowl games are a questionable (at best) standard by which to judge a team or conference. I've said it before, but the bowl season is the twilight zone of college football. Teams have had four to six weeks off. The season's over, nothing is at stake. The players have been distracted for a week by luaus, parties, banquets, and field trips.

The same media that overhypes the SEC has been overhyping bowl games in recent years, often placing an equal or even higher value on them than on regular-season games and conference championship games, but that's nonsense.

 

[DenverSooner]

The conference still has the best bowl record of all the major conferences over the past 15 years. That isn't just being propped up by 3-4 teams.

Ole Miss hammered Texas this year. If UT beats Baylor Saturday, they'll have at least a share of the Big 12 title. Ole Miss didn't even finish .500 in the SEC. Just one game, I know, but hard to say the SEC isn't better when stuff like that happens. (Another example: Mississippi State lost to OSU but held them to their lowest point total on the season; OSU puts up 40+ easily on most .500 teams in other conferences.)

And Texas hammered Ole Miss last year. That is one meaningless game. Texas was playing very bad at that time and is playing solid football now.

The majority of bowl games are played in the SEC. SEC teams rarely play a bowl game outside of the SEC region and when they do, they are typically a true neutral game such as an SEC team versus a Big Ten or Big XII team in the Fiesta Bowl. This makes a big difference for two reasons. First, home teams do better in virtually all sports. Second, outside of the biggest bowls, the promoters are setting up games designed to be attractive to the local fans. That means competitive games that the regional team can/should win. Bowls are and always have been slightly biased towards the SEC.

 

[propoke]

The conference still has the best bowl record of all the major conferences over the past 15 years. That isn't just being propped up by 3-4 teams.

Ole Miss hammered Texas this year. If UT beats Baylor Saturday, they'll have at least a share of the Big 12 title. Ole Miss didn't even finish .500 in the SEC. Just one game, I know, but hard to say the SEC isn't better when stuff like that happens. (Another example: Mississippi State lost to OSU but held them to their lowest point total on the season; OSU puts up 40+ easily on most .500 teams in other conferences.)

How many other teams have held Mississippi State to 3 points? Maybe OSU had the best defense MSU faced this year?

 

[tycat947]

But it's the conference that gets hyped, not the individual teams (outside of the top three or four).

Exactly! There is no doubt on this!

 

[Sawyer]

Bowl games are a questionable (at best) standard by which to judge a team or conference. I've said it before, but the bowl season is the twilight zone of college football. Teams have had four to six weeks off. The season's over, nothing is at stake. The players have been distracted for a week by luaus, parties, banquets, and field trips.

The same media that overhypes the SEC has been overhyping bowl games in recent years, often placing an equal or even higher value on them than on regular-season games and conference championship games, but that's nonsense.

Agree on the bowls and almost made that concession earlier (it's how a team like Navy can beat a team like Mizzou despite multiple NFL first rounders on MU's defense that year).

Thing is, there really isn't a good way to make the comparison. OOC games are too infrequent and don't match teams up of similar calibers (the aforementioned Ole Miss/Mississippi State games are sub-.500 SEC teams vs. Big 12 leaders). Any attempt at a comparison is going to be muddled by inconsistent data and subjectivity.

One thing I do know for certain, though: This board was just about unanimous two years ago that Mizzou would get demolished by the big, bad SEC, and WVU and TCU were upgrades. Now that Mizzou is playing for an SEC title, the SEC is overhyped, and there's nary a peep about the Big 12's newest additions.

 

[geeoh]

Not to derail the discussion, but it's worth noting that TCU and KSU got some solid wins for the Big 12 over Miss St and Ole Miss, respectively, last night.

 

[tycat947]

Bowl games are a questionable (at best) standard by which to judge a team or conference. I've said it before, but the bowl season is the twilight zone of college football. Teams have had four to six weeks off. The season's over, nothing is at stake. The players have been distracted for a week by luaus, parties, banquets, and field trips.

The same media that overhypes the SEC has been overhyping bowl games in recent years, often placing an equal or even higher value on them than on regular-season games and conference championship games, but that's nonsense.

There is only ONE bowl game now that really counts and different teams respond to their bowl games differently although they all obviously would like to win. Louisville had a lot more to prove in their bowl game against Florida last year than vice versa. Same with Utah/Alabama a few years back. With a 3 or 4 week layoff between regular season games and bowl games and different outlooks by coaches in what to get accomplished during extra practice time, it's difficult to me to measure one team against the other during bowl games except for the big one. Attendance is terrible at about 80% of the games and I can only imagine what TV ratings were for Ball State-Central Fla and Fresno St-SMU and UL-Lafayette-East Carolina, etc, etc.

 

[tycat947]

One thing I do know for certain, though: This board was just about unanimous two years ago that Mizzou would get demolished by the big, bad SEC, and WVU and TCU were upgrades. Now that Mizzou is playing for an SEC title, the SEC is overhyped, and there's nary a peep about the Big 12's newest additions.

Well, they did last year. Maybe we overestimated the overall strength of the SEC. Who was any good besides Alabama, Auburn, LSU and South Carolina, which MIZ...ZOU lost to.

 

[DenverSooner]

Well, they did last year. Maybe we overestimated the overall strength of the SEC. Who was any good besides Alabama, Auburn, LSU and South Carolina, which MIZ...ZOU lost to.

Missouri is a good football team. Very few teams could lose their QB and keep winning like MIssouri did. I didn't see it coming and I really don't think anyone did but they are a good team.

 

[DenverSooner]

TCU beat Miss St and KSU beat Ole Miss. Unfortunately, Alabama beat Tech. So far the Big XII is putting together a pretty impressive showing against the SEC.

 

[Sawyer]

Well, they did last year. Maybe we overestimated the overall strength of the SEC. Who was any good besides Alabama, Auburn, LSU and South Carolina, which MIZ...ZOU lost to.

We were demolished last year to the tune of an injured quarterback, running back and 4/5 an offensive line.

I would still say Georgia is good. They're losses have been to Clemson, Mizzou, Auburn (on a lucky last-second play) and Vanderbilt, so only one questionable loss.

Florida sucks, but through the first half of the season they were still at least a dangerous team with their defense. They gave up about halfway through the year. I don't know why Muschamp still has a job.

SC beat Mizzou with our backup quarterback. If any blue blood loses a game in those circumstances, they get a pass. With Franklin, we win that game by a couple scores.

Not that I'm really an "SEC is NFL light" proponent anyway. When this board was convinced Mizzou was destined for the cellar every year, I was saying the SEC wasn't that much stronger.

 

[MNsooner]

Not to get this thread back on topic, but OSU beat South Carolina today and Baylor has an lead against Kentucky. This Big 12/SEC challenge could get really lopsided.

 

[Sawyer]

SEC basketball sucks.

Good thing for Haith. He worked magic in year one (until Norfolk State). I'm not sold he'll ever do that again. I like our players (most of them). We'll have enough talent to consistently make the tournament. But the basketball IQ has not impressed me since the end of the 2011-12 season.

 

[MichaelM]

Baylor knocks off Kentucky, 67-62. Big 12 goes to 6-2 in the challenge with Kansas-Florida and OU-A&M still to play. No reason it shouldn't be 8-2 final.

 

[BigTime]

Nice win for Baylor!

 

[OklaSooners]

Big12Conference: Big12MBB is 13-4 (.765) against SEC teams the last two years.

I'm sure that stat will be mentioned on espn pretty soon.

 

[oSuJeff97]

Baylor knocks off Kentucky, 67-62. Big 12 goes to 6-2 in the challenge with Kansas-Florida and OU-A&M still to play. No reason it shouldn't be 8-2 final.

I would be surprised if Kansas won at Florida.

OU should beat A&M.

7-3 is still a pretty solid rear-end kicking.

Now, back to the SEC football discussion.... ?

 

[campbest]

SC beat Mizzou with our backup quarterback. If any blue blood loses a game in those circumstances, they get a pass. With Franklin, we win that game by a couple scores.

...and SC played with their back-up about half the game, then Shaw came in (with no in-week prep) and torched Mizzou's defense.