Bigs and defense.....

[WTSooner]

Does somebody want to tell me why/how Loyola Chicago has a 6'9 freshman big man that is probably better than any big on OU's roster this year, and is better as a true freshman than any OU big has been as a freshman since maybe Bookout (excluding BG)? I feel like OU fans say this every year come this time, but I'm sick of all these other schools having better overall big men than us. I don't get it. KSU has better bigs. UT. WVU. Just doesn't make sense.

Also, they are showing us that there is NO excuse for OU not playing better team defense. That Loyola team isn't a team full of great athletes, yet they play very good, possibly even great defense. How? Because they have a system, and because they play hard. It's that simple. OU is plenty talented enough to put a top 25ish defense on the court. It's not a talent issue. It's also not an experience issue. Loyola has a couple of seniors, but they have juniors and freshman playing considerable time as well.

 

[BCSooners]

Does somebody want to tell me why/how Loyola Chicago has a 6'9 freshman big man that is probably better than any big on OU's roster this year, and is better as a true freshman than any OU big has been as a freshman since maybe Bookout (excluding BG)? I feel like OU fans say this every year come this time, but I'm sick of all these other schools having better overall big men than us. I don't get it. KSU has better bigs. UT. WVU. Just doesn't make sense.

Also, they are showing us that there is NO excuse for OU not playing better team defense. That Loyola team isn't a team full of great athletes, yet they play very good, possibly even great defense. How? Because they have a system, and because they play hard. It's that simple. OU is plenty talented enough to put a top 25ish defense on the court. It's not a talent issue. It's also not an experience issue. Loyola has a couple of seniors, but they have juniors and freshman playing considerable time as well.

I think McNeace will be fine, I think the issues the past 2 years has been the mismatch at the 4 position teams like to exploit. OU hasn't had 1 the past 2 years (I thought Doolittle would've been it this year).

As for defense it just goes to show that 1 bad defender kills a team, OU had 3. Loyola has 5 guys that play hard, smart, team defense. However they do have some pretty good athletes as well.

 

[coolm]

I always wonder if you just shouldnt start every other recruiting class with a Spangler. even years a PG, odd years a spangler.

 

[AdaSooner]

I always wonder if you just shouldnt start every other recruiting class with a Spangler. even years a PG, odd years a spangler.

A Spangler or a TaShawn Thomas. You can’t defend the interior with tall, skinny players who are only good at blocking shots. They get pushed around too much by the beefier players WTSooner is talking about on nearly every team we play.

 

[BCSooners]

I always wonder if you just shouldnt start every other recruiting class with a Spangler. even years a PG, odd years a spangler.

I would take a Spangler every year, can't measure his value through stats (he also had good stats). I think the Cunningham kid that committed to Texas was supposed to be that player for us. Hopefully Doolittle or Manek becomes that but I don't see them having the same traits as Spangler.

 

[Eielson]

We aren't Gonzaga, so we won't be getting a Spangler every year.

 

[WTSooner]

I just want some decently tall/athletic guys that are skilled. Seems like all we've had lately, for the most part, are long guys that have some athleticism. McNeace is solid, but man, outside of him we have nothing.

I liked Spangler's toughness, but OU should be able to recruit better than that. Spangler should be positionless in today's game. Not skilled enough to be a 4, and not big enough to be a 5. On paper, Lon has recruited the kind of guys I'd like to have at the 4/5 spots. But they haven't panned out. Any of them, really. Just tired of seeing skilled athletic bigs on the rosters of all these other schools, but not ours.

 

[oudna]

Does somebody want to tell me why/how Loyola Chicago has a 6'9 freshman big man that is probably better than any big on OU's roster this year, and is better as a true freshman than any OU big has been as a freshman since maybe Bookout (excluding BG)? I feel like OU fans say this every year come this time, but I'm sick of all these other schools having better overall big men than us. I don't get it. KSU has better bigs. UT. WVU. Just doesn't make sense.

Also, they are showing us that there is NO excuse for OU not playing better team defense. That Loyola team isn't a team full of great athletes, yet they play very good, possibly even great defense. How? Because they have a system, and because they play hard. It's that simple. OU is plenty talented enough to put a top 25ish defense on the court. It's not a talent issue. It's also not an experience issue. Loyola has a couple of seniors, but they have juniors and freshman playing considerable time as well.

Ro Osby better than Bookout

 

[Ghost of Gar Heard]

A Spangler or a TaShawn Thomas. You can’t defend the interior with tall, skinny players who are only good at blocking shots. They get pushed around too much by the beefier players WTSooner is talking about on nearly every team we play.

TaShawn Thomas never defended the interior anyway and Lattin and McNeace have.

 

[WTSooner]

Ro Osby better than Bookout

Osby wasn't at OU as a freshman. Read my post.

 

[opsooner]

I agree that a guy like Krutwig from Loyola would be a great benefit to OU. He could probably turn over either shoulder when in HS. Skills and winners are just as important as speed and verticality. You need a mixture of both.

I disagree that KSU has better bigs if you are taking about Mawien or his backup.


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[WTSooner]

I agree that a guy like Krutwig from Loyola would be a great benefit to OU. He could probably turn over either shoulder when in HS. Skills and winners are just as important as speed and verticality. You need a mixture of both.

I disagree that KSU has better bigs if you are taking about Mawien or his backup.


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Well, there is no doubt Wade is a better 4 than any of our 4's or 5's, right?

As for Mawien, you are probably right. I thought he had better "stats" this year than he really did. He is playing pretty well right now though.

 

[opsooner]

I am not sure we really have a 4 on our roster but I would trade any 1-4 we currently have for Wade. I would take McNeace over Mawien any day of the week though. I would probably take Lattin over Mawien. If KSU had a decent 5 and Wade healthy they might be the best team in the country.


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[AdaSooner]

TaShawn Thomas never defended the interior anyway and Lattin and McNeace have.

Thomas averaged 12 points and 7 rebounds per game. McNeace averaged 6.8 and 5.4 last season. Lattin averaged 6.6 and 5.9.

I know which player I would rather see on the floor. I’ll also add that you don’t average 7 rebs per game defending the perimeter. TaShawn spent most of his time inside.

 

[Eielson]

I just want some decently tall/athletic guys that are skilled. Seems like all we've had lately, for the most part, are long guys that have some athleticism. McNeace is solid, but man, outside of him we have nothing.

I liked Spangler's toughness, but OU should be able to recruit better than that. Spangler should be positionless in today's game. Not skilled enough to be a 4, and not big enough to be a 5. On paper, Lon has recruited the kind of guys I'd like to have at the 4/5 spots. But they haven't panned out. Any of them, really. Just tired of seeing skilled athletic bigs on the rosters of all these other schools, but not ours.

Hahahaha....what??

I know these last two years have been brutal, but not much time has actually passed.

 

[oudna]

Osby wasn't at OU as a freshman. Read my post.

But still a good big. Whether they are good or not “as freshmen” seem trivial.

I don’t care if they are all transfers as long as they can play

 

[WTSooner]

Hahahaha....what??

I know these last two years have been brutal, but not much time has actually passed.

He is/was an under-sized, under-talented guy that could play one position, the four. The game is more spread out now, so 4's need to be able to do things that guards do. Spangler couldn't do that. OU "got by" because we had a guard that basically had one of the best three point shooting seasons in the history of college sports.

To be fair, and I liked him, Bookout would be the same way. Not really big enough to be a 5, but not versatile enough to be a good 4. Good offensive game, but only from about 5 feet and in. Clogs things up, especially if you are playing him at the 4 next to a 5 that has the same limitations.

JMO.

 

[sperry]

He is/was an under-sized, under-talented guy that could play one position, the four. The game is more spread out now, so 4's need to be able to do things that guards do. Spangler couldn't do that. OU "got by" because we had a guard that basically had one of the best three point shooting seasons in the history of college sports.

To be fair, and I liked him, Bookout would be the same way. Not really big enough to be a 5, but not versatile enough to be a good 4. Good offensive game, but only from about 5 feet and in. Clogs things up, especially if you are playing him at the 4 next to a 5 that has the same limitations.

JMO.

Spangler could absolutely spread the floor. He was bombing 3s at a good percentage by his senior year.

 

[WTSooner]

But still a good big. Whether they are good or not “as freshmen” seem trivial.

I don’t care if they are all transfers as long as they can play

It wasn't trivial to the point I was making at the time.

OU shouldn't need to be in a position to constantly wait on bigs until their JR/SR seasons before they are worth anything at all, especially when other schools have true freshman bigs that are out playing our JR/SR guys. That was my point.

 

[Ghost of Gar Heard]

Thomas averaged 12 points and 7 rebounds per game. McNeace averaged 6.8 and 5.4 last season. Lattin averaged 6.6 and 5.9.

I know which player I would rather see on the floor. I’ll also add that you don’t average 7 rebs per game defending the perimeter. TaShawn spent most of his time inside.

You said you liked Thomas because of his defense inside. Thomas was a poor defensive player. He scored, yes, but was awful defensively and completely refuted the point you were trying to make. Both Lattin and McNeace were/are MUCH better defensively.