Bill Self at Jeff Capels age ...

[bocabull]

Had just ended his first season at Tulsa. Had never been to the NCAA tournament. Had 1 NIT first round loss on his resume. Overall record of 74-66.

Capel has taken VCU and OU to the NCAA tournament 3 times. Has an elite 8 on his resume. Has coached a team USA U18 team to a championship. Overall record 163-93.

A smart person will analyze as much data as they can gather. Other people will cherry pick data to fit their argument. Of course smart people are right far more often.

 

[NickZepp]

And he coached at ORU and Tulsa for one year. After 9 years as a coach Bill Self had taken 4 straight teams to the NCAA Tournament, 2 Elite 8s and 1 Sweet 16. This is Jeff Capel's 9th year as a head coach and he's won 20 games 3 times in those 9 years.

 

[mardaddy51]

Had just ended his first season at Tulsa. Had never been to the NCAA tournament. Had 1 NIT first round loss on his resume. Overall record of 74-66.

Capel has taken VCU and OU to the NCAA tournament 3 times. Has an elite 8 on his resume. Has coached a team USA U18 team to a championship. Overall record 163-93.

A smart person will analyze as much data as they can gather. Other people will cherry pick data to fit their argument. Of course smart people are right far more often.

This post isn't accurate, because according to most in this board, the Blake Griffin years don't count. Capel deserves times to right the wrong of last year and the trouble to come of the OT and Gallon incident.

 

[NickZepp]

You can't compare coaches ages because some coaches start coaching later in life. For example John Wooden didn't start as a head coach till he was 35. Bob Knight started at 24. Bill Self was about 30 when he started as a head coach, Capel was 26.

 

[coolm]

IMO Boca has a good point regarding JC's future, not OU's

 

[bocabull]

Bill Self coached at ORU and Tulsa for 7 years before taking over the loaded program at Illinois Lon Kruger left him.

Even though Capel took over a team on probation without a single all conference caliber player on the roster, and is 3 years younger through his 9th season as a head coach ...

both Self and Capel through 9 seasons have been to the NCAA tournament 3 times and the NIT once.

 

[Sooner04]

both Self and Capel through 9 seasons have been to the NCAA tournament 3 times and the NIT once.

Not trying to stir the pot here, but two questions.

1. How many losing seasons had Self endured through this point?

2. How was the player attrition at Self's two programs through this point?

 

[CoachTalk]

Had just ended his first season at Tulsa. Had never been to the NCAA tournament. Had 1 NIT first round loss on his resume. Overall record of 74-66.

Capel has taken VCU and OU to the NCAA tournament 3 times. Has an elite 8 on his resume. Has coached a team USA U18 team to a championship. Overall record 163-93.

A smart person will analyze as much data as they can gather. Other people will cherry pick data to fit their argument. Of course smart people are right far more often.

+1

 

[CoachTalk]

This post isn't accurate, because according to most in this board, the Blake Griffin years don't count. Capel deserves times to right the wrong of last year and the trouble to come of the OT and Gallon incident.

TEABAG

:teabag

 

[bocabull]

Not trying to stir the pot here, but two questions.

1. How many losing seasons had Self endured through this point?

2. How was the player attrition at Self's two programs through this point?

Both Capel and Self have 2 losing seasons in the first 9.

Don't know on Self's player attrition in his first 9. Probably no problem at Illinois because he took over a well oiled machine. Capel has been scrambling since day 1 at OU so the attrition is to be expected.

Let's face it. We all thought when we had WW, TMG and Tiny coming in after Blake that Capel has this puppy on autopilot. Some unfortunate things happened that got him scrambling again. But we are in good shape for next season which could turn into great shape with a couple more additions.

 

[NickZepp]

Bill Self coached at ORU and Tulsa for 7 years before taking over the loaded program at Illinois Lon Kruger left him.

Even though Capel took over a team on probation without a single all conference caliber player on the roster, and is 3 years younger through his 9th season as a head coach ...

both Self and Capel through 9 seasons have been to the NCAA tournament 3 times and the NIT once.

Again, get your stats right when you are taking a more fair comparison.

After 9 years as a coach Bill Self had been to 4 straight NCAA Tournaments and 2 Elite 8s and 1 Sweet 16. He had won 9 NCAA Tournament games.

 

[bocabull]

Not trying to stir the pot here, but two questions.

1. How many losing seasons had Self endured through this point?

2. How was the player attrition at Self's two programs through this point?

And 04, my main point is that, from my experience, a person makes the greatest strides in intelligence and experience from age 35-45 in their life. At 35 people think they know what's what but they have about a 20% knowledge of the way things work. At 45 that 20% becomes about 80%.

 

[Sooner04]

I understand both sides of the argument, boca. I can see many reasons to keep Jeff and I can see many reasons to turn him loose.

The biggest worry I have about his performance is his inability to fill out a roster, and that goes back to inefficient recruiting. There have been so many busts and bad apples.

 

[NickZepp]

Bill Self after 9 years had 5 20 win seasons

Jeff Capel after 9 years has 3 20 win seasons

Bill Self after 9 years never had a losing conference record. It helped a lot that Oral Roberts was an independent when he coached there. But still never had a losing conference record as a coach. The lowest amount of wins he's had in a conference is 9 at Tulsa twice. Also never finished lower than 3rd in a conference

Jeff Capel has had a 3 losing seasons and has finished lower than 3rd 5 times in 9 years.

Bill Self's postseason record after 9 years: 9-5

Jeff Capel's postseason record after 9 years: 4-4

 

[bocabull]

Nick, you are like the climate deniers. You are searching for facts to back up a desired outcome instead of gathering as much data as possible and letting that data point you in the right direction.

 

[bocabull]

I understand both sides of the argument, boca. I can see many reasons to keep Jeff and I can see many reasons to turn him loose.

The biggest worry I have about his performance is his inability to fill out a roster, and that goes back to inefficient recruiting. There have been so many busts and bad apples.

Valid worry. Next season the data needs to show at least a winning conference record and trip to the dance. Only a modest improvement will correlate with the last two seasons and begin to override the previous success.

 

[NickZepp]

Nick, you are like the climate deniers. You are searching for facts to back up a desired outcome instead of gathering as much data as possible and letting that data point you in the right direction.

Kinda funny when you are trying to do the exact same thing. That's like saying Bob Knights a better coach than John Wooden because he had more wins and championships by the age of 50 or something like that. It's a stupid comparison.

 

[Sooner04]

Valid worry. Next season the data needs to show at least a winning conference record and trip to the dance. Only a modest improvement will correlate with the last two seasons and begin to override the previous success.

I'm down with that. There'll be 18 conference games next season. Plenty of time and room to show improvement.

 

[NickZepp]

Valid worry. Next season the data needs to show at least a winning conference record and trip to the dance. Only a modest improvement will correlate with the last two seasons and begin to override the previous success.

I think this is where we pretty much agree. If we don't make the NCAA Tournament next year Jeff is probably gone.

 

[okcsooner83]

Where is the talent to get OU a winning conference record?