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You place way too much stock into our "democracy" as it stands today. It is seriously flawed and misunderstood. The fix to most problems (in my opinion) is MORE democracy, and we have been going with LESS democracy. The powers that be don't want real democracy, especially at the federal level.

Democracy dies when you stagnate... it dies when you openly discourage it. It dies when you don't do everything in your power to encourage it. It dies when what the people want is ignored, neglected, etc. It dies when it's not constantly expanded.

Changing rules doesn't kill democracy. Defending the status quo doesn't kill democracy.

I recommend the following books on this. I have read a few of these multiple times. Very good reads.

  • Democracy and its Critics, by Robert Dahl
  • Direct Democracy and the Courts, by Kenneth Miller
  • Direct Democracy. The Politics of Initiative, Referendum, and Recall. By Thomas Cronin
  • Swiss Democracy, by Vincent Kucholl
  • Retained by the People, by Dan Farber

I agree that the people don't have enough say.
Nothing that has been proposed by the left or the right does anything to combat that.

The issue is the US is too large for a democracy/republic to really work.
 
It's not illegal, unethical, or immoral.

Is it?

I'd argue changing something that has been in place and isn't really broken, ONLY b/c it isn't currently benefiting your party, is a bit unethical, yes.

I'd never heard a word about doing away with the electoral college until the dems lost an election put won the popular vote.

I'd never heard a word about increasing the number of SC judges until this last week.

So yes.....I'd say that is a bit unethical. It ain't broken.....it's just not producing the results YOU and your party want at the moment.
 
I'd argue changing something that has been in place and isn't really broken, ONLY b/c it isn't currently benefiting your party, is a bit unethical, yes.

I'd never heard a word about doing away with the electoral college until the dems lost an election put won the popular vote.

I'd never heard a word about increasing the number of SC judges until this last week.

So yes.....I'd say that is a bit unethical. It ain't broken.....it's just not producing the results YOU and your party want at the moment.

Sitting on a nomination & not putting it to a vote for 12 months is broken. If the vote happened and it was voted down then okay I can understand that.

The electoral college has been discussed as out of date since the early 2000s that I can remember, might be longer than that.

9 people on a judges decision puts too much power with each nomination, needs to be balanced out. Just common sense.
 
Sitting on a nomination & not putting it to a vote for 12 months is broken. If the vote happened and it was voted down then okay I can understand that.

The electoral college has been discussed as out of date since the early 2000s that I can remember, might be longer than that.

9 people on a judges decision puts too much power with each nomination, needs to be balanced out. Just common sense.

I agree that the nomination process could use tweaking.
People have *****ed about the EC for two reasons. Their side lost or they don't understand why it is needed. It is a lack of education.
I am not opposed to more judges in theory. I'm worried about the precedence it would set.

But reallly...lets be honest. These changes only get brought up out of sour grapes. Not because of the common good of the country. I'm opposed in changing something just because one party lost. If the SC needed more judges, why didn't the dems propose it when they had power?

If Trump wins again, you think the dems will push for more SC justices? no:ez-laugh:
 
I agree that the nomination process could use tweaking.
People have *****ed about the EC for two reasons. Their side lost or they don't understand why it is needed. It is a lack of education.
I am not opposed to more judges in theory. I'm worried about the precedence it would set.

But reallly...lets be honest. These changes only get brought up out of sour grapes. Not because of the common good of the country. I'm opposed in changing something just because one party lost. If the SC needed more judges, why didn't the dems propose it when they had power?

If Trump wins again, you think the dems will push for more SC justices? no:ez-laugh:

Burma, Burundi, Estonia, India, Madagascar, Nepal, Pakistan, Trinidad & Tobago, Vanuata, & Vatican City are the only other countries that use EC. Not an impressive group. The EC basically means only votes in swing states matter.

It's not sour grapes, it's a reaction because McConnell sat on a vote for 12 months. Even if it is reactionary it would still benefit the country to have more SC judges with more diverse views.
 
Burma, Burundi, Estonia, India, Madagascar, Nepal, Pakistan, Trinidad & Tobago, Vanuata, & Vatican City are the only other countries that use EC. Not an impressive group. The EC basically means only votes in swing states matter.

It's not sour grapes, it's a reaction because McConnell sat on a vote for 12 months. Even if it is reactionary it would still benefit the country to have more SC judges with more diverse views.

Clearly, you might need some education on why the US uses the EC.

And I have a hard time even believing your list b/c you placed Vatican City on there lol
 
Sitting on a nomination & not putting it to a vote for 12 months is broken. If the vote happened and it was voted down then okay I can understand that.

The electoral college has been discussed as out of date since the early 2000s that I can remember, might be longer than that.

9 people on a judges decision puts too much power with each nomination, needs to be balanced out. Just common sense.

Take that up with biden.. and to the founders...

The senate "advised and consented" by NOT setting a vote via thr biden rule. You wanted the repubs to willfully ignore biden?
 
Burma, Burundi, Estonia, India, Madagascar, Nepal, Pakistan, Trinidad & Tobago, Vanuata, & Vatican City are the only other countries that use EC. Not an impressive group. The EC basically means only votes in swing states matter.

It's not sour grapes, it's a reaction because McConnell sat on a vote for 12 months. Even if it is reactionary it would still benefit the country to have more SC judges with more diverse views.

So get out the vote and communicate a better platform to a base and turn a state into a swing state??
 
That shouldn't be relevant. Either the president has that right in their final year or they don't. Owning the senate should not be an obligation.

So you're unilaterally taking away the senates role in advising and consenting? They advised that they weren't going to set a vote via the biden rule.. system worked.. thanks Biden
 
There is no "Biden rule." That's just some bull$hit Moscow Mitch McConnell made up to justify his own stunningly dishonest hypocrisy.

https://www.politifact.com/article/2020/sep/21/context-there-biden-rule-supreme-court-nominations/

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2016/03/there-is-no-biden-rule-explained.html

"is my view that if a Supreme Court Justice resigns tomorrow, or within the next several weeks, or resigns at the end of the summer, President Bush should consider following the practice of a majority of his predecessors and not—and not—name a nominee until after the November election is completed.
The Senate, too, Mr. President, must consider how it would respond to a Supreme Court vacancy that would occur in the full throes of an election year. It is my view that if the President goes the way of Presidents Fillmore and Johnson and presses an election-year nomination, the Senate Judiciary Committee should seriously consider not scheduling confirmation hearings on the nomination until after the political campaign season is over."

Note all the caveats that Biden peppers throughout that brief passage: “it is my view,” “should consider,” “must consider,” “should seriously consider,” etc. Yes, Biden’s judiciary gavel gave his words considerably more weight, but it is clear that he was stating a preference, not setting precedent. Also note that Biden was talking specifically about a vacancy created by a resignation in an election year (something more likely to be politically motivated, or at least pre-planned) and not a vacancy created by someone’s death, as was the case when Antonin Scalia died in his sleep at a Texas hunting lodge last month. There’s also the not incidental fact that Biden specifically left the door open for a lame-duck confirmation—something McConnell and Republicans have explicitly ruled out this time around. Even if there were a Biden Rule, it’s clear McConnell and co. would only be following the portions of it that benefit them.
 
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I agree that the people don't have enough say.
Nothing that has been proposed by the left or the right does anything to combat that.

The issue is the US is too large for a democracy/republic to really work.

Alright, you caught me in something I have a heavy interest in, so I can't resist getting all philosophical on you here.

I just don't agree with that... I think we have outgrown and become too diverse our current model, but most people believe it to be so sacred that they are scared to reform it.

Our system was brilliant and changed the world, don't get me wrong, but we are too diverse for it. Also, packing most of the population into two political parties is toxic, divisive, and ineffective as well.

The fix, in my opinion, is a proper system of representation. A diverse society needs proper representation in government.

Norway is always such a good case study for Democracy, because they are so well setup. They are a small country, but they had 8 political parties qualify for representation in their government.

They have 169 seats in their parliament.

The conservative party has 45 seats
The christian democratic party has 8 seats
The labour party has 49 seats
The centre party has 19 seats
The progress party has 26 seats
The socialist party has 11 seats
The green party has a seat
The red party has a seat
Etc....

Their population, though not NEARLY as diverse as ours, has proper political representation in government. This is also true in Canada, Germany, France, Sweden, Italy, etc. Most of the free world has a proper system of representation. We just don't.

If we wanted our government.... OF THE PEOPLE, BY THE PEOPLE, and FOR THE PEOPLE to be properly represented, we would probably have something like this:

The Conservative Party
The Liberal Party
The Progressive Party
The Tea Party
The Green Party
The Libertarian Party
The Moderate Party

Whatever... but one of the keys to a good democracy is proper representation in government. We just don't have that. We are way too big and way too diverse for our current 2 party system. We need an overhaul, badly.

This concept that other countries use to achieve better/proper representation is called "Proportional Representation".. Basically you have a lot of active political parties, and however the votes fall you earn representation. Parties that don't receive enough votes to meet the threshold don't get representation. It's not winner take all like ours. The more votes you get, the more representation in government you have. Ours is... If Ted Cruz wins by 0.1% in Texas, he represents ALL of Texas.

Ted Cruz and John Cornyn are the political representation for Texas. They are both Republicans. The 40% of the population of Texas that voted against John Cornyn has NO political representation in government. The 48% of Texans that voted against Ted Cruz in Texas have NO political representation in government.

Think about that... nearly half the citizens of Texas have zero political representation in government. That's why the rest of the free world does something different.

And, in fact, John Adams was one of the first to suggest it.

"It should be in miniature, an exact portrait of the people at large. It should think, feel, reason, and act like them. That it may be the interest of this Assembly to do strict justice at all times, it should be an equal representation, or in other words equal interest among the people should have equal interest in it"
-John Adams, 1776

"A representative body is to the nation what a chart is for the physical configuration of its soil: in all its parts, and as a whole, the representative body should at all times present a reduced picture of the people, their opinions, aspirations, and wishes, and that presentation should bear the relative proportion to the original precisely."
-Gabriel Riqueti, one of the leaders of the French Revolution
 
Clearly, you might need some education on why the US uses the EC.

And I have a hard time even believing your list b/c you placed Vatican City on there lol

I know why they do, it's outdated.

Vatican City is a country that uses the EC. Those are the only countries that uses them, so I don't get how you have a hare time believing it.
 
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Moscow Mitch? Should we now say Moscow Biden? Hunter linked to Russia, Communist China, and sex trafficking

What office is Hunter seeking? Oh and he's not been "linked" to any of that so get some better sources.
 
Take that up with biden.. and to the founders...

The senate "advised and consented" by NOT setting a vote via thr biden rule. You wanted the repubs to willfully ignore biden?

The founders? Yeah because laws & practices haven't changed since then.
 
Mict085 you seem awfully hung up on nonexistent sex trafficking. You wouldn't be one of those people that believes the Qanon grift are you?
 
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