Is Oklahoma cooked as a program?

[Boom Soon]

We're not "cooked" as a program, but I do have one frightening thought. Let's say there was an internet poll with this question: "Which Power school football fan base would be most likely to approve reallocating ALL basketball NIL money toward football?" I'm scared to ask this, but would Oklahoma win?

Very good question. I think a lot of “basketball schools” absolutely would become football schools if they had the opportunity. Arkansas comes to mind

 

[Eielson]

Lolol

"In Moser's tenure, the Redbirds were never higher than the No. 6 seed at the State Farm Missouri Valley Conference Tournament and finished as the No. 10 seed twice. In league play, the Redbirds compiled a 22-50 (.306) mark in Valley games under Moser - the lowest four-year mark since Illinois State joined the conference in 1981."

IT'S THE EXACT SAME STUFF

To be fair, they won 8 games the year prior to him taking over, and were projected highly going into the season after he was fired. Jankovic took over his roster and had a 25 win season. You could say it's better X's and O's, but Jankovic got worse every year and is no longer in coaching, so hard to argue he didn't benefit from Moser's roster.

This stop hasn't worked out at all, but it'll be the first program he left in a worse state than he inherited in.

Based on the lack of results despite talent this year, I don't think there's a scenario where Moser would have knocked it out of the park, but I do wonder if he'd have done better in an era without the transfer portal and NIL. Previously, guys like Oweh and Uzan wouldn't have been able to leave as easily.

Some people like to mock the importance of culture, citing it as irrelevant, but unlike football, nobody actually stays in basketball. Most of our players and coaches stay for one year, and we're lucky to get two. Some coaches don't even last a full season. Nobody is staying 3-4 years like football or in his previous stops.

I'd actually argue that the complete lack of culture is a big part of what doomed Moser. To be fair, I don't know if any basketball guys can keep players around without the type of money we utilize in football. Moving forward, the emphasis has to be on finding a guy that can implement things with a completely flipped over roster every year. 3-4 year development plans won't work.

 

[AnotherSoonerInTX]

We're not "cooked" as a program, but I do have one frightening thought. Let's say there was an internet poll with this question: "Which Power school football fan base would be most likely to approve reallocating ALL basketball NIL money toward football?" I'm scared to ask this, but would Oklahoma win?

Ohio State might give us a run for our money on that...but I'm sure their basketball attendance is bigger than ours. Their fan base is bigger.

 

[AnotherSoonerInTX]

Very good question. I think a lot of “basketball schools” absolutely would become football schools if they had the opportunity. Arkansas comes to mind

Indiana is doing that as we speak. They haven't won a hoops NC since 1987, and they haven't been to a Final Four since they beat us in 2002. They're still considered a blueblood in basketball, though that's more like Nebraska's status in football: past glory. They are favored to win a football NC tomorrow night.

 

[AnotherSoonerInTX]

I think people understate the disappointment and damage done immediately following the Final Four team. I’m not absolving Moser at all. If you coach for five years at a P5 school and make the tourney once with a very poor overall conf record, you aren’t doing a good job, period. But to follow up the F4 when you have some real momentum with five underwhelming/kinda boring/underperforming teams, it has residual effects. The mass exodus of fans began prior to Moser.

I truly view the Lon years in two parts… the first part was excellent. The exact type of ascension you want to see. The second part was not good, and it left the program in a bit of a weird spot. Almost completely out of the consciousness. Then, it appears we hired the wrong guy to set it all straight.

I agree with premise of the post… 10 years matters. It’s too long to just now assume it can be easily rekindled.

I cannot describe how much we left on the floor in Houston 10 years ago with the 40 point blowout at the Final Four. It's as if all of the program's momentum went away that day.

 

[vbdad]

Joe C. has a ruined a great basketball program. I’d love to check the basketball record from the beginning of his time and the 26 years before his arrival. And Kelvin had it rolling when he became AD. Also despite winning a football national championship in his third year OU hams its longest drought in school history. Nice work Joe!

 

[Soonerinkc]

I’ve posted on a lot of FB groups….

OU at one time had the longest post season streak in the country…

Longer than ku, uk, unc, Indiana, ucla, duke … all the blue bloods.

OU SHOULD be in the tourney 8/10 years at the least. Moser isn’t it.

I’d like to see OU win a NC in bball. Hell, men’s or women’s… lol. It’s been a long time since 1988…and we were so close. With that said I just want us in the tourney consistently.

 

[Soonerinkc]

I cannot describe how much we left on the floor in Houston 10 years ago with the 40 point blowout at the Final Four. It's as if all of the program's momentum went away that day.

That game was one of the most embarrassing shows ever

 

[AnotherSoonerInTX]

Some people like to mock the importance of culture, citing it as irrelevant, but unlike football, nobody actually stays in basketball. Most of our players and coaches stay for one year, and we're lucky to get two. Some coaches don't even last a full season. Nobody is staying 3-4 years like football or in his previous stops.

I'd actually argue that the complete lack of culture is a big part of what doomed Moser. To be fair, I don't know if any basketball guys can keep players around without the type of money we utilize in football. Moving forward, the emphasis has to be on finding a guy that can implement things with a completely flipped over roster every year. 3-4 year development plans won't work.

I'm not saying hire a junior college coach, because junior college ball is not what it was 20-30-40 years ago. But those coaches learned how to flip rosters long before anyone else. They never have a player longer than two years.

That's big-time college basketball now.

 

[WaymanFan]

That game was one of the most embarrassing shows ever

Sadly, that's not an overstatement since OU suffered the most lopsided Final Four loss in NCAA history. I thought it was destiny that we'd cut down the nets since it was the 50th anniversary of the most "important" NCAA game of all time - and our starting center was the grandson of the best player on that winning team. Our #1 highlight since that game was sending three players to the NBA who may all end up having "distinguished" careers. Since Blake Griffin is now doing Wayfair commercials, perhaps the next head coach can find a way to utilize these names (along with some decent NIL money) to bring some talent to Norman.

 

[cvangild]

We're not "cooked" as a program, but I do have one frightening thought. Let's say there was an internet poll with this question: "Which Power school football fan base would be most likely to approve reallocating ALL basketball NIL money toward football?" I'm scared to ask this, but would Oklahoma win?

There are SEVERAL morons on the On3 site who are serious about it, and bring it up all the time (well, after every loss)...which has been frequent as of late. That's never going to happen, so not sure why they feel the need to constantly bring it up. I don't need some "fan" who doesn't care for b-ball telling me where my NIL donations need to be going.

Growing up in the 80's/90's, OU b-ball was on top of the world for about 6-7 seasons. We were a top 3 seed in the tourney several times..and were a 1 seed a handful of times as well. It's what got me hooked on OU b-ball. I'd do anything (well almost) to get back to that level. For now, I'll settle for a change in guard and hopefully land someone who can at least get us in the tourney 4 of 5 years...let's worry about seeding later.

 

[jdizzle34]

If they keep Moser, then they are not a serious program. That is what this offseason will show.

 

[steverocks35]

If it was, would anyone at OU care?

 

[WaymanFan]

There are SEVERAL morons on the On3 site who are serious about it, and bring it up all the time (well, after every loss)...which has been frequent as of late. That's never going to happen, so not sure why they feel the need to constantly bring it up. I don't need some "fan" who doesn't care for b-ball telling me where my NIL donations need to be going.

Growing up in the 80's/90's, OU b-ball was on top of the world for about 6-7 seasons. We were a top 3 seed in the tourney several times..and were a 1 seed a handful of times as well. It's what got me hooked on OU b-ball. I'd do anything (well almost) to get back to that level. For now, I'll settle for a change in guard and hopefully land someone who can at least get us in the tourney 4 of 5 years...let's worry about seeding later.

I'm right there with you, except older since I remember Alvan Adams at OU. I wasn't exactly excited when we got Tubbs because I know they made a run at John Thompson. When we beat KSU and Rolando Blackmon during Tubbs second season (on ESPN), I started to think we had something special. The next season started an 8-year run which we played at a national power level as you alluded to. The beginning of the end of Tubbs tenure came when OU brought in a guy to clean up the academics (Thomas Hill - his son played for Duke) and it exposed Tubbs going overboard with JUCO players with suspect academic credentials. Despite a great first season in the Kelvin Sampson era, it took him awhile to build the program back up...but he always kept us competitive. By the time he left OU, we had the nation's longest consecutive postseason streak at 25 years. We were a damn good program! I want it to where we are at least highly competitive most games and at least make the NCAA 3 out of every 4 years.

 

[Boom Soon]

wasn’t there great fan turn out for the women’s team today?

 

[pnkranger]

Yep -- win consistently, be competitive within the conference, and give people hope that we can make the tournament, and people will show up. It has happened for Moser too. We have a great non-con, everyone shows up, and we **** the bed against a middle-tier team in the conference at home. Then we lose two in a row on the road, and everyone's like, "oh, we've already seen this movie."

 

[BoulderSooner]

I completed graduate school at OU in 1997. After, for more than a decade, I'd spend most of my vacation days ( 5 for the first 5 years and then 10 for the next 5) watching the Thursday / Friday games of the tournament's first 2 weekends. Basketball was fun! Even when the wins weren't coming, we had a tough and competitive team. OU was a consensus top 20 all-time program.

I no longer have interest, and the reason why is as follows:

- OU has had 4 ranked teams since 2007, Capel's first year.
- 4 in 20 seasons!! Only 20% of 2 the last 2 decades!
- They include 2 top 10 ( 7 and 7), 1 top 15 (13), and 1 top 25 (21).
- OU is in its 10th straight unranked season.

i guess you mean only in the final poll ?

because OU has been ranked way way more then that ..

 

[BoulderSooner]

I will also say .. under Joe C the OU admin has showed by their actions that they don't care about OU basketball

eventually the fans notice that .. and think if they don't "why should we"

 

[Soonerguy06]

wasn’t there great fan turn out for the women’s team today?

Sure was, sold out crowd only for the girls to play some of the worst basketball I've seen all season. This women's team has also been a huge disappointment and I blame the coaching staff. Any coach that loses as much as that team did to the portal and graduation and does not bring in any portal players and instead relies only on returning, inexperienced players and freshmen deserves to have the type of season they are having now. She failed that team so now both Sooner basketball teams are in the gutter. Not sure if either of them can turn it around before the season's over.

 

[WichitaSooner]

Sure was, sold out crowd only for the girls to play some of the worst basketball I've seen all season. This women's team has also been a huge disappointment and I blame the coaching staff. Any coach that loses as much as that team did to the portal and graduation and does not bring in any portal players and instead relies only on returning, inexperienced players and freshmen deserves to have the type of season they are having now. She failed that team so now both Sooner basketball teams are in the gutter. Not sure if either of them can turn it around before the season's over.

I think there is a pretty big difference between the two programs. The women are clearly not close to the level of the upper tier programs. There are a handful of women’s team that are well clear of the rest of the field, and OU isn’t there yet. I think it’s fair to wonder if they can get there with the frantic style they play. You need to have a lot of players with a really high IQ and really high skill level to pull that off. When they play teams that are more talented and more physical, that style of play leads to blowout losses, especially if they don’t shoot well. But all that said, they are a top 25 team every year and make the tournament easily. That’s not close to being in the gutter. And remember how badly things had fallen off in the last few years before she was hired. But they do need to evaluate whether they think they can get over the hump with this style, because turning the ball over like crazy is a tough way to compete against the best teams.