Is OU better than the team projected 10th?

[campbest]

There is more to winning basketball games than the stat line reads. Picks, help defense, hustle, etc. Dennis Rodman wasn't a scorer at any level he played. But based on the fact that he didn't average a lot of points, a lot of block shots, and that he was undersized he wouldn't make ADB's junior high team.

Except he rebounded...a lot.

i had no "pub" or anyone thinking i was going to do much because i never got the chance in middle school and my parents didnt play the politics but then i went to high school and was a 3 year starter and all stater

lol.

 

[thebigabd]

we are oklahoma, we are a top 20 program, capel got us to a great level that i hadnt seen in a while but then we took in some players that didnt mesh.. simple as that

but nevermind im sure the powerhouse that is ne-freakin-braska

First of all, Capel is just 2-2 against Nebraska with an average margin of defeat of 18 points. Thats right, Nebraska has beat Capel by 18 points twice. Not just winning, but they have run OU out of the gym twice. So lets not act all holier than thou against Doc Sadler or the Huskers.

secondly, this dude talks about players that he has never even seen.. ADC says that Nebbish's PG will be better than ours? who cares.. the guys knows nothing about our new pg's.. i dont either.. however, i expect them to do good because we are on a higher level than neb

They have a Big 12 All Newcomer who was pretty solid last year and a guy who led a Pac-10 team in Assists for two years. WHY is it so much of a stretch to assume their pg's might be better than OU's?

Reading back through the posts it seems everyone is comparing OU to Nebraska (which was the title) or saying you are overvaluing Nebraska (which was your 1st post). Exactly what are people doing wrong.

Right, what I meant by that is that this is who OU is competing with and you guys are getting angry for even comparing OU to Nebraska. You guys think OU is too good to be compared to Nebraska, but this is who we are slated to compete with for positioning this year. Thats what makes the thread AND comparison legit.

look at Cade

What about him?

I knew that keiton page would play at osu because i PLAYED against him.. you should love his numbers he put up in high school.. o wait.. didnt play juco

Keiton Page is big time. 95% of big time players in the country are high school guys. I dont think jucos are the only good players, lol. I just appreciate what they have done for OU's program and think that OU needs to take the best jucos along with the best high school talent they can get like they used to.

 

[campbest]

They have a Big 12 All Newcomer who was pretty solid last year and a guy who led a Pac-10 team in Assists for two years. WHY is it so much of a stretch to assume their pg's might be better than OU's?

Seriously doubt he knew this...probably didn't do his homework.

 

[hoopsaustin]

First of all, Capel is just 2-2 against Nebraska with an average margin of defeat of 18 points. Thats right, Nebraska has beat Capel by 18 points twice. Not just winning, but they have run OU out of the gym twice. So lets not act all holier than thou against Doc Sadler or the Huskers.

who cares? they won two games on us, it happens, its basketball.. capel had a 5 game win streak on osu and still overall.. so according to you that means OU is way > osu

Right, what I meant by that is that this is who OU is competing with and you guys are getting angry for even comparing OU to Nebraska. You guys think OU is too good to be compared to Nebraska, but this is who we are slated to compete with for positioning this year. Thats what makes the thread AND comparison legit.

who cares what we are slated to do.. i dont give a crap about polls.. never have never will...

What about him?

his importance is measured by more than stats and you are obsessed with stats.. who cares that doesnt always make a player good or not

Keiton Page is big time. 95% of big time players in the country are high school guys. I dont think jucos are the only good players, lol. I just appreciate what they have done for OU's program and think that OU needs to take the best jucos along with the best high school talent they can get like they used to.

ya like patillo, cannon, allen.. jucos are different now with prep schools.. the best players capel has had are high school players.. i didnt even want CJ or nick thompson when we got them because i didnt think they will be good.. but capel wanted them.. he has SEEN them play.. he didnt just look at stats from high school..

hows that stud Shane Harris-trunks from CU pimping of yours paying off? 1.8ppg, .3a, 1.6rpg, .5bl, .5st... all you do is list every single player from every bad team in the big 12 so that way one will be good and you can see i told you so.. i know basketball..

i think this team will suprise with blair and newell, TJT and cam, i hope that fitz and pledge will improve greatly and im getting tired of you saying that we are complete garbage, if you think so.. leave, its gay you talking up all of these teams at the expense of ours

 

[thebigabd]

who cares? they won two games on us, it happens, its basketball.. capel had a 5 game win streak on osu and still overall.. so according to you that means OU is way > osu

I was just pointing out that the comparison isnt silly. 2-2 record with them, and they are projecting right next to OU in the polls.

who cares what we are slated to do.. i dont give a crap about polls.. never have never will...

I care.

i didnt even want CJ or nick thompson when we got them because i didnt think they will be good.. but capel wanted them.. he has SEEN them play

Capel wanted them after Aziz Ndaiye, Jawanza Poland, and Marquise Carter went elsewhere. You would have wanted those jucos. Now, he signed a starter and captain in Nick Thompson and I am excited to see him play.

i think this team will suprise with blair and newell, TJT and cam, i hope that fitz and pledge will improve greatly and im getting tired of you saying that we are complete garbage, if you think so.. leave, its gay you talking up all of these teams at the expense of ours

Im not talking up any team... I am comparing OU to the teams that OU is projected to compete with.

Thats great that you think this team will surprise. Thats awesome. Its terrific. Its wonderful. Kudos to you. That doesnt mean that you have to go nuts when somebody has a different opinion than you, or says something you dont like.

 

[Sam]

I haven't been able to respond to this post with the time I have wanted to so I am going to dive into a few things.

First this is a weird thread, why was it needed? Shouldn't this have just been a responses to BT's 11th in the conference thread. Seems to fit the same subject matter and was started about 40 minutes after BT's thread had been up. Perhaps you had been planing a thread like this and it was just pure coincidence but it seems weird.

It just comes off as instead of really comparing Nebraska vs OU (as much as it pains me to say it, it is a legit point in this preseason) you wanted it to be known as your thread. I don't start a counter point thread when I disagree with on the many things as we tend to do because we have different personalities and viewpoints as that is human nature. I just add into your thread because that is typical message board procedure. Maybe I shouldn't because this thread screams "I want people to notice me" and I'm only fueling your ego.

I wont change my opinion for the sake of fake optimism. But, I think this board needs a different opinion, outside of "OU IS AWESOME!". Without differing opinions and someone willing and able to be negative if the situation itself is negative, we become www.orangepower.com.

The difference is and I think the point Mackie is making sometimes it seems forced when you go a different viewpoint. Especially when you go out of your way (i.e. 2011-12 Texas Tech vs 2010-11 OU) to build up the other team.

I just want to know why when given similar chances you give optimism to other teams but still act like OU is doomed.

I still laugh when I read ISU boards writing off Royce White as eligible for this season yet you speak of him as a potential Big 12 Newcomer of the year. But you take one quote from Capel (proved to not even being related) and some rumors at the time and assume the worse about Calvin Newell.

Like I said before, I still don't give why the 2011-12 Tech team is able to compete in the Big 12 next year but we're bottom feeders with a similar team make up but arguably better recruited talent?

Why? Do other teams get the benefit of the doubt and OU gets the short stick? There is a difference between providing info on other teams and exposing our short comings but I would expect one our own fans to at least give a fair shake. I don't know why I let this get to me but as much as I enjoy nah love Sooner basketball it gets old every day seeing one of own take potshots at the program.

Is it because you want Capel fired or what?


/Rant over

 

[Seymore Cox]

I can't believe I opened this thread even though I knew what the content was going to be about.

 

[Mr.B!!!]

I haven't been able to respond to this post with the time I have wanted to so I am going to dive into a few things.

First this is a weird thread, why was it needed? Shouldn't this have just been a responses to BT's 11th in the conference thread. Seems to fit the same subject matter and was started about 40 minutes after BT's thread had been up. Perhaps you had been planing a thread like this and it was just pure coincidence but it seems weird.

It just comes off as instead of really comparing Nebraska vs OU (as much as it pains me to say it, it is a legit point in this preseason) you wanted it to be known as your thread. I don't start a counter point thread when I disagree with on the many things as we tend to do because we have different personalities and viewpoints as that is human nature. I just add into your thread because that is typical message board procedure. Maybe I shouldn't because this thread screams "I want people to notice me" and I'm only fueling your ego.


The difference is and I think the point Mackie is making sometimes it seems forced when you go a different viewpoint. Especially when you go out of your way (i.e. 2011-12 Texas Tech vs 2010-11 OU) to build up the other team.

I just want to know why when given similar chances you give optimism to other teams but still act like OU is doomed.

I still laugh when I read ISU boards writing off Royce White as eligible for this season yet you speak of him as a potential Big 12 Newcomer of the year. But you take one quote from Capel (proved to not even being related) and some rumors at the time and assume the worse about Calvin Newell.

Like I said before, I still don't give why the 2011-12 Tech team is able to compete in the Big 12 next year but we're bottom feeders with a similar team make up but arguably better recruited talent?

Why? Do other teams get the benefit of the doubt and OU gets the short stick? There is a difference between providing info on other teams and exposing our short comings but I would expect one our own fans to at least give a fair shake. I don't know why I let this get to me but as much as I enjoy nah love Sooner basketball it gets old every day seeing one of own take potshots at the program.

Is it because you want Capel fired or what?


/Rant over

This is the part I don't get and the specific example is Nick Thompson.In another thread, abd says that at 6'9" and 215, Thompson would be hard pressed to compete against other post players in the B12 and yet with this German guy who also happens to be about 6'9" and 215, not only can he compete, but he has done well AND should have a better season.

It pains me to say it, but OU and NU are closer than they ever should be in basketball expectations as of right now. That having been said, we brought in a huge recruiting class that looks talented with HS guys and debatable with the JUCO guys. That said, the JUCOs we brought in did have decent stats. Bottom line, it goes both ways, it is doubtful that the #10 preseason ranked team is "clearly" better than any other team in the conference, much less the #11 ranked team.

Love information on other schools and generally enjoy the cut and paste jobs that abd puts out there; however, they are getting more and more slated to OU sucking and anyone and everyone being better than us...which on some level is fair because we are ranked next to last, but where the patronizing attitude or some type of agenda reveals itself is calling out #10 as being so "clearly" better than #11. Call me crazy, but there is a break-down in logic with that.

 

[campbest]

Wow...if you guys are this sensitive right now, just wait til we start losing games and the "Fire Capel" bandwagon gets going.

 

[Max Power]

Wow...if you guys are this sensitive right now, just wait til we start losing games and the "Fire Capel" bandwagon gets going.

Or wait until we start winning games and you ABD and the others have to eat crow

 

[thebigabd]

First this is a weird thread, why was it needed? Shouldn't this have just been a responses to BT's 11th in the conference thread.

Perhaps, but it would have been seen as hijacking, or at least I thought so.

Also, some people think OU will finish as high as 5th or 6th this year, which makes you a lock to go to the NCAA Tournament. In order to do so, OU would obviously need to be better than the teams projected in front of them. So, I posted about the team projected directly in front to see if people thought OU will or should be better than them.

Turns out, most people think it was an insult to even compare OU to Nebraska this year and here we are.

Maybe I shouldn't because this thread screams "I want people to notice me" and I'm only fueling your ego.

I assume we would be having the same discussion no matter where the thread was posted. As for my ego, I don't let a basketball forum fuel or deflate it, lol.

Why? Do other teams get the benefit of the doubt and OU gets the short stick?

I dont think I give OU the short stick, and I dont think I give other teams the benefit of the doubt. As Mr. B says, I just cut and paste and then make an opinion based on what I know about those players and what I have seen and think will happen.

Lately, my opinion of OU has been negative and I think I have a great deal of evidence to justify my opinions.

Is it because you want Capel fired or what?

No.

 

[boksooner]

Lately, my opinion of OU has been negative and I think I have a great deal of evidence to justify my opinions.

The point is that there is a ton of similar evidence about TT, Neb, Col, etc., but you seem to only focus on the positive for them. With OU, it seems that you gloss over the positives and focus on the negatives. No one thinks that you should say OU is a 20 win team, but it would be nice if you talked about both sides.

 

[Mr.B!!!]

The point is that there is a ton of similar evidence about TT, Neb, Col, etc., but you seem to only focus on the positive for them. With OU, it seems that you gloss over the positives and focus on the negatives. No one thinks that you should say OU is a 20 win team, but it would be nice if you talked about both sides.

This is exactly where I'm at. Personally, I'd love to see a cut-and-paste write-up by abd that has the positives for OU. I mean in all seriousness, it would have highly recruited high school talent, JUCO AA's, transfers, etc. If he can paint turds like Tech, Iowa State and Nebraska, I'd love to see what he can do with OU, just once!

 

[campbest]

Or wait until we start winning games and you ABD and the others have to eat crow

Would love to see where I hope OU loses or that I want Capel fired (was one of the stronger Capel supporters after the season ended, check it out). Personally I think OU finishes in the 8-9 range, we will surprise some people. I am not high on the JUCOs we brought in but we do have a lot of young, raw talent (said so earlier in the thread). I have always said the 2011-12 season is Capel's make or break year...he's going to have talent, experience and size to play with. The JUCO AA stuff means nothing to me based on how I know those types of awards are given out...get your team to Hutch, someone will make AA.

My only problem with the sensitivity was the backlash of comparing Thompson with Standhardinger, when a vast majority of people on this board have not watched the kid play outside the OU contest. Hell, Mr. B didn't even know his only games played were in conference due to the NCAA suspension. Thompson was courted by UNM dependent on the Hobson situation and once Gordon was deemed eligible at semester the interest cooled until Will Brown was booted. Then again they lost interest in Thompson, because they actually picked up a transfer from Tennessee who is bigger, stronger and more skilled.

 

[Mr.B!!!]

Would love to see where I hope OU loses or that I want Capel fired (was one of the stronger Capel supporters after the season ended, check it out). Personally I think OU finishes in the 8-9 range, we will surprise some people. I am not high on the JUCOs we brought in but we do have a lot of young, raw talent (said so earlier in the thread). I have always said the 2011-12 season is Capel's make or break year...he's going to have talent, experience and size to play with. The JUCO AA stuff means nothing to me based on how I know those types of awards are given out...get your team to Hutch, someone will make AA.

My only problem with the sensitivity was the backlash of comparing Thompson with Standhardinger, when a vast majority of people on this board have not watched the kid play outside the OU contest. Hell, Mr. B didn't even know his only games played were in conference due to the NCAA suspension. Thompson was courted by UNM dependent on the Hobson situation and once Gordon was deemed eligible at semester the interest cooled until Will Brown was booted. Then again they lost interest in Thompson, because they actually picked up a transfer from Tennessee who is bigger, stronger and more skilled.

My only backlash is the inconsistency of a few things that abd has said in the past that conflict with what he is saying about this guy. You want to call me out for asking for that consistency, no big deal...but at least be honest yourself, you haven't seen Nick play at the D-1 level, or JUCO either, so you can't say definitively what his skill set is or isn't at this point. He has already been named as a captain of the team, so he must be doing something to gain the respect of his peers out there.

 

[Dem Coltz]

There is more to winning basketball games than the stat line reads. Picks, help defense, hustle, etc. Dennis Rodman wasn't a scorer at any level he played. But based on the fact that he didn't average a lot of points, a lot of block shots, and that he was undersized he wouldn't make ADB's junior high team.

I hope this isn't serious. Dennis Rodman put up ridiculous stats in college. Yes he did things that can't really be quantified like play great defense and set picks and hustle like a madman. But at Southeastern Oklahoma State he was a 3 time NAIA All American. Not major D1 but his numbers are similar to Blake Griffin's, in other words he dominated the competition. He averaged 25 points and 15 rebounds over 3 seasons, has the school record for season scoring average, led all NAIA in rebounding two years, and shot 63% from the field. People don't sniff the NBA unless they are one of the best in the country at doing something people can quantify. For Rodman it was scoring and rebounding that got him an invite to Portsmouth pre-draft camp, where he won MVP with scouts watching intently.

 

[NickZepp]

Rodman stats

He put up great numbers in college, not just rebounding numbers. But his rebound numbers in the NBA were sick, especially in an era with great 7 footers and he was like 6'7