Tulsa beats #5 Houston

thebigabd said:
No, you are out of touch.... Lon is under .500 against league opponents at OU. In 9 years we have had seasons where he finished 9th, 8th, 8th, and 7th in a 10 team league. We will see what happens this year.

Lon is doing an average-at-best job at a premier program... There is no way around it. Haith has been National Coach of the Year multiple times at total crap programs. He had a 30 win team at Mizzou, that got upset in the NCAA Tournament.

Since Haith left Missouri, that program has completely tanked. They are 77-112 and an SEC bottom feeder since Haith left. Haith went 76-28 at Missouri the three years prior.

OU's previous coach has elevated Houston to a new level. Making it in the top 5 until last night. Some are predicting Sampson and the Cougars to be in the Final Four, while OU is going to be trying to nab a 12 seed again.

Sampson is on a run down there... 22-10... 21-11... 27-8... 33-4... and now has a top 10 team. AT HOUSTON. That program has completely sucked for a long time, and a former OU coach has turned it into something much better.

Put Haith, Sampson, Konkol, etc on the OU sideline and the program gets better. I have no doubt. Zero doubt.

OU is stagnant... being in the Big 12 and being a really successful program is keeping us treading water. But that's all we keep doing, is treading water.
Click to expand...



Time to waive the white flag on this one, abd. If you want to compare Lon Kruger to Kelvin Sampson that's one thing...but comparing either one to a guy who has literally won ONE NCAA Tournament game is insulting at best. At worst, you lose all credibility for future discussions. Please stop the nonsense.
 
I unintentionally opened up a can of worms on this thread. I just saw the score scroll across the bottom of the TV last night and that I would post it. I grew up in Tulsa watching Nolan Richardson and JD Barnett teams. I guess you could say TU is my second favorite team. So anytime they experience some success, I enjoy it with them.

As for Haith, I thought it was a bad hire initially. But he has exceeded my expectations so far. Not that he has been great there thus far, but I thought the program would crater. Not to mention, I think his past reeks of improprieties. He is a good coach, but he has been sleazy. I still hope they can squeeze into the tournament.
 
WaymanFan said:
Time to waive the white flag on this one, abd. If you want to compare Lon Kruger to Kelvin Sampson that's one thing...but comparing either one to a guy who has literally won ONE NCAA Tournament game is insulting at best. At worst, you lose all credibility for future discussions. Please stop the nonsense.
Click to expand...

Plus one.
 
thebigabd said:
My mistake on 2005... He was a finalist for National of Coach of the Year in 2005. I thought he won it in 2005 and 2012.



I never cited OU's ranking in defense as a reason to fire Kruger..... I was making a point about how Frank has developed in his time at Tulsa and is now known as one of the toughest defensive coaches in the country. My reason to fire Kruger are that he works at a premier basketball program and is treading water.

I never said or implied that Kruger should be fired because OU ranks low on defense.

That being said, it is a problem. I think in the Trae Young season OU was statistically one of the worst defensive teams in the country.

Yea, sure buddy...

He's been coaching a bit longer...Doesn't mean he's the best guy for this job.

Kruger is failing at OU right now... We will see how this season plays out. But he is not meeting expectations. That much is clear.
Click to expand...

Clear to a wanna be JUCO.com talent ranker?

Youve lied and avoided actual facts. be better ABD.
 
He has been past the 2nd round 1 time!!!!!!

Kruger has taken 4/5 teams to the Final 4?
 
WaymanFan said:
Time to waive the white flag on this one, abd. If you want to compare Lon Kruger to Kelvin Sampson that's one thing...but comparing either one to a guy who has literally won ONE NCAA Tournament game is insulting at best. At worst, you lose all credibility for future discussions. Please stop the nonsense.
Click to expand...

This has been discussed on this forum before.... You guys are using crap logic here. You can't just compare resumes and say, "see, look, this guy is better"... It's just ridiculous.

Kruger leads the OU basketball program... The OU basketball program is treading water... Programs like Baylor, West Virginia, Texas Tech, Texas, etc have passed OU. OU is in a group of teams in the league that consists of Iowa State, TCU, and Oklahoma State.

You guys are deploying a classic straw man here... and ignoring all substance. In your world... Kruger is the best man for OU over anyone without a comparable or better resume. There is even a comment above from someone (Coach?) that says OU wouldn't hire someone who hasn't had consistent success at the P5 level. OU hired Kelvin Sampson out of Washington State where he went 103-103 and accomplished nothing. He barely made 1 NCAA Tournament before he arrived at OU. But someone knew he could coach. That is the part you guys refuse to apply.

Good thing the Golden State Warriors didn't use that logic when hiring Steve Kerr, who had never been a coach before. Good thing Joe C didn't use that logic when he hired Lincoln Riley, who had never been a head coach before. Good thing Joe C didn't use that logic when he hired Bob Stoops, who had never been a head coach before.

Maybe OU wouldn't hire him because of some NCAA stuff... maybe they wouldn't hire Sampson back for the same reason. Doesn't change that I think they would do better at OU than Lon Kruger.

Frank Haith has never coached at an elite program... He did very well at Missouri. He won the league one year... Now he's at a mid-major that typically doesn't get that many teams in. He won that league last year (regular season) along with Houston.

But I've been watching his teams play for years, in person... They are well coached. They play really tough defense. They rebound. They swarm around and constantly pressure the other team. He hasn't been able to bring in good enough 3pt shooters which has hurt their offense. With OU talent, and his style of play, I think OU would get substantially better. I think it would look a lot more like what Sampson did.

Konkol....... same thing. Has gone 22-8, 23-10, 23-10, 20-13, and 17-16 at LA Tech.

Last year:

#1 in CUSA in FG Defense
#1 in scoring defense
#1 in scoring margin
#4 in scoring offense
#2 in FG percentage
#3 in 3pt percentage
#4 in 3pt defense
#1 in turnover margin
#1 in assist/turnover ratio
#4 in steals

Defensive minded. Well coached. Consistent.

You guys are applying the wrong logic when you keep saying "you can't compare "Insert Someone" to Lon Kruger because Lon Kruger has won more!".... "You can't compare "Insert Someone" to Lon Kruger because look at March!"....

Why not? I can look at how a person coaches. How a coach assembles a team. What they do well, what they do poorly, and make a judgement on whether or not they will do well at this program.

You guys are basically saying that nobody who has won any less than however many games Kruger has won is worthy of coaching OU. That's crazy.
 
Last edited:
On a brighter note, if history is any indication, now that I have made these posts it all but guarantees OU beats West Virginia. :)
 
thebigabd said:
This has been discussed on this forum before.... You guys are using crap logic here. You can't just compare resumes and say, "see, look, this guy is better"... It's just ridiculous.

Kruger leads the OU basketball program... The OU basketball program is treading water... Programs like Baylor, West Virginia, Texas Tech, Texas, etc have passed OU. OU is in a group of teams in the league that consists of Iowa State, TCU, and Oklahoma State.

You guys are deploying a classic straw man here... and ignoring all substance. In your world... Kruger is the best man for OU over anyone without a comparable or better resume. There is even a comment above from someone (Coach?) that says OU wouldn't hire someone who hasn't had consistent success at the P5 level. OU hired Kelvin Sampson out of Washington State where he went 103-103 and accomplished nothing. He barely made 1 NCAA Tournament before he arrived at OU. But someone knew he could coach. That is the part you guys refuse to apply.

Good thing the Golden State Warriors didn't use that logic when hiring Steve Kerr, who had never been a coach before. Good thing Joe C didn't use that logic when he hired Lincoln Riley, who had never been a head coach before. Good thing Joe C didn't use that logic when he hired Bob Stoops, who had never been a head coach before.

Maybe OU wouldn't hire him because of some NCAA stuff... maybe they wouldn't hire Sampson back for the same reason. Doesn't change that I think they would do better at OU than Lon Kruger.

Frank Haith has never coached at an elite program... He did very well at Missouri. He won the league one year... Now he's at a mid-major that typically doesn't get that many teams in. He won that league last year (regular season) along with Houston.

But I've been watching his teams play for years, in person... They are well coached. They play really tough defense. They rebound. They swarm around and constantly pressure the other team. He hasn't been able to bring in good enough 3pt shooters which has hurt their offense. With OU talent, and his style of play, I think OU would get substantially better. I think it would look a lot more like what Sampson did.

Konkol....... same thing. Has gone 22-8, 23-10, 23-10, 20-13, and 17-16 at LA Tech.

Last year:

#1 in CUSA in FG Defense
#1 in scoring defense
#1 in scoring margin
#4 in scoring offense
#2 in FG percentage
#3 in 3pt percentage
#4 in 3pt defense
#1 in turnover margin
#1 in assist/turnover ratio
#4 in steals

Defensive minded. Well coached. Consistent.

You guys are applying the wrong logic when you keep saying "you can't compare "Insert Someone" to Lon Kruger because Lon Kruger has won more!".... "You can't compare "Insert Someone" to Lon Kruger because look at March!"....

Why not? I can look at how a person coaches. How a coach assembles a team. What they do well, what they do poorly, and make a judgement on whether or not they will do well at this program.

You guys are basically saying that nobody who has won any less than however many games Kruger has won is worthy of coaching OU. That's crazy.
Click to expand...


You've made a great argument for taking Frank Haith over Steve Henson.
 
If Kruger retired tomorrow Haith wouldn’t be in the top 50 names, nor should he.
 
thebigabd said:
On a brighter note, if history is any indication, now that I have made these posts it all but guarantees OU beats West Virginia. :)
Click to expand...

Swept them last year but they are superior to us.

Just admit you’re wrong. You and daqman are the only 2 in America that think haith is better.
 
CoachTalk said:
Swept them last year but they are superior to us.

Just admit you’re wrong. You and daqman are the only 2 in America that think haith is better.
Click to expand...


consider this a warning
 
Last edited by a moderator:
daqman said:
Did one of your sources tell you that? Because you obviously can't read or are just to stupid to comprehend.
Or maybe you're just a lying sack of ****.
Click to expand...

Jealousy is flattering.
 
OU has to replace Billy Tubbs.... what a legend. Won 72% of his games at Oklahoma. Won the Big 8 multiple times. Made it to the National Championship game... Final Four... Sweet 16... Won 640 games in his career.

I know of this coach... very different from Billy Tubbs. His teams are tough, structured, very well coached, defensive oriented. They grind you down. He currently coaches at the worst program in the Pac-10. He's been to the NCAA Tournament one time in his career, and lost in the first round. 0 NCAA Tournament wins. He is 103-103 at Washington State, including a 48-78 record in conference play. Before that, he did pretty well at Montana Tech. Went 73-45 coaching the Diggers of Montana Tech.

I think this is the guy who should replace the great Billy Tubbs... I've been watching them closely. I know the record doesn't show it, but his style, I think it could work here.. He will have much better talent here, and when you match that with his coaching style, I think he's going to win quite a lot.

"How could you possibly make such a suggestion, he is nowhere near as accomplished as Tubbs!", says CoachTalk.

Well, I actually watched his teams play. I see their style. They are hard nosed. They rebound. I think it could work well at OU.

"But he's never won an NCAA Tournament game!!", says Skyvue.

I get that... we aren't basing the decision on his resume. But rather, on what we have observed. You have to take what you observe about his teams and decide if it would work well at OU or not. Can he recruit the area? Does he know how to win at this school? OU isn't like North Carolina, Kansas, Gonzaga, etc.

"Nope, screw that, the next coach must have a comparable or better career than Billy Tubbs"- CoachTalk

I just don't agree... I really think we should hire this Sampson fella.

"Because he's never won an NCAA Tournament game, he shouldn't even be mentioned in the first 50 names to replace Billy Tubbs"- BCSooners
 
thebigabd said:
OU has to replace Billy Tubbs.... what a legend. Won 72% of his games at Oklahoma. Won the Big 8 multiple times. Made it to the National Championship game... Final Four... Sweet 16... Won 640 games in his career.

I know of this coach... very different from Billy Tubbs. His teams are tough, structured, very well coached, defensive oriented. They grind you down. He currently coaches at the worst program in the Pac-10. He's been to the NCAA Tournament one time in his career, and lost in the first round. 0 NCAA Tournament wins. He is 103-103 at Washington State, including a 48-78 record in conference play. Before that, he did pretty well at Montana Tech. Went 73-45 coaching the Diggers of Montana Tech.

I think this is the guy who should replace the great Billy Tubbs... I've been watching them closely. I know the record doesn't show it, but his style, I think it could work here.. He will have much better talent here, and when you match that with his coaching style, I think he's going to win quite a lot.

"How could you possibly make such a suggestion, he is nowhere near as accomplished as Tubbs!", says CoachTalk.

Well, I actually watched his teams play. I see their style. They are hard nosed. They rebound. I think it could work well at OU.

"But he's never won an NCAA Tournament game!!", says Skyvue.

I get that... we aren't basing the decision on his resume. But rather, on what we have observed. You have to take what you observe about his teams and decide if it would work well at OU or not. Can he recruit the area? Does he know how to win at this school? OU isn't like North Carolina, Kansas, Gonzaga, etc.

"Nope, screw that, the next coach must have a comparable or better career than Billy Tubbs"- CoachTalk

I just don't agree... I really think we should hire this Sampson fella.

"Because he's never won an NCAA Tournament game, he shouldn't even be mentioned in the first 50 names to replace Billy Tubbs"- BCSooners
Click to expand...

Kelvin Sampson was a young, up and coming coach who was clearly ascending when he was hired by OU at a time when we had missed the tourney three of the previous four seasons. Haith is in his mid 50s and had had multiple opportunities to coach programs in power conferences, and has almost no sustained success to show for it on a national level. His best run was tarnished by NCAA violations. To put it in perspective, his best four year run at any school he has coached would be worse than any four year stretch Lon has had at OU, and would be the exact type of thing that would lead to all sorts of people complaining that he should be fired.
 
thebigabd said:
OU has to replace Billy Tubbs.... what a legend. Won 72% of his games at Oklahoma. Won the Big 8 multiple times. Made it to the National Championship game... Final Four... Sweet 16... Won 640 games in his career.

I know of this coach... very different from Billy Tubbs. His teams are tough, structured, very well coached, defensive oriented. They grind you down. He currently coaches at the worst program in the Pac-10. He's been to the NCAA Tournament one time in his career, and lost in the first round. 0 NCAA Tournament wins. He is 103-103 at Washington State, including a 48-78 record in conference play. Before that, he did pretty well at Montana Tech. Went 73-45 coaching the Diggers of Montana Tech.

I think this is the guy who should replace the great Billy Tubbs... I've been watching them closely. I know the record doesn't show it, but his style, I think it could work here.. He will have much better talent here, and when you match that with his coaching style, I think he's going to win quite a lot.

"How could you possibly make such a suggestion, he is nowhere near as accomplished as Tubbs!", says CoachTalk.

Well, I actually watched his teams play. I see their style. They are hard nosed. They rebound. I think it could work well at OU.

"But he's never won an NCAA Tournament game!!", says Skyvue.

I get that... we aren't basing the decision on his resume. But rather, on what we have observed. You have to take what you observe about his teams and decide if it would work well at OU or not. Can he recruit the area? Does he know how to win at this school? OU isn't like North Carolina, Kansas, Gonzaga, etc.

"Nope, screw that, the next coach must have a comparable or better career than Billy Tubbs"- CoachTalk

I just don't agree... I really think we should hire this Sampson fella.

"Because he's never won an NCAA Tournament game, he shouldn't even be mentioned in the first 50 names to replace Billy Tubbs"- BCSooners
Click to expand...

Thinking haith is that young and up and coming guy is idiotic at best. And those programs were in shambles afte the left because of the ncaa violations... from his rule breakings
 
Max Power said:
Thinking haith is that young and up and coming guy is idiotic at best. And those programs were in shambles afte the left because of the ncaa violations... from his rule breakings
Click to expand...

Nobody said Haith was a young up and comer, lol. Man, you guys know how to use the straw man with the best of them.
 
thebigabd said:
OU has to replace Billy Tubbs.... what a legend. Won 72% of his games at Oklahoma. Won the Big 8 multiple times. Made it to the National Championship game... Final Four... Sweet 16... Won 640 games in his career.

I know of this coach... very different from Billy Tubbs. His teams are tough, structured, very well coached, defensive oriented. They grind you down. He currently coaches at the worst program in the Pac-10. He's been to the NCAA Tournament one time in his career, and lost in the first round. 0 NCAA Tournament wins. He is 103-103 at Washington State, including a 48-78 record in conference play. Before that, he did pretty well at Montana Tech. Went 73-45 coaching the Diggers of Montana Tech.

I think this is the guy who should replace the great Billy Tubbs... I've been watching them closely. I know the record doesn't show it, but his style, I think it could work here.. He will have much better talent here, and when you match that with his coaching style, I think he's going to win quite a lot.

"How could you possibly make such a suggestion, he is nowhere near as accomplished as Tubbs!", says CoachTalk.

Well, I actually watched his teams play. I see their style. They are hard nosed. They rebound. I think it could work well at OU.

"But he's never won an NCAA Tournament game!!", says Skyvue.

I get that... we aren't basing the decision on his resume. But rather, on what we have observed. You have to take what you observe about his teams and decide if it would work well at OU or not. Can he recruit the area? Does he know how to win at this school? OU isn't like North Carolina, Kansas, Gonzaga, etc.

"Nope, screw that, the next coach must have a comparable or better career than Billy Tubbs"- CoachTalk

I just don't agree... I really think we should hire this Sampson fella.

"Because he's never won an NCAA Tournament game, he shouldn't even be mentioned in the first 50 names to replace Billy Tubbs"- BCSooners
Click to expand...

Youve lost it brother. Sampson to Haith to Lon... You are all over the place.

Are we comparing Kelvin to Lon
or
Lon to Haith?

2 completely different conversations.
 
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