We have talent

Seymore Cox

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That has to be the most frustrating thing to me. I remember when Kelvin was here and we had maybe one or two guys that could put the ball in the basket. This year we have 6 guys that can put up 20 plus. I think Fitz can put up good offensive numbers. The only thing this team physically lacks is a little athleticism. It's just not clicking in other phases of the game. Mainly teamwork, communication, defense, and effort.
 
I don't know if we lack athletes. We lack the guys that can actually care to play the game of basketball. They just want to score.
 
Most our our talented guys don't know how to work yet. That's part of being a freshman.
 
Most our our talented guys don't know how to work yet. That's part of being a freshman.

Unfortunately, you're right.

These guys play good defense in spurts - very short spurts unfortunately. I hope that when they do that tonight, the crowd will acknowlege it. I think one of the signs of their immaturity is that when they play good defense but the other team scores anyway, they get down on themselves and lose focus. It's a vicious cycle. If they get down on themsleves and lose focus, the outcome is bound to be bad and they get even more down on themselves.
 
I don't know if we lack athletes. We lack the guys that can actually care to play the game of basketball. They just want to score.

I should hope so, given that it is 50% of the sport.
 
I should hope so, given that it is 50% of the sport.
Yeah but we make a good shot then get beat on transition off an inbound pass and give up an open shot that pretty much kills anything we do on offense. In 13 games this year we've averaged 77 points a game this year. That's only 2 less points last year.
 
Yeah but we make a good shot then get beat on transition off an inbound pass and give up an open shot that pretty much kills anything we do on offense.

Sometimes! But, sometimes not. Too often, probably. I certainly am not going to attempt to read minds and claim that the players "do not care" about playing the game of basketball. As best as I can tell, they all care. But, like I said, I don't think I can read minds.

In 13 games this year we've averaged 77 points a game this year. That's only 2 less points last year.

I find comparing statistics that have been accumulated only in non-conference play to a full season's worth of statistics to be a pretty strange way to determine an offense's effectiveness.
 
Sometimes! But, sometimes not. Too often, probably. I certainly am not going to attempt to read minds and claim that the players "do not care" about playing the game of basketball. As best as I can tell, they all care. But, like I said, I don't think I can read minds.



I find comparing statistics that have been accumulated only in non-conference play to a full season's worth of statistics to be a pretty strange way to determine an offense's effectiveness.

Last years non conference we averaged 80 points a game. If he get around 107 tonight I think that puts us right at 80.
 
Last years non conference we averaged 80 points a game. If he get around 107 tonight I think that puts us right at 80.

Don't see how you arrive at that number unless you count NCAA tournament games, which again seems strange.

This is all beside the point anyway.
 
Some freshman are more mature than normal. But most take a year or even two years to figure out how hard you have to play to win at the high D-1 level. Upper class competition is the single biggest motivator to accelerate the maturation process. In other words, if you can play good ball without the younger players, and do, then they will get with the program earlier so that they can get minutes.

I think this is Jeff's problem. The freshman and Willie are our best players and are having to play whether they work hard or not -- because they are our best players. Outside of Crocker, we just don't have a really good bunch of returning players that are as talented as our younger players.

Jeff took "runners" on some really good athletes that were available because they were academic risks, e.g. Clark, Cannon and Patillo, or because they were "head cases", e.g. Maze and Early. These kids didn't make it and are gone now. I don't have a problem with taking these chances, and when you gamble, you need to be ready to lose. We are now paying our losses -- sort of speak.

I also think that to a certain degree Jeff is going through a learning curve with regard to recruiting. He thinks he can recruit anyone, and in some cases, he has shocked everyone. However, he is finding out in some instances when you go against the North Carolinas, Jayhawks and UCLA, you are going to get some of the kids you want and you will have wasted a lot of time and money chasing kids that aren't coming. Then, you find yourself on the outs with kids that went elsewhere that you could have had.

In short, Jeff is learning and will develop a better feel about recruiting, focus on a couple big time kids and also recruit a few you know you can get. Every kid on Kansas is not a high school all american, and you don't need this to win. For example, we could have had Roberson, but chose to jerk his schollie to go after Jai. Not questioning or gripping, just saying that he could be our senior point guard this year.

Bottom line, Kelvin's recruits went elsewhere. We have missed on some risky players, missed on some decent recruits that we could have had, and it looks like it has all caught up to us this year.

We have talent and play outstanding for a few minutes at a time, but we look like what we are, talented but young and immature. I had hoped Jeff would have these kids playing ball by Conference, but it doesn't look like that can be accomplished. And, he might not get much out of them this year. But I still think he is a terrific coach and we should stand behind him. He was young when we hired him, and he had no experiance at a big time school and he is feeling his way. I still say the sky is the limit with Jeff. My guess is that is that he is searching far and wide for some immediate help. I think he will build his numbers by next year, have more competition and options for playing time, get his freshman churning like they should by next year and we will be right back in the middle of things.

In short,
 
Great post, cowboysooner. You should post it on OUI. They could use your insite.
 
Good post, cowboy.

I'm not exactly sure that Capel knew when he came to OU exactly what he needed to recruit. He was accustomed to recruiting the level of athlete that went to VC, and he had attended Duke. He had to hit somewhere in between, and we have never been a strong recruiting school. Often our best players are from Oklahoma (Adams, Tisdale, Griffin, Webster, etc.), and we mixed in a few JC recruits with them. Kelvin recruited drill sergeant type players and played in the trenches. Billy went the JC route. If you look at our last two final four teams, they had some transfers and JC players in key roles.

Capel will have to see what works for him. I think he is recruiting the high school athletes on a national basis more effectively than did Billy or Kelvin. But, he isn't there yet, and needs a bit more reputation to get there.
 
I also think that to a certain degree Jeff is going through a learning curve with regard to recruiting. He thinks he can recruit anyone, and in some cases, he has shocked everyone. However, he is finding out in some instances when you go against the North Carolinas, Jayhawks and UCLA, you are going to get some of the kids you want and you will have wasted a lot of time and money chasing kids that aren't coming. Then, you find yourself on the outs with kids that went elsewhere that you could have had.

In short, Jeff is learning and will develop a better feel about recruiting, focus on a couple big time kids and also recruit a few you know you can get. Every kid on Kansas is not a high school all american, and you don't need this to win. For example, we could have had Roberson, but chose to jerk his schollie to go after Jai. Not questioning or gripping, just saying that he could be our senior point guard this year.

All around good post, cowboy! This part stood out to me, though, because I had similar thoughts over the weekend. Kids like Roberson, Mike Singletary, Udoh and a few others I might be able to name if I took the time to think about it, would have been much better choices than some of the guys you mentioned.

I'm also worried that Coach Capel is doing the same thing with our 2010 recruiting class. I am thrilled that we signed Cam Clark and T. J. Taylor. But, have we missed out on some really good players by hanging on to our hope of signing high-profile recruits like Jones, Lamb and McCallum too long? Time will tell, I suppose.
 
You can have all the talent in the world but if they don't play as a team then you're defeating the purpose of basketball, a team game.
 
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