At this point Kruger gets a D at best.

[thebigabd]

You would have taken Longar over Fitzgerald...Carter/Griffin over Osby, Neal over Pledger??/

Duh, who wouldnt?

 

[Big Old Booger]

Duh, who wouldnt?

Exactly!

 

[AdaSooner]

I'm having a hard time understanding what this thread is about. Is it that when results don't meet fan expectations, it is the coaches fault? Couldn't it be that fan expectations just got out of whack?

This team is much better than last years team. They have been competitive most of the time against almost everyone. Last years team lost 15 games by double digits and it could have been more if they hadn't closed the gap alittle against opponents bench after the game was decided. This years team has only lost 7 by double digits so far.

I could never detect that last years team had so much as an inbound play to run. This team has gotten competitive because they are much improved in the half court. They have had lots and lots and lots of successful offensive plays and sets. How do you think Pledger scored so many points?

When we play a Kansas or Missouri close for a half and then lose. That is an improvement. That is good coaching. Those ranked schools have better players. OU just can not keep up down the stretch. That's all.

Capel is the one that rounded this group up. That is on him. Seems like that Kruger has done too good of a job with them. They have shown just enough promise for some to get to imagining that they are capable of more. They are not.

Grooms, a Capel recruit that Kruger came in and locked down, is a good example. I have been a big fan of Grooms. He seems like a great kid and I think he is doing a fine job. And even though he is a big improvement at point guard. To this point, he hasn't shown that he is good enough. I doubt that he could go to any current top 20 team and start. So, how could anyone expect us to beat a top 20 team with a point guard that isn't as good as our theirs.

And the same can be said for Cam, Fitz, and yes even Pledger. Grooms can not score and all the rest have things that they can not do. It is those things that they can not do that would inhibit them from starting at or for better teams.

With good coaching and this group of players, OU has a good chance to be competitive game in and game out. But, a marginal chance of actually beating good teams.

Outstanding post! :clap

I have thought about responding for several days, but couldn't bring myself to be part of a thread that starts by awarding a "D" grade to a head coach who is in his first season. Never mind that the coach didn't have a heck of a lot to work with in the first place, and none of it his fault. I won't bother to go into all of the reasons this was destined to be a down year for OU. But anyone who thought this team had the goods to do more than make a run at the NIT had to be seeing the level and depth of talent on our roster through crimson colored glasses.

Like everyone else, I was hopeful this team would overachieve. But I have said from the beginning that an 18 win season would be quite an accomplishment. Am I disappointed that our season is going come up short of that number? Disappointed maybe, but not surprised. I also said 16 wins may be more realistic. And if we finish a game or two shy of that number, that won't surprise me either.

Garyeb2 said it better than I ever could. Every player on this team is limited in what they can do. We don't have a single player on our bench who can be counted on to come in and spark the team on offense or defense. Not one. Three players on this team score most of the points. The other two starters are not even close to double figures, despite playing enough minutes in every game to be more productive.

Like it or not, this is not a team with a lot of quallity depth. Kruger is not to blame for that. There have definitely been signs of improvement. No one was arguing that point in the non-conference portion of our schedule, or when we took Mizzou to the wire, played KU tough the first half or when we pulled off a sweep against KSU.

I have been part of this and other boards for a long time. Losses, especially when there doesn't seem to be an end to them, brings out the worst in fans. But to give Coach Kruger a "D at best" in his first season? That's a flagrant personal foul in my officiating book!

 

[Dem Coltz]

As some else said, it's not phsyical fatigue. I think it's a mental fatigue that comes from a lack of confidence. It's as if they come out in the second half expecting something bad to happen and when it does, they are done mentally.

? Mental fatigue from lack of confidence, despite outplaying and leading Kansas for a half, and playing Mizzou tightly? How is mental fatigue/lack of confidence coming out of halftime the fault of anyone but the current coach and players after 10 months. This explanation is absurd if you are trying to defend Kruger.

 

[WTSooner]

How is mental fatigue/lack of confidence coming out of halftime the fault of anyone but the current coach and players after 10 months.

It is absolutely the fault of the players. And who recruited those players, and helped them suffer through two terrible seasons? Hint.....it wasn't Lon Kruger.

 

[Dem Coltz]

It is absolutely the fault of the players. And who recruited those players, and helped them suffer through two terrible seasons? Hint.....it wasn't Lon Kruger.

So you're saying coaches have no effect on team attitudes, mental toughness, and in-game changes? Exactly what do you think coaches do, just recruit players and that's it? That is beyond ridiculous. I like Kruger, but if people say with a straight face our players are mentally fatigued after halftime of games where we are competitive and lack confidence, then Kruger hasn't coached them well enough. End of discussion. When we were 9-1 people were falling over themselves to say how much better LK was than Capel because with the same team we were winning games. Now those same people are finding endless scapegoats besides Kruger for why we are losing.

 

[WTSooner]

So you're saying coaches have no effect on team attitudes, mental toughness, and in-game changes? Exactly what do you think coaches do, just recruit players and that's it? That is beyond ridiculous. I like Kruger, but if people say with a straight face our players are mentally fatigued after halftime of games where we are competitive and lack confidence, then Kruger hasn't coached them well enough. End of discussion. When we were 9-1 people were falling over themselves to say how much better LK was than Capel because with the same team we were winning games. Now those same people are finding endless scapegoats besides Kruger for why we are losing.

So what you are saying is that coaches can inact any change they wish, on any player they wish, at any time they wish? Sometimes a turd is just that, a turd. You can find the best turd polisher in the world, and guess what? After days, or even months of polishing, you are still going to have a turd.

Now, I'm not calling our program or our guys turds. But this team, this group of guys, has so many issues and problems, most of which, alone, aren't a big deal, but in total, they are crippling the team. Limited depth. Limited guard play. One shooter. Not much quickness. Most of them didn't learn much under Capel. Most of them developed bad habits under Capel. Most of them got used to losing and not being accountable under Capel. They don't fit LK's system/style. And if you assume that Cam is better than he has been all year, then we have a player that has pretty much been in a season long slump.

All that, and we're still probably 10 minutes of better basketball from being at least three wins better. Again, this team doesn't have any one, huge hole that causes us to lose. This team has a bunch of smaller holes. A LOT of smaller holes. And it's just a team that doesn't fit together well. The strengths and weaknesses of each player don't mesh well. That was actually one of my biggest Capel complaints.....that he never tried to put a full team together. Instead, he simply went out and recruited the best athletes and scorers, without any regard to the other stuff that is important when constructing a 13 man roster.

When a coach has been successful at a number of schools like LK has been, I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. If you aren't, then you are pretty much saying that LK has "forgotten" all the things he has done at every other stop along his coaching career. That doesn't seem very likely to me.

 

[garyeb2]

So what you are saying is that coaches can inact any change they wish, on any player they wish, at any time they wish? Sometimes a turd is just that, a turd. You can find the best turd polisher in the world, and guess what? After days, or even months of polishing, you are still going to have a turd.

Now, I'm not calling our program or our guys turds. But this team, this group of guys, has so many issues and problems, most of which, alone, aren't a big deal, but in total, they are crippling the team. Limited depth. Limited guard play. One shooter. Not much quickness. Most of them didn't learn much under Capel. Most of them developed bad habits under Capel. Most of them got used to losing and not being accountable under Capel. They don't fit LK's system/style. And if you assume that Cam is better than he has been all year, then we have a player that has pretty much been in a season long slump.

All that, and we're still probably 10 minutes of better basketball from being at least three wins better. Again, this team doesn't have any one, huge hole that causes us to lose. This team has a bunch of smaller holes. A LOT of smaller holes. And it's just a team that doesn't fit together well. The strengths and weaknesses of each player don't mesh well. That was actually one of my biggest Capel complaints.....that he never tried to put a full team together. Instead, he simply went out and recruited the best athletes and scorers, without any regard to the other stuff that is important when constructing a 13 man roster.

When a coach has been successful at a number of schools like LK has been, I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. If you aren't, then you are pretty much saying that LK has "forgotten" all the things he has done at every other stop along his coaching career. That doesn't seem very likely to me.

I certainly agree with this. I would add that the only hammer most any coach has over the modern athlete is minutes. Do as I say or come and sit down is all thye have.

 

[garyeb2]

So what you are saying is that coaches can inact any change they wish, on any player they wish, at any time they wish? Sometimes a turd is just that, a turd. You can find the best turd polisher in the world, and guess what? After days, or even months of polishing, you are still going to have a turd.

Now, I'm not calling our program or our guys turds. But this team, this group of guys, has so many issues and problems, most of which, alone, aren't a big deal, but in total, they are crippling the team. Limited depth. Limited guard play. One shooter. Not much quickness. Most of them didn't learn much under Capel. Most of them developed bad habits under Capel. Most of them got used to losing and not being accountable under Capel. They don't fit LK's system/style. And if you assume that Cam is better than he has been all year, then we have a player that has pretty much been in a season long slump.

All that, and we're still probably 10 minutes of better basketball from being at least three wins better. Again, this team doesn't have any one, huge hole that causes us to lose. This team has a bunch of smaller holes. A LOT of smaller holes. And it's just a team that doesn't fit together well. The strengths and weaknesses of each player don't mesh well. That was actually one of my biggest Capel complaints.....that he never tried to put a full team together. Instead, he simply went out and recruited the best athletes and scorers, without any regard to the other stuff that is important when constructing a 13 man roster.

When a coach has been successful at a number of schools like LK has been, I'm inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt. If you aren't, then you are pretty much saying that LK has "forgotten" all the things he has done at every other stop along his coaching career. That doesn't seem very likely to me.

I certainly agree with this. I would add that the only hammer most any coach has over the modern athlete is minutes. Do as I say or come and sit down is all thet have. Considering our current bench strength, Kruger really doesn't have that option without sacrificing a reasonable chance to win.

 

[Northbase]

Pretty poor coaching job and that's being kind.

This has got to be one of the stupidest post I have ever seen on any message board anywhere. What's wrong (baby talk voice) You feeling bad about yourself cause your teams not winning? Just complete message board ignorance.

 

[DenverSooner]

I certainly agree with this. I would add that the only hammer most any coach has over the modern athlete is minutes. Do as I say or come and sit down is all thye have.

I agree and Kruger doesn't even have this. He can't really bench anyone because he has zero options. Capel had this problem too.

I really hope Kruger can find one more player for next year. I would love to get a good transfer or juco guy.

 

[Krugerfan52]

I disagree that Kruger has zero options. Neal and Blair showed again today that they can make things happen if they get more than just a few minutes.

Kruger has done nearly the same thing Capel did the past few years lately. He has worn out his starters. Honore, Arent, Blair, Washington and Neal are 5 guys that can contribute, but they havent gotten much of a chance during this losing streak.

 

[Riseandfire10]

Blair didn't play much against texas in the second half because he had three straight turnovers that led to layups. Blair is an average point guard that wouldn't play on any good OU team.

 

[Sid]

So our talent level is so abhorrent that the coach is irrelevant?

 

[DenverSooner]

I disagree that Kruger has zero options. Neal and Blair showed again today that they can make things happen if they get more than just a few minutes.

Kruger has done nearly the same thing Capel did the past few years lately. He has worn out his starters. Honore, Arent, Blair, Washington and Neal are 5 guys that can contribute, but they havent gotten much of a chance during this losing streak.

Are you suggesting taking minutes from Osby and Fitzgerald for Arent, Washington and Honore? I don't think too many coaches would do that. I suspect Osby and Fitzgerald abuse them in practice.

Blair has played all season. He is averaging just over 16 minutes per game. Neal is averaging just over 13. They have both been given opportunities. Until recently Neal has not been playing well.

 

[Sid]

No talent, no depth.

Brought to you by Jeff Capel. Guy ran the program into the ground, gonna take a few years to bring it back to life. OU just has to hope that the rise of Baylor, K-State, and Iowa State hasnt pushed the program down to where this kind of thing is normal. This has been normal for the past 3-4 years, but hopefully long term its not the norm.

:clap

 

[DenverSooner]

I don't understand that post. I actually blame Joe C for the downfall of the basketball program as much as Capel. He totally screwed up releasing Sampson's class before they even met Capel. Did it not cross his mind to tell the guys they committed to OU and at least owed it to the program to meet the new coach before asking for a release?

He hired Capel when most people didn't agree. He has instituted no policies that have effectively promoted the program. When OU self reported the telephone calls he agreed with the NCAA to allow it to continue so they could "monitor" the situation and then the NCAA acted like OU was a major rules violator.

Overall he is a good AD but I don't like what he has done with the basketball program.

 

[Sid]

I don't understand that post. I actually blame Joe C for the downfall of the basketball program as much as Capel. He totally screwed up releasing Sampson's class before they even met Capel. Did it not cross his mind to tell the guys they committed to OU and at least owed it to the program to meet the new coach before asking for a release?

He hired Capel when most people didn't agree. He has instituted no policies that have effectively promoted the program. When OU self reported the telephone calls he agreed with the NCAA to allow it to continue so they could "monitor" the situation and then the NCAA acted like OU was a major rules violator.

Overall he is a good AD but I don't like what he has done with the basketball program.

Blaming Joe C for the current state of the men's basketball program is absurd. Joe has tried everything within his power to promote the men's basketball program at Oklahoma. Since the Student Body and the local community don't give a dayum about men's basketball at OU, what would you like Joe to do? He fired JC and brought in one of the best college basketball coaches in the country.

 

[AdaSooner]

Blaming Joe C for the current state of the men's basketball program is absurd. Joe has tried everything within his power to promote the men's basketball program at Oklahoma. Since the Student Body and the local community don't give a dayum about men's basketball at OU, what would you like Joe to do? He fired JC and brought in one of the best college basketball coaches in the country.

You can fool some of the people some of the time, but you can't fool me. :ez-laugh:

 

[Sawyer]

blaming joe c for the current state of the men's basketball program is absurd. Joe has tried everything within his power to promote the men's basketball program at oklahoma. Since the student body and the local community don't give a dayum about men's basketball at ou, what would you like joe to do? He fired jc and brought in one of the highest paid college basketball coaches in the country.

fify