Capel's interview with Hale up on OU Insider

[HeismanWatch]

So, let's keep in mind, before we kneejerk about how we hate Capel and he needs to be fired and we're getting the death penalty and we'll suck for years, that someone from another program will possibly print that out and give it to a recruit. They'll tell the recruit, "Here is a snapshot of fan sentiment about the program you're thinking of attending." Then your prophecy of failure has a better chance of coming true!

I was telling the wife this morning, 2-3 years ago I thought we had a great place to discuss our sport, but it seems 60/40 at least in favor of this being a place for people with marginal knowledge of a situation to vent negatively about the program. While I understand the need to do this, remember the more extreme and negative and not thought out your opinions are, the better chance someone might use it to influence potential recruits/assistant coaches.

At least maybe keep it to as few threads as possible so people don't think that all we do is negatively rant and rave about how much we don't like our team.

I respect your opinion, but don't agree with it at all.

OU didn't lose any recruit because of any message board. That's BS. The media printed ALL OVER THE NATION about the Tiny Gallon issue and possible probation, and Capel's problems with Willie Warren was not written by OU fans.

It was printed on NATIONAL MEDIA venues because it was newsworthy.

I read it everywhere. I heard it on the radio everywhere. I saw it on ESPN.

Coaches will take that press and share it with recruits, no doubt. So, OU needs to STOP DOING IT!

The fans are not doing it. To blame the fans is DUMBER THAN DUMB!

 

[HeismanWatch]

So the suggestion is that we keep the basketball board on a more positive or at least contructive note?

Wow...that sounds strangely familiar to me. Not sure how. hmmm - maybe it will come to me.

It will be positive once the Tiny Gallon and Willie Warren issues go away.

That's the problem. It's like a alcoholic blaming his family for the stress.

"I drink to numb my problems with my family." BS, you drink because you are an alcoholic.

Work on that and you'll see your stress and that on the family is 10 fold less.

 

[HeismanWatch]

This is the stuff recruits are reading, not a message board!

NBA Draft: Former Sooner Willie Warren fighting his past

By John Rohde
Published: June 19, 2010

NBA Draft: Former Sooner Willie Warren fighting his past
NEWSOK RELATED ARTICLES
What about Tiny Gallon and Tommy Mason-Griffin?

06/19/2010 Keith "Tiny" Gallon and Tommy Mason-Griffin were both born in Houston, and both left Oklahoma after their freshman season, but it appears both will not be...

Warren missed 10 games last season, was suspended for one game for undisclosed reasons and had arthroscopic ankle surgery on March 3.

While damaging his once lofty draft expectations, not only did Warren post poor numbers, he displayed a poor attitude.

"His lack of concentration on the defensive side of the ball, along with his all-around questionable attitude and poor results when asked to play a larger role are three significant factors when explaining his lowered draft stock,” DraftExpress.com surmised.

The 6-foot-4, 208-pound Warren is a shooting guard, but also has been evaluated at point guard.

"I don't want to say I'm a 1 (point guard). I don't want to say I'm a 2 (shooting guard),” Warren said Wednesday. "I'm a guard that can really, really score. I can also handle the ball, too.”

Warren's agent, Kim Grillier, said his client is a hybrid along the lines of Stephen Curry, who averaged 17.5 points, 5.9 assists, 4.5 rebounds and shot 43.7 percent from 3-point range as a rookie with Golden State last season.
"Honestly, I think his (Warren's) game is more suited for the NBA because it's more up-tempo, more open,” Grillier said. "He can handle the ball and create as opposed to being in college where they have a lot of zone.”

Warren's statistics last season make him neither a 1 or 2.
Shooting guards don't shoot 43.8 percent from the field and 30.9 percent from 3-point range, which Warren did as a sophomore. Point guards don't finish with only six more assists than turnovers (86-80), which Warren did.
If these numbers belonged to anybody but Warren, NBA teams might have zero interest. Warren's flashes of brilliance have kept him on the draft board. His potential upside is substantial. His one-on-one ability ranks among the elite.

The best way for Warren to stop his slide down the draft charts was to have a serious change in attitude, which many claim he has done.

"Several people I've talked to have been impressed with how he's handled his interviews,” OU coach Jeff Capel said. "I think there were some misperceptions from people who thought Willie and I didn't get along. That's probably the furthest thing from the truth. There were frustrating times, which happens between players and coaches at one point or another. I don't think Willie's a bad kid. It's just a matter of putting it all together.”

Warren underwent intense private workouts with player development trainer Marcus Harris in Mansfield, Texas, south of his native Fort Worth.

"You've got people calling and saying the main thing he needs to work on is his attitude,” Harris told the Fort Worth Star-Telegram last month. "I heard that from pro scouts, I heard that from college coaches, college players and just people in the streets as you go around to these different tournaments when they found out I was working him out.

"But I've been overwhelmed by his attitude. It's been great.”
Grillier said Warren has worked out for a dozen teams. Warren initially struggled with back spasms after working hard to come back from his ankle injury, but said earlier this week he is now in good health.
Physically and emotionally, Warren has been in constant flux. His answers have been equally wide-ranging.

Last month, Warren said: "I wanted to come back (to OU last season) and prove to a lot of people that I can lead a team. I felt like I was a 25-points-per-game guard, eight rebounds, six or seven assists."

On Wednesday, after working out with the Indiana Pacers for a second time, Warren said: "I don't know about leading yet, because obviously I was 13-18 at Oklahoma (last season), but I can be a great follower. Put me in the right situation, you know like (Boston's Rajon) Rondo, he went to the right situation ... now look at him now. He's an All-Star."

Capel is hoping all this upheaval somehow might benefit Warren.
"Sometimes this can be a blessing in disguise," Capel said. "Maybe if he's not drafted as early as he anticipated before the season, he could end up on a team with some really good guys, a place where he can learn how to be a pro.”

Read more: http://newsok.com/nba-draft-former-...9?custom_click=lead_story_title#ixzz0rNfJbcGH

 

[skyvue]

There's a misperception in this thread. Capel didn't speak of the negative impact on recruits of OU fans whining and moaning; he was talking about misinformation being spread -- by the media, primarily, and yes, by fans on boards like this one. He said he told one set of parents they should come to him with their questions about what exactly was going on at OU, that the media were reporting lots of incorrect info.

That's not to say that negative posts here couldn't persuade a recruit to go elsewhere -- though, frankly, I consider that something of a long shot, and if it did happen, it would suggest to me that the recruit was a fragile flower better suited to Div. II -- but fans' expressions of discontent is NOT what Coach Capel was talking about. Misinformation is what concerned him.

 

[Sawyer]

I agree with the people saying negativity by fans on message boards doesn't impact recruiting.

Cheno mentioned a few schools with notoriously negative boards, but you can go to ANY board for any school and you'll find an abundance of negativity. It happens everywhere. For all the differences people have, we're for the most part similar. We obviously have individual differences, but as groups we tend to more or less think alike (exception: those from kansas).

The "we shouldn't post negative things because it might hurt the program" sentiment brings me back to the not so distant dark days of the conclusion of the Quin years at Mizzou. If the negativity is deserved (as it was in Quin's case, and as it remains to be seen in Capel's), then it's not helpful to censor things to preserve a failed regime. If it's not deserved, it probably won't matter anyway. Recruits are not always the brightest students, but they're not stupid, either. At least not stupid enough to choose against a school because of anonymous comments online by fans.

 

[Cleavon Little]

Maybe we just need a banner at the top of every page that says:

"Take anything you read here with a grain of salt. Opinions are like a-holes, everybody's got one."

I'm kidding, of course, but apparently journalists, recruits and other people take this stuff way too seriously. Probably Capel is included in that. Don't believe anything that comes from the Interwebs! It's all lies and porn!

 

[Cheno]

I respect your opinion, but don't agree with it at all.
OU didn't lose any recruit because of any message board. That's BS. The media printed ALL OVER THE NATION about the Tiny Gallon issue and possible probation, and Capel's problems with Willie Warren was not written by OU fans.
It was printed on NATIONAL MEDIA venues because it was newsworthy.
I read it everywhere. I heard it on the radio everywhere. I saw it on ESPN.
Coaches will take that press and share it with recruits, no doubt. So, OU needs to STOP DOING IT!
The fans are not doing it. To blame the fans is DUMBER THAN DUMB!

Agreed. And Capel did mention the media which I think is the main culprit of the negativity but hey that like you said if stuff quits happening they won't talk about it.

Bottom line is I think it's silly to bring up that recruiting is taking a hit because of media and message boards negativity. OU is on it's best run ever in as far as recruiting talent. 4 MCDAA in 3 years. I mean come 'on. Recruiting has not been bad. It's at an all-time high.
And like others have said it's the other teams coaches that are having a field day with this. That's not the media or message boards fault....that's all the crap that's gone on within the programs fault.
I doubt most recruits hardly even read message boards. In all the interviews I've read/seen over the years when asked if they pay attention to the internet most recruits response was no. They are 16-17 year old high school kids...they are playing, hanging out, etc. Some of them even commented they don't watch college basketball that much. They are busy....busier than most of us. LOL.

 

[Cheno]

Maybe we just need a banner at the top of every page that says:

"Take anything you read here with a grain of salt. Opinions are like a-holes, everybody's got one."

I'm kidding, of course, but apparently journalists, recruits and other people take this stuff way too seriously. Probably Capel is included in that. Don't believe anything that comes from the Interwebs! It's all lies and porn!

:clap Absolutely my man!

 

[Seymore Cox]

Yeah, I think Capel is being a little too thinned skinned on this issue. You've got to take the good with the bad. When people were raving about his recruiting classes and having 2 Mcdaa's on the team, he didn't complain about that. And if you check the consistency of the things that came on on Message boards and this one specifically, they've been pretty accurate.



Btw Cheno, saw where KU was Leading for Ben McElmore. That dude is a stud.

 

[boksooner]

Everyone seems to be getting a little defensive about this. As skyvue said, Capel was talking about misinformation, not simple negativity. Message boards, generally, lack the credibility to be damaging. Capel is referring to national and local media reporting rumors as fact. If I was a recruit and someone handed me the national story about how OU should get the death penalty, I would think twice about going there. Some posters here, and elsewhere, may have been accomplices by spreading these stories, but the news agencies that practice irresponsible reporting should be held responsible.

 

[Cheno]

Yeah, I think Capel is being a little too thinned skinned on this issue. You've got to take the good with the bad. When people were raving about his recruiting classes and having 2 Mcdaa's on the team, he didn't complain about that. And if you check the consistency of the things that came on on Message boards and this one specifically, they've been pretty accurate.
Btw Cheno, saw where KU was Leading for Ben McElmore. That dude is a stud.

Exactly. The recruiting has been at a high level. I guess then all the positives on the board when Capel was hired should be given credit for landing those MCDAA's.

Yeah, what I've read is the McElmore is a bigtime KU lean. I guess he's always liked them being so close in St. Louis and KU has been on him early before he really started blowing up. I've heard the same that he's just killing fools this summer and he's an unbelievable athlete.
I think you'll see KU land him in 2011 and then have a pretty soft class othe than him and then 2012 has the makings of a monster class. Peters is already in the fold and KU is in strong with a ton of kids in '12.

If I was a recruit and someone handed me the national story about how OU should get the death penalty, I would think twice about going there. Some posters here, and elsewhere, may have been accomplices by spreading these stories, but the news agencies that practice irresponsible reporting should be held responsible.

That's just it....the coaches of the other schools are telling them this and adding fuel to the fire. This holds about 100x the weight of anything they read on a message board.

 

[Seymore Cox]

Some of the Athlete's First guys have some clips of where he threw down some big dunks on them. The ironic thing is when I was living in STL, the Talk was all Brad Beal. Now this dude has passed him up.

 

[Sam]

"These so-called Wisconsin fans, what they had to say on those [message boards], it really made me second-guess: Do people really want me here?" Blue told Jeff Potrykus of the Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel. "Because I know if I was a fan and I heard about a recruit [who might be struggling academically], I'd be more like: 'What can we do to help him?' And not, 'Let's make him feel like the worst person in Madison right now.'"

But what made it a national story -- and perhaps a lesson for the uncivilized world of message boards, if we're lucky -- is that the decommitment was prefaced by a story about the Madison native's alleged academic woes, which led to some Wisconsin fans spending their days publicly bashing the Class of 2010 standout on the Internet. They questioned his attitude, character and intelligence. And guess what? Vander Blue read it and it bothered him.

He is 16 years old, by the way.

"I felt like I was in a corner, trapped and I couldn't get out," Blue told the Milwaukee paper. "I just felt like it was so unnecessary. I don't think I'm that worse of a guy. Sometimes I might be tired and have a little attitude, [but] I don't think I'm a horrible person.

"Forty year-old adults talking about somebody who don't got their license yet; I just felt it was so unnecessary," Blue added. "Picture yourself in my position. Rumors going around, you're just keeping quiet. And you read the article and 1,000 people [are] throwing you under the bus."

It would be easy to spend the next 250 words killing Wisconsin fans.

Blue ended up being a 5 star and committed to Marquette

Source

Current players, potential players, etc do read this place on occasion.

 

[Cleavon Little]

Everyone seems to be getting a little defensive about this. As skyvue said, Capel was talking about misinformation, not simple negativity. Message boards, generally, lack the credibility to be damaging. Capel is referring to national and local media reporting rumors as fact. If I was a recruit and someone handed me the national story about how OU should get the death penalty, I would think twice about going there. Some posters here, and elsewhere, may have been accomplices by spreading these stories, but the news agencies that practice irresponsible reporting should be held responsible.

A few conclusions:

Some kids don't pay attention to media or message boards much, so they may be less aware than others that the boards are full of rumors, speculation, and plain untruths at times. Then, since they are often also less media savvy (they're actually playing basketball instead of writing and reading about it), they might lend more credence to a newspaper story basically reporting off of message boards.

There once was a time when a journalist with a sense of pride wouldn't even reference so much rumor and hearsay. These guys do it weekly, and the radio is as bad as anything else. But, these guys have to fill a column every day, or worse, jabber nonstop on the air for 4-6 hours a day, and they're too lazy or unwilling to write more in depth profile pieces on players and coaches, or program developments.

Ever notice how one kid, often a football player, has this rise up from the streets profile piece, overcoming adversity thing, in the paper? Then, especially if he gets nationwide attention, every subsequent article references the same stuff? Laziness. He's not the only interesting story. Every person out there, student athlete or not, has a story, you just have to find it.

Sadly, you get more readers, callers, and posts when you just go with the rumor and speculation.

 

[Cleavon Little]

Current players, potential players, etc do read this place on occasion.

I wonder sometimes if a few message board regulars out there would take the risk of running off a kid or two to be allowed to rant and rave unhindered. And it's not like it's a call for censorship. It's like being asked to think before they post is what's making people mad. You'd be expected to think before you blurted out that your wife's aunt was a lardbutt.

Thinking before speaking is what adults do. Kids don't, and they also probably get their feelings hurt more from reading internet crap than an adult would.

 

[HeismanWatch]

Agreed. And Capel did mention the media which I think is the main culprit of the negativity but hey that like you said if stuff quits happening they won't talk about it.

It's like a alcoholic blaming his family for the stress.

"I drink to numb my problems with my family." BS, you drink because you are an alcoholic.

Work on that and you'll see your stress and that on the family is 10 fold less.

 

[Cleavon Little]

What alcoholics you know blame their drinking on their family? Man, that's low!

 

[Sam]

It's like a alcoholic blaming his family for the stress.

"I drink to numb my problems with my family." BS, you drink because you are an alcoholic.

Work on that and you'll see your stress and that on the family is 10 fold less.

So you use that analogy once in this thread and people ignore it, so what is your reaction?
Keep using it till people respond?
Weird.

 

[BigTime]

It's like a alcoholic blaming his family for the stress.

"I drink to numb my problems with my family." BS, you drink because you are an alcoholic.

Work on that and you'll see your stress and that on the family is 10 fold less.

Any other addiction tips for us?

 

[Cleavon Little]

That boy ain't thinkin when he's postin on a thread that's talking about thinkin before you start postin.