Current Events Thread

[SoonerBounce13]

This is a disgusting comment. I’m talking about public education in general, with an emphasis on low income areas. Never once did I mention black children.

Child abuse is common in all classes of wealth.

child abuse is common across all races.
But I don't see what is disgusting about the comment...a little insensitive? Yes.
But it is true.

 

[BCSooners]

So 3 questions:

Where does that state funding come from?

DO you have any sources that say the money being used for credits to a private school kid would mean less goes to the public funded kid?

If my kids go to a private school, and I am paying state taxes, why should my kid not be eligible for school credits provided by these state taxes?

1) taxes
2) if public money is being used in private schools it’s common sense that the money isn’t going to public schools. There isn’t a separate budget for each type of school.
3) you get tax credits for paying tuition. Also you are choosing to send your kid to a private school, which already provide more scholarships and tuition waivers to certain students...usually athletes.

 

[BCSooners]

child abuse is common across all races.
But I don't see what is disgusting about the comment...a little insensitive? Yes.
But it is true.

Duh, I’ve already said I wasn’t singling out a race. You & Sheep have done that on your own.

It was a sh***y comment that was made for no reason, other than being insensitive.

 

[sheepdogs1]

This is a disgusting comment. I’m talking about public education in general, with an emphasis on low income areas. Never once did I mention black children.

Child abuse is common in all classes of wealth.

Abd did and I was addressing both of your comments. I separated my comment to you and my comment to him and did not lump them together as one so as to avoid confusion (yeah that worked out okay). I was not stating in any manner that you did so you could chill. Before the civil rights era 70% of black children came from a home with two parents and now it stands at about 30%. Surely, this has an affect not only on the children, but it affects the money in the household. No?

 

[WTSooner]

Which is exactly why BLM is so evil. They openly want to break up the nuclear family even more

Ding, ding, ding!

The erosion of families and family values, REGARDLESS OF COLOR, is probably the leading cause of where are Nation is heading.

 

[BCSooners]

Abd did and I was addressing both of your comments. I separated my comment to you and my comment to him and did not lump them together as one so as to avoid confusion (yeah that worked out okay). I was not stating in any manner that you did so you could chill. Before the civil rights era 70% of black children came from a home with two parents and now it stands at about 30%. Surely, this has an affect not only on the children, but it affects the money in the household. No?

This is finally an actual statement & question that is good for the argument.

Yes it definitely has an impact. But it’s not the sole or even majority impact imo. The divorce rate is over 50%, so single parent homes are across the board. Again I’m not talking about race, I’m talking about low income areas in which the public school is reflected on the area. Your family’s starting income has so much impact on what kind of career the kid will end up with. The kid with higher income parents can afford to explore paths, make more financial mistakes, be stupidly selfish, get arrested with lesser penalties, not take school seriously, etc. The advantage they had going into K-12th grade gives them more time to get their crap together, even if they never dothey’ll still be put through college & the connections their family has still gets them a foot in the door to a successful path.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

1) taxes
2) if public money is being used in private schools it’s common sense that the money isn’t going to public schools. There isn’t a separate budget for each type of school.

I would have to see exactly where the money is coming from and if it affects public school funding. I haven't seen any source showing how this would happen. And remember, a tax credit is different than the state just giving out money.

3) you get tax credits for paying tuition. Also you are choosing to send your kid to a private school, which already provide more scholarships and tuition waivers to certain students...usually athletes.

When my kids went to Catholic school, I did not get a tax credit. They did not get any scholarships and nobody at the school did.

Belief it or not, most students at Catholics schools are not any better off than students in public schools. They make a sacrifice to pay more for the religious aspect OR they get financial aid from the Church.

I do see both sides of this but IMO if I am paying taxes for service that I am not using, I don't think it is unreasonable to seek a credit

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Duh, I’ve already said I wasn’t singling out a race. You & Sheep have done that on your own.

It was a sh***y comment that was made for no reason, other than being insensitive.

I was agreeing with you

 

[SoonerBounce13]

This is finally an actual statement & question that is good for the argument.

Yes it definitely has an impact. But it’s not the sole or even majority impact imo. The divorce rate is over 50%, so single parent homes are across the board. Again I’m not talking about race, I’m talking about low income areas in which the public school is reflected on the area. Your family’s starting income has so much impact on what kind of career the kid will end up with. The kid with higher income parents can afford to explore paths, make more financial mistakes, be stupidly selfish, get arrested with lesser penalties, not take school seriously, etc. The advantage they had going into K-12th grade gives them more time to get their crap together, even if they never dothey’ll still be put through college & the connections their family has still gets them a foot in the door to a successful path.

So you agree that lower income kids should also have some of these advantages correct?

That is what school vouchers attempts to help with.
A family that might not be able to afford their kid going to a better private school may now be able to

 

[BCSooners]

I would have to see exactly where the money is coming from and if it affects public school funding. I haven't seen any source showing how this would happen. And remember, a tax credit is different than the state just giving out money.


When my kids went to Catholic school, I did not get a tax credit. They did not get any scholarships and nobody at the school did.

Belief it or not, most students at Catholics schools are not any better off than students in public schools. They make a sacrifice to pay more for the religious aspect OR they get financial aid from the Church.

I do see both sides of this but IMO if I am paying taxes for service that I am not using, I don't think it is unreasonable to seek a credit

If I die before I receive Medicare can my family get a credit to pay me back. Just because you don’t use the services doesn’t mean you should get $$$ back from the allotted source.

This wouldn’t be as big of an issue for me if public schools weren’t already underfunded & still seeing cuts every year.

 

[BCSooners]

So you agree that lower income kids should also have some of these advantages correct?

That is what school vouchers attempts to help with.
A family that might not be able to afford their kid going to a better private school may now be able to

I’d rather improve the school system as a whole for every kid. Instead of selecting a few families to help out.

 

[WTSooner]

This wouldn’t be as big of an issue for me if public schools weren’t already underfunded & still seeing cuts every year.

And I might feel more sorry for the public school system if they would be more active in cleaning up their own houses first. The amount of administrative WASTE that the Oklahoma public school system has is ridiculous. So much overhead and waste on administrative positions that are not needed, or that should be consolidated. It's crazy.

 

[WTSooner]

And I might feel more sorry for the public school system if they would be more active in cleaning up their own houses first. The amount of administrative WASTE that the Oklahoma public school system has is ridiculous. So much overhead and waste on administrative positions that are not needed, or that should be consolidated. It's crazy.

And don't even get me started on unions (teachers). Unions make meaningful change very, very difficult.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

If I die before I receive Medicare can my family get a credit to pay me back. Just because you don’t use the services doesn’t mean you should get $$$ back from the allotted source.

This wouldn’t be as big of an issue for me if public schools weren’t already underfunded & still seeing cuts every year.

I agree with you there...which is why I said I can see both sides.

 

[sheepdogs1]

This is finally an actual statement & question that is good for the argument.

Yes it definitely has an impact. But it’s not the sole or even majority impact imo. The divorce rate is over 50%, so single parent homes are across the board. Again I’m not talking about race, I’m talking about low income areas in which the public school is reflected on the area. Your family’s starting income has so much impact on what kind of career the kid will end up with. The kid with higher income parents can afford to explore paths, make more financial mistakes, be stupidly selfish, get arrested with lesser penalties, not take school seriously, etc. The advantage they had going into K-12th grade gives them more time to get their crap together, even if they never dothey’ll still be put through college & the connections their family has still gets them a foot in the door to a successful path.

I understand you are not singling out race, but abd did, and that was why I made the comment about "daddy." You then questioned my motivation for the comment which I responded to you about 70% turning into 30% to clarify my understanding. Nothing more. Additionally, I know some people from higher income families and some children made the most of it yet not all children from the same family did, thus coming from the same household, same parents, etc was not enough in and of itself. There are some things internal, which is organic in nature ,and we either have it or we do not. I just do not agree that the kid with the best golf clubs being a contributing factor to success in golf versus the kid with the "knock offs" that flounders because of it.

 

[BCSooners]

And I might feel more sorry for the public school system if they would be more active in cleaning up their own houses first. The amount of administrative WASTE that the Oklahoma public school system has is ridiculous. So much overhead and waste on administrative positions that are not needed, or that should be consolidated. It's crazy.

So instead of putting caps on salaries and consolidating responsibility you cut funding? Funding that would go to updating to last decades technology & this century textbooks? Or how about teachers not having to teach 6 different subjects because you have to riff teachers? Government has to reform before they can put those types of limitations on schools.

What specific waste are you talking about? Master degree principles who work 60+ hours a week making $65-80k a year?

 

[thebigabd]

Kind of proving my point. Has public education helped this problem in any way?

That is kind of a ridiculous stance.... The economic conditions of a community made the school ineffective. You have to fix the economic conditions first, then the school becomes effective.

"School Choice" doesn't even attempt to solve the problem... it just takes a very select amount of kids out of a bad district and puts them in a good school.

There are two solutions to this problem, in my view.

1.) Change how schools are funded. A famous case that went to the Supreme Court that you should all read is San Antonio Schools vs. Rodriquez in 1973... It was a high profile case that basically stated that using property taxes to fund schools is fundamentally unfair and discriminatory against communities of color and other poor districts. This is 100% true. They lost in the Supreme Court, but there have been lots of challenges since then on school funding.

2.) You have to fix economic conditions. Over 42% of the country makes less than $15 an hour. The average hourly wage of a black man is something like $13 an hour. This problem (education), and many others, will never end unless we raise the standard living. Median personal income in the US is $31k.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

So instead of putting caps on salaries and consolidating responsibility you cut funding? Funding that would go to updating to last decades technology & this century textbooks? Or how about teachers not having to teach 6 different subjects because you have to riff teachers? Government has to reform before they can put those types of limitations on schools.

What specific waste are you talking about? Master degree principles who work 60+ hours a week making $65-80k a year?

the waste is the number of districts and overhead

 

[BCSooners]

I understand you are not singling out race, but abd did, and that was why I made the comment about "daddy." You then questioned my motivation for the comment which I responded to you about 70% turning into 30% to clarify my understanding. Nothing more. Additionally, I know some people from higher income families and some children made the most of it yet not all children from the same family did, thus coming from the same household, same parents, etc was not enough in and of itself. There are some things internal, which is organic in nature ,and we either have it or we do not. I just do not agree that the kid with the best golf clubs being a contributing factor to success in golf versus the kid with the "knock offs" that flounders because of it.

It’s not just the equipment. It’s the time to practice, the place & fees to practice, the private instructor, the means make sure you can see this through for as long as you want.

 

[BCSooners]

the waste is the number of districts and overhead

I can get on board with the number of districts. But even in those smallest of districts the superintendent is also a principal, teaches 2 classes, & coaches a team or 2.

I see teachers & administrators wearing more hats than they should, it’s hard for me to see the waste y’all are talking about to justify the cuts being made.