Fellas...I will never doubt the OU program again (semi Football thread)

[sybarite]

I think it was Heupel.

We have criticized OC for years: Mangino, Long, Wilson, and, now, Heupel because all of them, however different they might have been in the past, now look the same. We get Wilson who had been totally innovative, and his play-calling looked like Long. We get Heupel, a disciple of Leach, and his play-calling looked like Long. Either Long has a very long shadow, or the continuity is Stoops keeping charge of the game plan of the offense. He's a DC, not an OC.

 

[skyvue]

Either Long has a very long shadow, or the continuity is Stoops keeping charge of the game plan of the offense. He's a DC, not an OC.

And yet, year in and year out, with very few exceptions, we have had a very high-scoring offense. Surely you're not complaining about our offensive success under Stoops.

I think that a big part of what appeared to be a big turnaround in playcalling on Thursday was the quality of our QB play. A QB can make an offensive coordinator look like a genius or a fool.

For some reason, Blake Bell was like a deer in the headlights against texas and Baylor. He played well in some other games (and he played great against oswho), but in our two losses, he just looked lost somehow.

And Knight has exhibited the expected freshman growing pains (and a couple of injury-related setbacks). But he was at his best against Bama, which gave Coach Heupel the ability to open things up.

 

[sybarite]

And yet, year in and year out, with very few exceptions, we have had a very high-scoring offense. Surely you're not complaining about our offensive success under Stoops.

Funny. I thought that was exactly what I was doing. I'm not particularly concerned with how many times we score fifty. I am concerned about our performance in BCS title games. In those games, despite some rather superb talent, we haven't performed well on offense.

 

[skyvue]

Funny. I thought that was exactly what I was doing. I'm not particularly concerned with how many times we score fifty. I am concerned about our performance in BCS title games. In those games, despite some rather superb talent, we haven't performed well on offense.

That's generally what happens in title games -- things tighten up. You're facing either the best or the second best team in the country. Expecting to score fifty points -- or anything close to it in a title game -- is asking for disappointment.

Then there's the fact that Jason White was hobbled by injuries in one of those games, and the other we played without DeMarco Murray.

With JW at full strength or Murray toting the rock, I think we win either/both of those games. As it was, they were hard-fought losses -- nothing to hang our heads about.

And our prolific offenses played a huge role in us reaching those title games.

Also? You didn't mention the title games in your post. You seemed to be generally criticizing our offenses under Stoops which is, with all due respect, a tough sell at best.

 

[Big Old Booger]

That's generally what happens in title games -- things tighten up. You're facing either the best or the second best team in the country. Expecting to score fifty points -- or anything close to it in a title game -- is asking for disappointment.

Then there's the fact that Jason White was hobbled by injuries in one of those games, and the other we played without DeMarco Murray.

With JW at full strength or Murray toting the rock, I think we win either/both of those games. As it was, they were hard-fought losses -- nothing to hang our heads about.

And our prolific offenses played a huge role in us reaching those title games.

Also? You didn't mention the title games in your post. You seemed to be generally criticizing our offenses under Stoops which is, with all due respect, a tough sell at best.

:clap :clap :clap :clap

A lot of facts in this post.

I was at the Orange Bowl in January of 2009 and when Florida announced Harvin was playing and we knew Murray was not, all of my friends knew it was going to be a tough game to win. However, if we can somehow score when we had the chances, we win that game going away. We moved the ball on Florida all night long and they had no answer for our fast-paced offense. We just tightened up on the goal-line and weren't as aggressive as we had been in previous games, and we didn't have our most dynamic player in Murray.

In the LSU game, you take that pick-6 away and the game is tied late and we had all the momentum. That one was also very close and was a true road game nonetheless.

I have criticized Stoops some and his OC's but not for those 2 games. I didn't like the goal-line calls vs Florida but everybody makes mistakes. I criticized them more for the games like the Nebraska game in 09 and the Baylor game this year when we just walked out and took a big dump at midfield.

 

[sybarite]

That's generally what happens in title games -- things tighten up. You're facing either the best or the second best team in the country. Expecting to score fifty points -- or anything close to it in a title game -- is asking for disappointment.

Then there's the fact that Jason White was hobbled by injuries in one of those games, and the other we played without DeMarco Murray.

With JW at full strength or Murray toting the rock, I think we win either/both of those games. As it was, they were hard-fought losses -- nothing to hang our heads about.

And our prolific offenses played a huge role in us reaching those title games.

Also? You didn't mention the title games in your post. You seemed to be generally criticizing our offenses under Stoops which is, with all due respect, a tough sell at best.

OU football is about titles. I think that we lost the last OC that Stoops trusted enough to leave alone when we lost Leach. Leach was the one he hired because he had difficulty against him. I don't know that any OC since has had a free hand.

 

[playmakr]

OU football is about titles. I think that we lost the last OC that Stoops trusted enough to leave alone when we lost Leach. Leach was the one he hired because he had difficulty against him. I don't know that any OC since has had a free hand.

But we won a national title without Leach, so I don't get what you are saying. We've also won all our league titles without him.

 

[sybarite]

But we won a national title without Leach, so I don't get what you are saying. We've also won all our league titles without him.

We won it with the offense that he installed with the returning players in place to carry it out, like Heupel. Conference titles? Football at OU is about conference titles? Bud won how many in a row? That's a given. The Monster was built for national titles, not conference titles of state titles.

 

[playmakr]

We won it with the offense that he installed with the returning players in place to carry it out, like Heupel.

Oh, I was responding to this in relation to you discussing "titles":

I think that we lost the last OC that Stoops trusted enough to leave alone when we lost Leach. Leach was the one he hired because he had difficulty against him. I don't know that any OC since has had a free hand.

I guess, you misspoke.

It's also an irrational point because most years we have had a better offense than 1999, and if you indeed want to randomly/illogically expand leach's tenure into 2000, many years have been better on offense as well.

Football at OU is about conference titles?

Straw man.

 

[skyvue]

OU has been playing football for 118 years. We've won seven national titles, a rate that places us among the nation's elite programs.

But even so, we've only won national titles every 17 years, on the average. Even if you count only the post-war years, we've averaged a national title just about every 10 years.

Given how difficult it is to win a national title, it's beyond absurd to dismiss the value of conference championships. In fact, it's laughable.

 

[WaymanFan]

Given how difficult it is to win a national title, it's beyond absurd to dismiss the value of conference championships. In fact, it's laughable.

I couldn't agree more.

You guys have been arguing about the wrong side of the ball. If we're going to win another National Championship in the foreseeable future, we need to step up the recruiting defensively. We have two starters on NFL teams on that side of the ball (eleven on offense). TWO. That is frightening-bad. And you talk about 2008. I remember Jimmy Johnson saying at halftime that Gerald McCoy (one of those two NFL starters) was keeping OU in the game. Yes, we beat Alabama without any players on defense who will likely make an impact in the NFL, but we're going to continue to get demolished when we don't play well (Texas & Baylor). Title-bound teams find a way to win games when they don't play well.

 

[MNsooner]

I think BCS games matter too. And Stoops is the only coach (with OU being the only team) to win every BCS bowl at least once. that should tell you a lot about the consistent quality of Stoops teams.

 

[sybarite]

I began by stating that I have different standards for the head coaches in basketball and football. If the men's basketball coach had Stoops' record, I would be the greatest supporter. For the football coach to have that same record, I find it unacceptable. You are free to accept it if you wish. I will not. It is that simple, and nothing that you can say will change my mind. A couple of national titles might.

 

[skyvue]

I began by stating that I have different standards for the head coaches in basketball and football. If the men's basketball coach had Stoops' record, I would be the greatest supporter. For the football coach to have that same record, I find it unacceptable. You are free to accept it if you wish. I will not. It is that simple, and nothing that you can say will change my mind. A couple of national titles might.

Look forward to a miserable existence (as a fan), then. Because football championships very, very rarely come in bunches.