I smell more recruiting negligence......

BCSooners said:
Obanor was recruited by OU, I think OU was even in his final list of schools. You can't just pick a player & ask why OU didn't get him.
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Especially now, when paying for players is the norm.
 
My thoughts on Porter and the team he has assembled. First, Porter had to completely rebuild the roster, and couldn't recruit in person. He did it on zoom. He didn't have his top recruiting assistant (patrick) until the summer when he freed up from Arkansas.

All in all, he put together a competitive team and so I am satisfied. With the loss of Harkless, the kids seem to have lost and can't find their edge.

Things could have been very different for the team with a little luck. Krautwig seriously thought about coming and playing for Porter for a year. He is exactly the type of big we needed to compete in the B12. Alondes was from Chicago and if he had stayed, we would have been substantially better.

He now has his staff in place. He put together a pretty highly ranked class for 2022. He seems to be working hard on 2023 and there is an unusually large number of P-5 kids in the 2023 class from Oklahoma.

I say give him a pass for this year, and see what the roster looks like next year, whether his returning players have developed some and how the team looks with a year in his system.

JMO, but it is too early to get down on Porter and lets give him another year before we get too negative.

I have no problem with Jucos if the kid is our best option. With the portal blowing the game open, it might be smart to see what hits the portal before we go juco. If there is another class of bigs in the portal to equal last year, then we might be able to get a sure fire thing.
 
cowboysooner said:
My thoughts on Porter and the team he has assembled. First, Porter had to completely rebuild the roster, and couldn't recruit in person. He did it on zoom. He didn't have his top recruiting assistant (patrick) until the summer when he freed up from Arkansas.

All in all, he put together a competitive team and so I am satisfied. With the loss of Harkless, the kids seem to have lost and can't find their edge.

Things could have been very different for the team with a little luck. Krautwig seriously thought about coming and playing for Porter for a year. He is exactly the type of big we needed to compete in the B12. Alondes was from Chicago and if he had stayed, we would have been substantially better.

He now has his staff in place. He put together a pretty highly ranked class for 2022. He seems to be working hard on 2023 and there is an unusually large number of P-5 kids in the 2023 class from Oklahoma.

I say give him a pass for this year, and see what the roster looks like next year, whether his returning players have developed some and how the team looks with a year in his system.

JMO, but it is too early to get down on Porter and lets give him another year before we get too negative.

I have no problem with Jucos if the kid is our best option. With the portal blowing the game open, it might be smart to see what hits the portal before we go juco. If there is another class of bigs in the portal to equal last year, then we might be able to get a sure fire thing.
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Agree on everything
 
thebigabd said:
Not recruiting him with OU's problems with size, athletic ability, rebounding ability, etc is an act of negligence. When you have guys like Issanza on your roster, and you don't even offer this guy a scholarship, there is no other way around it. It's an act of negligence to not even offer him a scholarship or recruit him.
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Man I tend to agree it makes no sense he doesn’t have an offer unless there’s grade concerns/something else. I am not saying it is negligent because the recruiting season isn’t over yet and Moser still has plenty of cards to play. Let’s hope he has someone comparable or better in mind (and then lands him).
 
I’m on record as saying we need to give Coach Moser an entire recruiting cycle and see who he brings in. It’s clear we need massive turnover on this roster.

Having said that, my optimism comes and goes.
 
BCSooner,

Your post lacks some context... In many cases, we already had a roster established and were looking to fill certain needs. Many of those guys you mentioned would have been better at that than who was actually signed. You are portraying it as if I wanted to fill 13 roster spots with a few guys in the same class. It was like, 1-2 of them based on the needs at the time.

I love that you get topics going, and I understand everyone can be wrong (I certainly am). However, JUCO recruiting is obviously not the way to go, too many busts & most have baggage.
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OU will struggle and be a fringe basketball program, with some highs and lows, until they learn the lesson taught by Tubbs and Sampson. The quote from Sampson shows the path... Paraphrasing, "At OU, you must rely on regional junior college talent to fill gaps"... I can go find the exact quote again if you want, but thats the gist. It has been proven true since Sampson left. Fringe NCAA Tournament team, really weak conference performance year after year, losing relevance by the second.

Get the absolute best high school guys you can get, and fill *all* the gaps with junior college talent. Obviously the portal has added a new twist on that recipe, but it is what it is.

And then there's that old standby: your persistent refusal to acknowledge that not all -- and perhaps none -- of the jucos you tout would have any interest in playing at OU. The implication in your diatribes is that they are all dying to be Sooners, if only we would offer. You also consistently presume that OU has NOT reached out to at least some of them, only to have the player demur. You never even allow for this possibility.
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I have addressed this issue, but I don't think it was to your liking. I still believe region matters. Manek, Blake Griffin, Trae Young, Cade Davis, and lots of other dudes went to OU for a reason... It's a really good program, and it's nearby. Geography gives you a built in recruiting advantage.

I absolutely refuse to believe that Alonzo Verge, for example, would have had 0 interest in playing for OU if he was recruited heavily. He went to Arizona State late in the signing period, and received zero documented OU interest. All the way up to the late period and even at the end, OU would have been his best scholarship offer. That matters.

I absolutely refuse to believe that Taz Sherman, who was in the Dallas area, would have had no interest in playing for Oklahoma.... He received zero documented interest. Goes on to be a 20ppg guy in our league....

We didn't offer Shakur Juiston from Hutchinson, literally 3 hours away, a scholarship... He went on to UNLV and averaged 14 and 10 and we had total, absolute scrubs on the team at the position at that time.

Are you saying that being 3 hours from Juiston, Bandoo, Taz, etc doesn't matter at all? You think Manek, Young, Griffins, Cade, Cortes, and all the other local/regional are just as likely to sign with OU as if they are from Miami, FL... Seattle, WA... Etc? Of course that isn't true.

It's clear to me that my opinion of OU basketball is significantly higher than yours... You guys don't think OU can get a lot of this high level regional juco talent that you pretend doesn't even exist? It does exist. It's right there.

If OU can't win lowly contested recruited battles with regional players against TCU, UNLV, WVU, and others we have a serious problem.
 
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thebigabd said:
B

OU will struggle and be a fringe basketball program, with some highs and lows, until they learn the lesson taught by Tubbs and Sampson. The quote from Sampson shows the path... Paraphrasing, "At OU, you must rely on regional junior college talent to fill gaps"... I can go find the exact quote again if you want, but thats the gist. It has been proven true since Sampson left. Fringe NCAA Tournament team, really weak conference performance year after year, losing relevance by the second.
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lol juco's are not what they were 20 years ago ...


and it has not "been proven true" since sampson left ..
 
thebigabd said:
BCSooner,

Your post lacks some context... In many cases, we already had a roster established and were looking to fill certain needs. Many of those guys you mentioned would have been better at that than who was actually signed. You are portraying it as if I wanted to fill 13 roster spots with a few guys in the same class. It was like, 1-2 of them based on the needs at the time.



OU will struggle and be a fringe basketball program, with some highs and lows, until they learn the lesson taught by Tubbs and Sampson. The quote from Sampson shows the path... Paraphrasing, "At OU, you must rely on regional junior college talent to fill gaps"... I can go find the exact quote again if you want, but thats the gist. It has been proven true since Sampson left. Fringe NCAA Tournament team, really weak conference performance year after year, losing relevance by the second.

Get the absolute best high school guys you can get, and fill *all* the gaps with junior college talent. Obviously the portal has added a new twist on that recipe, but it is what it is.
Click to expand...

What Kelvin said 20 years ago doesn’t apply now. Transfer portal & non-qualifiers can go to prep school.

So you want 1-2 Jucos a recruiting cycle? That’s what OU currently does & usually the jucos suck because juco as a whole sucks. Mawein was a top ranked juco prospect & can’t get on the floor for the worst team OU has had in 8 years.
 
BCSooners said:
What Kelvin said 20 years ago doesn’t apply now. Transfer portal & non-qualifiers can go to prep school.

So you want 1-2 Jucos a recruiting cycle? That’s what OU currently does & usually the jucos suck because juco as a whole sucks. Mawein was a top ranked juco prospect & can’t get on the floor for the worst team OU has had in 8 years.
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Worse than our 2017 team when we finished 11-20 overall and 5-13 in conference?

As for Mawein, I think he should play more, maybe give him some of Jacob’s minutes. He’s a better defender IMO.
 
AdaSooner said:
Worse than our 2017 team when we finished 11-20 overall and 5-13 in conference?

As for Mawein, I think he should play more, maybe give him some of Jacob’s minutes. He’s a better defender IMO.
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people have short memories

OU is 45 in kenpom ..

basically the same range as the last 4 years ...
 
steverocks35 said:
Yeah well my eye test says we aren't close to 45, especially without Harkless. Sorry.
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I wouldn't say we are much different from previous years honestly. The record might show it but I do consider some loses as good. When evaluating the quality of a team, it is important if your loses are close or blowouts.


Lost by 10 @ Baylor but the game was pretty tight down the stretch
Lost by 1 @ TCU
Lost by 3 vs KU
Lost by 2 @ KU
Lost by 2 vs UT

Yes, we lost them. And that matters. But it feels like people have it in their minds that we haven't been competitive. If even 2 of those go our way, we are in a much different spot.

I'm not happy. I don't like moral victories. Just trying to look at things without emotions
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
I wouldn't say we are much different from previous years honestly. The record might show it but I do consider some loses as good. When evaluating the quality of a team, it is important if your loses are close or blowouts.


Lost by 10 @ Baylor but the game was pretty tight down the stretch
Lost by 1 @ TCU
Lost by 3 vs KU
Lost by 2 @ KU
Lost by 2 vs UT

Yes, we lost them. And that matters. But it feels like people have it in their minds that we haven't been competitive. If even 2 of those go our way, we are in a much different spot.

I'm not happy. I don't like moral victories. Just trying to look at things without emotions
Click to expand...

Great post, Bounce! Your last sentence is so on point — remove the emotion and then evaluate. Very difficult to do but it is necessary in order to assess properly.
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
I wouldn't say we are much different from previous years honestly. The record might show it but I do consider some loses as good. When evaluating the quality of a team, it is important if your loses are close or blowouts.


Lost by 10 @ Baylor but the game was pretty tight down the stretch
Lost by 1 @ TCU
Lost by 3 vs KU
Lost by 2 @ KU
Lost by 2 vs UT

Yes, we lost them. And that matters. But it feels like people have it in their minds that we haven't been competitive. If even 2 of those go our way, we are in a much different spot.

I'm not happy. I don't like moral victories. Just trying to look at things without emotions
Click to expand...


We're 2-11 in our last 13 games and are coming off 21 and 24 point drubbings. Oh, also, our best player (arguably) is out for the year.
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
I wouldn't say we are much different from previous years honestly. The record might show it but I do consider some loses as good. When evaluating the quality of a team, it is important if your loses are close or blowouts.


Lost by 10 @ Baylor but the game was pretty tight down the stretch
Lost by 1 @ TCU
Lost by 3 vs KU
Lost by 2 @ KU
Lost by 2 vs UT

Yes, we lost them. And that matters. But it feels like people have it in their minds that we haven't been competitive. If even 2 of those go our way, we are in a much different spot.

I'm not happy. I don't like moral victories. Just trying to look at things without emotions
Click to expand...

I think there is some merit to this post, but I guess where I disagree is that I see no areas where we are as good or better this year than recent teams. Offense is worse, defense is worse, rebounding no better. And unlike the recent teams, we don’t have a Reaves or Doo who can get us a bucket. I know some people think Harkless is capable, but I’d venture a guess that his overall numbers in those situations are awful. The fact he hit a few big shots seems to skew how people view him, but he just isn’t a guy you can reliably give the ball to and expect good things to happen.

I agree that most of the games you list showed a team close to being a tournament team. I’d definitely remove the game at TCU … we were awful that day. But overall, I appreciate your point.
 
Let's wait a while longer and see what or what not PM does far as recruiting goes. No OU will not recruit at the levels of the blueboods but they can improve some..I think PM will get it done and be a yearly top 25 team in most years
 
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