John Higgins

[steverocks35]

Not just terrible, unprecedentedly terrible. Historically unprecedented.

Way easier probability of a league mandate there as opposed to OU getting random officiating variance IMO.

I've been doing a bit of reading on this topic. OU's opponents were actually called for holding 3 times, one of which was declined. OU was called for 5 holding penalties, 2 of which were offset or declined. Does that sound like a conspiracy against us?

Edited to add one more nugget of information: K-State only had 4 holding penalties against them the entire year. It looks like holding was just not emphasized by the conference much last year.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I've been doing a bit of reading on this topic. OU's opponents were actually called for holding 3 times, one of which was declined. OU was called for 5 holding penalties, 2 of which were offset or declined. Does that sound like a conspiracy against us?

Edited to add one more nugget of information: K-State was called for 4 holding penalties the entire year. It looks like holding was just not emphasized by the conference much last year.

OU was called for holding more than 5 times lol

 

[steverocks35]

OU has called for holding more than 5 times lol

You could be right, the source I found could be wrong. It's hard to find stats broken down by individual penalties. I did find team stats for penalties. OU had 74 penalties called on them. Their opponents in Big 12 play had 64. Texas was 79 to 76. The difference for us is probably because we were not very good. If the Big 12 was out to get Texas you would think they would have been called for a lot more penalties than their opponents.

Did the Big 12 tell the refs, "Be sure and call the games fairly evenly EXCEPT FOR HOLDING!"

It's pretty laughable.

 

[SoonerDutch]

I've been doing a bit of reading on this topic. OU's opponents were actually called for holding 3 times, one of which was declined. OU was called for 5 holding penalties, 2 of which were offset or declined. Does that sound like a conspiracy against us?

Edited to add one more nugget of information: K-State only had 4 holding penalties against them the entire year. It looks like holding was just not emphasized by the conference much last year.

I don’t want to clog a bball board up with football talk but I’m happy to follow up with a PM. From looking at play-by-play data OU had five holds (3 on offense, 2 on ST) called against them in their first three conference games (not counting UT). One was declined, one (Murray against KU) took a TD off the board.

Considering the amount of yardage incurred and the general sense of discretion selectively not calling holds (and PI) would be what I’d focus on if I was shaping outcomes.

 

[WichitaSooner]

https://www.syracuse.com/orangebask...ls work as independent,the course of a season.

From over a decade ago. The current system has been in place a long time.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

You could be right, the source I found could be wrong. It's hard to find stats broken down by individual penalties. I did find team stats for penalties. OU had 74 penalties called on them. Their opponents in Big 12 play had 64. Texas was 79 to 76. The difference for us is probably because we were not very good. If the Big 12 was out to get Texas you would think they would have been called for a lot more penalties than their opponents.

Did the Big 12 tell the refs, "Be sure and call the games fairly evenly EXCEPT FOR HOLDING!"

It's pretty laughable.

I think you should find better sources instead of using junk stats

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I don’t want to clog a bball board up with football talk but I’m happy to follow up with a PM. From looking at play-by-play data OU had five holds (3 on offense, 2 on ST) called against them in their first three conference games. One was declined, one (Murray against KU) took a TD off the board.

yeah i started going through the games and gave up after showing we had 5 in the first 3 games lol

 

[steverocks35]

I think you should find better sources instead of using junk stats

I acknowledged that the source could be wrong. Again, very difficult to find any good sources for numbers of individual penalties. Many of the sources even differ on numbers.

But my source for the total penalties is the Big 12 website. Is that source good enough for you?

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I acknowledged that the source could be wrong. Again, very difficult to find any good sources for numbers of individual penalties. Many of the sources even differ on numbers.

But my source for the total penalties is the Big 12 website. Is that source good enough for you?

I don't know. It would be most fair to look at all penalties regardless if they were declined or offsetting. I believe the official conference stats don't track that. We would also have to take out the penalties there weren't objective (like false starts and delay of games etc)

 

[steverocks35]

I don't know. It would be most fair to look at all penalties regardless if they were declined or offsetting. I believe the official conference stats don't track that. We would also have to take out the penalties there weren't objective (like false starts and delay of games etc)

Yes, I agree, but people aren't doing that. They're jumping to conclusions based on one cherry-picked stat that may or may not be accurate.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Yes, I agree, but people aren't doing that. They're jumping to conclusions based on one cherry-picked stat that may or may not be accurate.

it's not a cherry picked stats. Holding calls are one of the most subjective calls there are. It could be called on the majority of plays. It seemed to the naked eye (and by stats) that OU and UT came up very short on holding calls

 

[ByronHoustonsSweatyPalms]

I would imagine that most officials work the majority of games for one conference and sprinkle in other conferences as available. That does nothing to stop a conference like the big 12 hiring officials for games and trying to screw OU and texas.

I am not saying I believe this conspiracy. But it certainly is possible.

How to refs get paid? Who pays them? How do they determine which games to ref? Do the hosting teams contact them? Does the league? Do they themselves reach out?

The Illuminati. I heard Beyoncé sing a song about it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

 

[SoonerBounce13]

The Illuminati. I heard Beyoncé sing a song about it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Beyonce sucks

 

[WaymanFan]

I would imagine everyone reading this has dealt with "work politics" at some point in their professional careers. It's not any different with referees. Correct in that they don't care about Oklahoma and Texas bolting for another conference. That said, it's pretty naive to think they don't have bosses or "bosses bosses" who just might care - especially in football.

I remember them talking about this on ESPN before Bedlam football this past year. Since OSU wasn't in the running for the conference title, there was no reason to have bias against OU. Of course, 2021 was completely different season and OSU was in the running. I don't remember who on ESPN said this, but I do remember the exact quote: "I'm not saying the Oklahoma-Oklahoma game was fixed last year, but what I am saying is that every close call went Oklahoma State's way".

 

[paboomersooner]

College basketball refs are not employed by conferences. College football refs are. It's not a mystery. Watch any football noncon game and announcers will say which conference the crew is from. This isn't the case in basketball.

I didn't say employed. The word I used was affiliated. They are independent contractors, probably members of a union, that are probably assigned games by an assigner in their chapter.

I was a HS sports official, I work with a HS football and softball official and I know many others that officiate HS and collegiate sports.

My co-worker is a member of a local chapter and does, primarily, games in that chapter/area. However, if there is a shortage in another chapter, he may be asked to those games.

I understand I'm referencing HS l, however, some of the research I've done and prior knowledge, it sounds like the college and HS systems of officiating are similar.

https://www.cbssports.com/college-b...ho-is-the-best-referee-in-college-basketball/