MBB Transfer Portal Thread: Moser Year 4

TEvans4Three said:
Not really that hard to assume other programs are spending more. Look what Arkansas just did. Providence winning out vs. OU in recruiting. Us losing out to Kansas every single time in the NIL era for players. (Not a surprise there though)

Also, we won't be able to compare Kruger to Moser much bc of how NIL has changed the game. Jay Wright retired for a reason, NIL is that reason. I think Kruger would be struggling bc Kruger is a stand-up, "clean the program", guy. And he did it very well. It is just a different era of basketball, and not in a good way IMO.


Disagree with the empty cupboard as well. Not even close to the same that Moser had, but that excuse is wearing thin now bc we have a new team every year and still miss the tournament. At some point, something has to break. I am ready for Bucky-Ball.
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Do you think Lon had it easier in an era where OU wasn’t able to offer any money while other schools were illegally paying players? At least now, we can offer something.
 
WichitaSooner said:
Do you think Lon had it easier in an era where OU wasn’t able to offer any money while other schools were illegally paying players? At least now, we can offer something.
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Hmm, good question. No, I wouldn't say easier, I would just classify it as vastly different. Guys staying 4 years will be a dying breed. Especially at smaller schools. JUCO one-offs are dying out. I think both coaches were/are hamstrung in their own way. Both coaches are selling you differently now. I think it would be the same if you flipped them. Moser before NIL and Kruger after.

Let me ask a follow-up, do you think Buddy Hield stays at OU if he gets offered $1m to come to play at Kansas or Duke during the NIL era? (let's say our offer is 500k.)
 
Hmm, good question. No, I wouldn't say easier, I would just classify it as vastly different. Guys staying 4 years will be a dying breed. Especially at smaller schools. JUCO one-offs are dying out. I think both coaches were/are hamstrung in their own way. Both coaches are selling you differently now. I think it would be the same if you flipped them. Moser before NIL and Kruger after.Let me ask a follow-up, do you think Buddy Hield stays at OU if he gets offered $1m to come to play at Kansas or Duke during the NIL era? (let's say our offer is 500k.)
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Agree...it all goes back to the real issue being transfers. OU can compete better with a lesser budget if once you got players on campus, they couldn't jump ship without penalty.

We know that legally, it is going to be hard for the NCAA to do anything to cap NIL or prevent transferring.
Maybe a compromise is that if a player transfers, what they are owed in NIL is given back to the university with some type of fee. Make NIL offers 4 year commitment offers. Player A commits to OU to be paid $1mm over 4 years. Player A has a great sophemore year and gets an offer from Kansas that doubles his NIL. He would owe money back to OU that OU can use to get someone else. I don't know, just thinking out loud
 
StoopsBros said:
This is now official

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Last year it seemed to come down to McCollum or Small to OU. I thought at the time they should have gone with Small. He had better overall numbers against tougher competition at East Carolina. I think this past year showed that Small was better. In Big 12 play, Small averaged 15.1, which was the same as his out of conference. McCollum averaged 14.7 in OOC and down to 12.3 in conference play. Small is also bigger and able to guard and rebound at a higher clip.
 
WaymanFan said:
I agree with what you said in the second paragraph, but it's a myth that LK inherited an empty cupboard. When I look at LK's SECOND team (the one which made the Dance), half of the top eight players were guys he inherited. The real gem was Romero Osby - a pretty good player to build one's team around when starting a new era. Having guys like Pledger, Clark, and Fitzgerald to support Osby is not a bad start to a new era. LK was a great coach so that was certainly part of the turnaround - but he had some talent to work with.
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Osby is one of the most criminally underrated OU basketball players. Lon would have been 0.500 at best during those first two years without him.
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
Agree...it all goes back to the real issue being transfers. OU can compete better with a lesser budget if once you got players on campus, they couldn't jump ship without penalty.

We know that legally, it is going to be hard for the NCAA to do anything to cap NIL or prevent transferring.
Maybe a compromise is that if a player transfers, what they are owed in NIL is given back to the university with some type of fee. Make NIL offers 4 year commitment offers. Player A commits to OU to be paid $1mm over 4 years. Player A has a great sophemore year and gets an offer from Kansas that doubles his NIL. He would owe money back to OU that OU can use to get someone else. I don't know, just thinking out loud
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This implies that we are getting kids to Norman and having them leave for higher NIL. That really isn't happening. Uzan, Oweh, and JM are not leaving this year because of NIL. Jacob Groves, Bamisile, Noland, and Cortes, did not leave because of NIL. Schroder did not leave because of NIL. Harkless did not leave because of NIL. The only two that maybe left for NIL were Hill (who oddly enough we adequately replaced) and maybe Gibson.
 
WichitaSooner said:
Do you think Lon had it easier in an era where OU wasn’t able to offer any money while other schools were illegally paying players? At least now, we can offer something.
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yes it was definitely easier to recruit when only a fraction of teams were breaking the rules. The list of teams doing pay for play has grown exponentially in the NIL era, which makes the market for acquiring talent significantly More competitive than before.

Further, there was a decent amount of players who didn’t want to risk being caught cheating previously so they would not take pay for play deals. It was possible to get some very talented players without paying for them then. Now every player can and should accept pay for play.
 
WTSooner said:
This implies that we are getting kids to Norman and having them leave for higher NIL. That really isn't happening. Uzan, Oweh, and JM are not leaving this year because of NIL. Jacob Groves, Bamisile, Noland, and Cortes, did not leave because of NIL. Schroder did not leave because of NIL. Harkless did not leave because of NIL. The only two that maybe left for NIL were Hill (who oddly enough we adequately replaced) and maybe Gibson.
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Sources?
 
WTSooner said:
This implies that we are getting kids to Norman and having them leave for higher NIL. That really isn't happening. Uzan, Oweh, and JM are not leaving this year because of NIL. Jacob Groves, Bamisile, Noland, and Cortes, did not leave because of NIL. Schroder did not leave because of NIL. Harkless did not leave because of NIL. The only two that maybe left for NIL were Hill (who oddly enough we adequately replaced) and maybe Gibson.
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We don't really know that for sure. For most of those, NIL likely was not the primary factor. But without knowing what they were getting at OU vs what they are getting now, it is just a guess.

But besides that, my comment wasn't specific to OU
 
WTSooner said:
This implies that we are getting kids to Norman and having them leave for higher NIL. That really isn't happening. Uzan, Oweh, and JM are not leaving this year because of NIL. Jacob Groves, Bamisile, Noland, and Cortes, did not leave because of NIL. Schroder did not leave because of NIL. Harkless did not leave because of NIL. The only two that maybe left for NIL were Hill (who oddly enough we adequately replaced) and maybe Gibson.
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Didn’t Mo leave because he wanted to play the 1?
 
We were told when Gibson left that it was because he wanted to play PG to improve his pro prospects. Now we've decided it was an NIL thing?

The cupboard was NOT empty when Moser arrived, though it was pretty close to it after he'd been in Norman for a couple of months. But not only could he (potentially) have convinced some of those players to stay, he had those same two months to work the portal, an option Kruger didn't have. And if Moser was widely viewed as the splash hire many have insisted lately that he was, he should have been one of the stars of the portal that spring (no one can claim that NIL was the same factor then that it is now)

And if Kruger had more decent players to start with (just one or two more, if that), he should get credit for that and/or Moser should get a debit for not being able to convince guys to stick around. If one is going to defend Moser by pointing to the supposedly empty cupboard he inherited, one had better praise Kruger for retaining players his first offseason. The next time I see one of the Moser defenders do that, though, will be the first time.

Another head-scratching break Moser gets from his defenders: They sometimes claim he had no time to work the portal after he took the job, but nowadays, when other fans get antsy about the portal in late March or early April, they are pointedly told to relax--it's early days and there's plenty of time. Well, if it's early days now, it was early days then.
 
TINY said:
yes it was definitely easier to recruit when only a fraction of teams were breaking the rules. The list of teams doing pay for play has grown exponentially in the NIL era, which makes the market for acquiring talent significantly More competitive than before.

Further, there was a decent amount of players who didn’t want to risk being caught cheating previously so they would not take pay for play deals. It was possible to get some very talented players without paying for them then. Now every player can and should accept pay for play.
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A few? The universally accepted view a few years ago was that almost every program cheated to varying degrees. That’s why Lon was held in such high regard by his peers and media members: they knew he was damn near one of a kind. I’m sure it varied widely to what degree schools were cheating, but almost everyone was skirting the rules to some degree.
 
Goldberg719 said:
Didn’t Mo leave because he wanted to play the 1?
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Exactly. Other than Hill, there hasn't been ANY NIL talk about players leaving the OU program. None. So we (some of YOU) don't get to recreate history here to fit a narrative.
 
WichitaSooner said:
A few? The universally accepted view a few years ago was that almost every program cheated to varying degrees. That’s why Lon was held in such high regard by his peers and media members: they knew he was damn near one of a kind. I’m sure it varied widely to what degree schools were cheating, but almost everyone was skirting the rules to some degree.
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Driving 5 over is a lot different than 25 over
 
WTSooner said:
Exactly. Other than Hill, there hasn't been ANY NIL talk about players leaving the OU program. None. So we (some of YOU) don't get to recreate history here to fit a narrative.
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Who is trying to rewrite history?
 
SoonerBounce13 said:
Who is trying to rewrite history?
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I wouldn't term your comment below necessarily as rewriting history, but its factually untrue making excuses for our program:

Agree...it all goes back to the real issue being transfers. OU can compete better with a lesser budget if once you got players on campus, they couldn't jump ship without penalty.
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That simply isn't true, as I've shown. Anybody arguing that it is true, or might be true, or really even that we don't know, is trying to recreate/rewrite history.
 
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