Roster and Contribution analysis

[thebigabd]

9 players seem "eligible" to be in the rotation. They are Reaves, Doolittle, Manek, Harmon, Williams, Bienemy, Victor, Kuath, and Jalen Hill.

Of those 9... Victor, Kuath, and Hill do not appear to be "ready" for contribution yet. Too raw. They will not be major contributors against good teams. The minutes and contributions demonstrate that.

That leaves 6 who are "ready" for significant contribution.. Reaves, Doolittle, Manek, Williams, Bienemy, and Harmon.

Of those 6...

1. Bienemy has scored 3 or less points in 7 out of 10 games
2. Harmon has scored 4 or less points in 5 out of 10 games, and has had 0 assists in 3 of 10 games
3. Austin Reaves, averaging 17 per game, is shooting 29% from 3

Manek, Williams, and Doolittle are performing as expected.

Conclusion
OU has a 6 person rotation of reliable players, and 2 of those players are struggling heavily... Austin Reaves is having to do too much, and is therefore shooting a very poor percentage.

This team has no legitimate depth right now... a serious point guard problem... a serious rebounding problem. Main guys literally can't come out of the game, because the drop is too significant.

Fair?

 

[Sooner04]

At the very least, Victor and Hill are five fouls. They are worthy of spelling the starters. Both can snag a rebound here and there. Both appear to have very good motors. There is clay there that can be molded and shaped.

Kuath has no clue how to play D-1 basketball. He shouldn't see any meaningful minutes from here on out.

We have eight. It's a pretty thin eight, but it's eight.

 

[steverocks35]

Absolutely fair and the blame falls squarely on the head coach.

 

[WichitaSooner]

Eight-deep is what you need in college basketball. Ask Bill Self about that -- say what you want about the man, I think he has proven that he knows what it takes to build a team that will be successful over the course of the season. He routinely points out that eight is plenty at the college level. While it would be nice if Kur could play up to expectations, I think we would be fine with Vic, Williams, and Hill off the bench. Bigger issue to me is that too many of the starters, JB and Harmon in particular, aren't getting it done. Reaves is forcing things (somewhat understandably), and is also missing too many open shots. Brady is hot and cold. Right now, Doo is the one guy you can rely on.

Hill intrigues me. He has the athletic ability, motor, and size to be very good defensively. If he can even just contribute a little bit offensively, he could be a factor, especially if two of our starting guards don't produce more than they have.

 

[stormspencer]

At the very least, Victor and Hill are five fouls. They are worthy of spelling the starters. Both can snag a rebound here and there. Both appear to have very good motors. There is clay there that can be molded and shaped.

Kuath has no clue how to play D-1 basketball. He shouldn't see any meaningful minutes from here on out.

We have eight. It's a pretty thin eight, but it's eight.

The frustrating part is that if Kuath could somewhat "figure it out" the few minutes that he is actually on the floor, then he could really help this team from a depth, rebounding, and inside defense perspective. Unfortunately, from having seen what we've seen thus far, him contributing anytime soon should not be the expectation.

 

[stormspencer]

Eight-deep is what you need in college basketball. Ask Bill Self about that -- say what you want about the man, I think he has proven that he knows what it takes to build a team that will be successful over the course of the season. He routinely points out that eight is plenty at the college level. While it would be nice if Kur could play up to expectations, I think we would be fine with Vic, Williams, and Hill off the bench. Bigger issue to me is that too many of the starters, JB and Harmon in particular, aren't getting it done. Reaves is forcing things (somewhat understandably), and is also missing too many open shots. Brady is hot and cold. Right now, Doo is the one guy you can rely on.

Hill intrigues me. He has the athletic ability, motor, and size to be very good defensively. If he can even just contribute a little bit offensively, he could be a factor, especially if two of our starting guards don't produce more than they have.

Agree 100%. Outside of Williams, I think Hill is our last realistic option for contribution and "quality" depth over the next month. I think he needs to be on the court more....and maybe his comfort level and confidence can grow. But while he is out there, he needs to be the guy "that does the little things" along with some occasional scoring.....much like JB did last year.

I like Vic's energy, but he is just so raw. Yet, we still have to play him some minutes or we risk running Manek and Doo into the ground.

 

[CoachTalk]

Somewhat fair.

Victor can help this year and hill can.

As stated above. Starters aren’t getting it done. End of story.
7-8-9 guys are role guys for 2-3 mins spurts at a time.

 

[thebigabd]

Somewhat fair.

Victor can help this year and hill can.

As stated above. Starters aren’t getting it done. End of story.
7-8-9 guys are role guys for 2-3 mins spurts at a time.

Are you sure about that? Jalen Hill has scored 3 or less points in 8 of 10 games. He is either being held back by Lon Kruger, or he isn't ready to play a meaningful role yet.

That being said.... the assumption of progress from Jamal Bienemy is likely the #1 problem on the team. If Bienemy developed in the way we all thought or hoped from last year to this year, he would be a serviceable (at worst) combo guard who could play in tandem with Reaves to provide a good backcourt.

 

[thebigabd]

Eight-deep is what you need in college basketball. Ask Bill Self about that -- say what you want about the man, I think he has proven that he knows what it takes to build a team that will be successful over the course of the season. He routinely points out that eight is plenty at the college level. While it would be nice if Kur could play up to expectations, I think we would be fine with Vic, Williams, and Hill off the bench. Bigger issue to me is that too many of the starters, JB and Harmon in particular, aren't getting it done. Reaves is forcing things (somewhat understandably), and is also missing too many open shots. Brady is hot and cold. Right now, Doo is the one guy you can rely on.

Hill intrigues me. He has the athletic ability, motor, and size to be very good defensively. If he can even just contribute a little bit offensively, he could be a factor, especially if two of our starting guards don't produce more than they have.

OU is only getting reasonable contributions from 6, not 8. 8 are playing out of necessity, but I would argue that OU is actually 6 deep. And a few of those 6 aren't performing.

 

[OUsky]

Hill played efficiently the other night. You do not have to score to be an effective bench player... as long as you aren’t taking unadvised shots. Play tough de, rebound and pass the ball. Know your role.

By the way, it’s a great night.

 

[MJSooner]

Are you sure about that? Jalen Hill has scored 3 or less points in 8 of 10 games. He is either being held back by Lon Kruger, or he isn't ready to play a meaningful role yet.

That being said.... the assumption of progress from Jamal Bienemy is likely the #1 problem on the team. If Bienemy developed in the way we all thought or hoped from last year to this year, he would be a serviceable (at worst) combo guard who could play in tandem with Reaves to provide a good backcourt.

I agree with this 100%. JB is giving us nothing on the offensive end. You would like to see Harmon at least dishing for baskets but his assists total is showing something is missing. And Reaves' outside shot has not been strong at all. Our guard play is an issue and that is surprising. Both JB and Harmon seems hesitant and, at times, Reaves tries to take over like Trae, but without the production.

As frustrating as Brady's inconsistency is, other than rebounding, our biggest issue is the offensive production and shooting percentage from our guards. Teams will start playing us like they did Gottlieb or Jacque Vaughn.

 

[vbdad]

Kuath has been a huge disappointment. He looked good in the early practices. He has completely disappeared so far this season.
Hill and Vic have great potential but aren't ready yet. I would continue to play them though in hopes that they will continue to grow. Vic's athleticism is still off the charts. He is the only guy we have on the team that knows what an offensive rebound is.

 

[OULad]

If our guard play doesnt get better fast, we will be lucky to win 3 games in conference.

 

[Sooner04]

Iwuakor also stopped playing high school basketball two years ago. It's going to take a while to wash the AAU stench off of him because it's been a long time since he's played anything other than glorified street ball. He's a fouling machine!

:eddie187_jpg_xs:

 

[daqman]

So we don't have much better talent than last year like most posters proclaimed before the season?
There hasn't been an upgrade at every position?

We either have a talent problem or a coaching problem. And a talent problem over multiple years is of course, a coaching problem.

Looking forward to the day Kruger retires.

 

[WichitaSooner]

So we don't have much better talent than last year like most posters proclaimed before the season?
There hasn't been an upgrade at every position?

We either have a talent problem or a coaching problem. And a talent problem over multiple years is of course, a coaching problem.

Looking forward to the day Kruger retires.

Or we have an overreaction problem based on two straight losses. Just a crazy possibility.

 

[thebigabd]

Or we have an overreaction problem based on two straight losses. Just a crazy possibility.

This thread is not based on wins or losses. It is based on an assessment of contributions by the players on roster. Winning and losing is not what is being discussed.

 

[sperry]

Why is 67 year old Lon Kruger our head coach still? What is the end game? What are we building towards? It just makes no sense to me. Lon did a great job of stabilizing the program. He made a ton of money doing it, and we can give him a nice golden parachute on his way out. But go get your next guy to lead this program.

 

[NY Soonerfan]

9 players seem "eligible" to be in the rotation. They are Reaves, Doolittle, Manek, Harmon, Williams, Bienemy, Victor, Kuath, and Jalen Hill.

Of those 9... Victor, Kuath, and Hill do not appear to be "ready" for contribution yet. Too raw. They will not be major contributors against good teams. The minutes and contributions demonstrate that.

That leaves 6 who are "ready" for significant contribution.. Reaves, Doolittle, Manek, Williams, Bienemy, and Harmon.

Of those 6...

1. Bienemy has scored 3 or less points in 7 out of 10 games
2. Harmon has scored 4 or less points in 5 out of 10 games, and has had 0 assists in 3 of 10 games
3. Austin Reaves, averaging 17 per game, is shooting 29% from 3

Manek, Williams, and Doolittle are performing as expected.

Conclusion
OU has a 6 person rotation of reliable players, and 2 of those players are struggling heavily... Austin Reaves is having to do too much, and is therefore shooting a very poor percentage.

This team has no legitimate depth right now... a serious point guard problem... a serious rebounding problem. Main guys literally can't come out of the game, because the drop is too significant.

Fair?

I think this is dead-on. We have a very top-heavy roster of contributors, and the problem is the rest of the would-be contributors are not-B12 caliber players, or, at the very least, certainly not B12 caliber players right now (Hill, Kuath, Victor). And, I'm sad to say, I do not think Bieniemy is a B12 caliber player, or at least not one who would be contributing 27-33 mins a game on a top-5 B12 team.

My biggest problem with the roster construction is that we are relying on too many "what-ifs" to try to make up the rotation. A lot of people have clamored to go the JUCO route (I'm not sure if you did Big) and I think in this instance, with THIS particular team, it would have been great to add a legit JUCO who would step in and start. A graduate transfer would have worked nicely too. If that was the case, then it allows the growing pains of a Hill, Kuath, and Victor to occur and not hurt the team, and/or force the others to take up way too many minutes. I feel like we have seen Kuath about five different times during Kruger's tenure, and that player is and always will be a 200-1 project. To think we were going to get any kind of meaningful contribution from him in his first season is just asking for way too much.

And, for better or worse, it will only get worse as the conference season starts. If Hill, Kuath, and Victor can barely get on the court now, and do very little when they do, that will only shrink once we get into the rigors of B12 play.

Some may say it's an overreaction off two straight losses, others might say they are two of the best teams we have played all year, and we lost them both. High-fiving after beating also-rans doesn't really do any good when we've lost to the three best teams we've played. Those are much more telling, IMO.

 

[daqman]

Or we have an overreaction problem based on two straight losses. Just a crazy possibility.

It's actually a reaction based on watching many years of Sooner basketball and realizing Lon's recent teams are failing to living up to expectations. Coupled with no confidence the trend will change under Kruger's leadership.