The Big 12 has accepted UCF, Cincy, Houston, and BYU

[BoulderSooner]

Re: So we may be seeing the Big 12 RIP.

I hate that I am partaking in this kind of banter.... because, again, it's ridiculous that we as fans are doing so and that the sport is in this position in the first place.

Let's use Wyoming as an example. It's obscure. Mountain West. Lowest population in the nation. Very little TV money.

Wyoming's TV Money: $4 million per year
Head Coach: Craig Bohl
Salary: $1.5 million
Wyoming Football Facility: High Altitude Sports Complex
Link: https://gowyo.com/facilities/high-altitude-performance-center/23

Now lets look at.... Arkansas. SEC team. SEC television money. Etc.

Arkansas TV Money: $55 million per year
Head Coach: Sam Pittman
Salary: $3 million per year
Arkansas Football Facility: Fred W. Smith Football Center
Link: https://flintco.com/our-work/projects/university-of-arkansas-fred-w-smith-football-center/

There is barely a discernable difference between their training facilities.... Arkansas obviously has a much larger stadium... because its not in Wyoming. They make a ga-jillion more in TV money and pay their coach double. Get nothing for it. Hell, I'd probably hire Craig Bohl over Sam Pittman anyway....

You'd be stunned at how all these training facilities look exactly the same... Go look up Wyoming, San Diego State, Boise State, BYU, etc... compare it to SEC and Big 12 teams. They look exactly the same. The big difference is stadium sizes. But even a lot of those stadiums were built a long time go and just got renovated. It's not like modern TV money funded the construction of Gaylord Memorial Stadium or any of these other venues.

So, you are saying the estimates for the "new" Big 12 will be $15 or $20 million a year, right? So Wyoming pays its coach $1.5 million with $4 million in TV money... but you don't think Kansas State can pay Chris Klieman the $2.5 million per year he is used to with $20 million in TV money?

And all that TV money seems to be doing jack **** for Arkansas, Vanderbilt, Kentucky, etc... This whole thing is just so overblown...

And, by the way, with OU and Texas joining the SEC, these cannon fodder programs are getting even more cannon foddery. At this point they are just lining pockets to build fancy new crap I guess. They have no real interest in winning.

recruting budget .. . .support staff .. and everything else will go down for the remaining big 12 schools

 

[SoonerBounce13]

Re: So we may be seeing the Big 12 RIP.

I hate that I am partaking in this kind of banter.... because, again, it's ridiculous that we as fans are doing so and that the sport is in this position in the first place.

Let's use Wyoming as an example. It's obscure. Mountain West. Lowest population in the nation. Very little TV money.

Wyoming's TV Money: $4 million per year
Head Coach: Craig Bohl
Salary: $1.5 million
Wyoming Football Facility: High Altitude Sports Complex
Link: https://gowyo.com/facilities/high-altitude-performance-center/23

Now lets look at.... Arkansas. SEC team. SEC television money. Etc.

Arkansas TV Money: $55 million per year
Head Coach: Sam Pittman
Salary: $3 million per year
Arkansas Football Facility: Fred W. Smith Football Center
Link: https://flintco.com/our-work/projects/university-of-arkansas-fred-w-smith-football-center/

There is barely a discernable difference between their training facilities.... Arkansas obviously has a much larger stadium... because its not in Wyoming. They make a ga-jillion more in TV money and pay their coach double. Get nothing for it. Hell, I'd probably hire Craig Bohl over Sam Pittman anyway....

You'd be stunned at how all these training facilities look exactly the same... Go look up Wyoming, San Diego State, Boise State, BYU, etc... compare it to SEC and Big 12 teams. They look exactly the same. The big difference is stadium sizes. But even a lot of those stadiums were built a long time go and just got renovated. It's not like modern TV money funded the construction of Gaylord Memorial Stadium or any of these other venues.

So, you are saying the estimates for the "new" Big 12 will be $15 or $20 million a year, right? So Wyoming pays its coach $1.5 million with $4 million in TV money... but you don't think Kansas State can pay Chris Klieman the $2.5 million per year he is used to with $20 million in TV money?

And all that TV money seems to be doing jack **** for Arkansas, Vanderbilt, Kentucky, etc... This whole thing is just so overblown...

And, by the way, with OU and Texas joining the SEC, these cannon fodder programs are getting even more cannon foddery. At this point they are just lining pockets to build fancy new crap I guess. They have no real interest in winning.

:ez-laugh:

 

[hoopsaustin]

Re: So we may be seeing the Big 12 RIP.

Arkansas Recruiting Rankings
2015 Recruiting Rank - 25
2016 Recruiting Rank - 30
2017 Recruiting Rank - 24
2018 Recruiting Rank - 61
2019 Recruiting Rank - 20
2020 Recruiting Rank - 41
2021 Recruiting Rank - 25

Average Since 2015: 32.2

$55 million a year in TV money, SEC recruiting territory, and top 30 recruiting classes is good enough to go 12-38 in SEC play since 2015. Including two 0-8 finishes and a 1-7 finish.

Boise State Recruiting Rankings
2015 Recruiting Rank: 64
2016 Recruiting Rank: 54
2017 Recruiting Rank: 66
2018 Recruiting Rank: 56
2019 Recruiting Rank: 63
2020 Recruiting Rank: 88
2021 Recruiting Rank: 77

Average Since 2015: 66.8

Boise has won the Mountain West 6 out of 7 times in this span and been a regular fixture in the top 25.

I am guessing Boise State fans are happier than Arkansas fans. They have a reason to show up to the stadium and watch their team play. They aren't cannon fodder.

No one cares about bsu. And imagine in 20 years what the differences look like

 

[thebigabd]

https://www.espn.com/college-footba...-adding-byu-cincinnati-houston-ucf-conference

 

[WTSooner]

Again, I think this will be a fun little conference. There is an outside part of me that hopes OU stays in the league long enough to play with these other teams for a season or two. Would love an OU football trip to UCF, and Lord knows an OU/Houston bball game would be fun.

I'll be rooting for the Big 12 after we leave. I hate that its working out this way, but I understand it. OU football better get their crap together, but SEC athletes ain't no joke.

 

[thebigabd]

Again, I think this will be a fun little conference.

Lol.

I'll be rooting for the Big 12 after we leave. I hate that its working out this way, but I understand it. OU football better get their crap together, but SEC athletes ain't no joke.

I will definitely be following and pulling for this league... I still think it's a mistake not to go to 14 and grab Boise and Memphis, but maybe they will, who knows.

I will be particularly interested in UCF, Cincy, and Houston from a recruiting perspective. Both sports.

As for OU.... they'll get their money, but my stance on the outcome remains unchanged... They won't be top dog anymore, lose more games, and the fans will hate it.... Not only will national championships be harder to come across, but conference championships won't be as accessible as well. My gut tells me OU fans won't like that.

 

[BCSooners]

Lol.



I will definitely be following and pulling for this league... I still think it's a mistake not to go to 14 and grab Boise and Memphis, but maybe they will, who knows.

I will be particularly interested in UCF, Cincy, and Houston from a recruiting perspective. Both sports.

As for OU.... they'll get their money, but my stance on the outcome remains unchanged... They won't be top dog anymore, lose more games, and the fans will hate it.... Not only will national championships be harder to come across, but conference championships won't be as accessible as well. My gut tells me OU fans won't like that.

I don't think this. Being able to dip into SEC territory for better recruiting will help with overall talent, bettering the chance at a National Title. Now conference championships will be much tougher to accomplish.

 

[thebigabd]

I don't think this. Being able to dip into SEC territory for better recruiting will help with overall talent, bettering the chance at a National Title. Now conference championships will be much tougher to accomplish.

I am still trying to figure out if that recruiting territory expansion helps OU or Texas or more....

 

[BCSooners]

I am still trying to figure out if that recruiting territory expansion helps OU or Texas or more....

I don't know, I'd say Texas since they have Sark now and he'll go recruit that area. But past coaches at UT rarely went outside of the state. OU has already proven it will and can go out of state, but this helps them with that area.

 

[WTSooner]

I am still trying to figure out if that recruiting territory expansion helps OU or Texas or more....

I don't think it helps either as much as some people think it will.

Kids in Florida go to Bama/Georgia/Tennessee because of location/proximity, not just because they are in the SEC.

OU and Texas will probably recruit a little better in Texas and maybe West Louisiana, but I'm not expecting us to start pulling in multiple 5* kids per class from the deep south.

 

[thebigabd]

I don't think this. Being able to dip into SEC territory for better recruiting will help with overall talent, bettering the chance at a National Title. Now conference championships will be much tougher to accomplish.

You are making some assumptions here that I would question.

1.) Thinking that the better talent is only going to OU. It will also go to Texas and Texas A&M from this area. Texas may have the most to gain. We don't know.

2.) That the beefed up conference won't also help Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, etc. Players who would have gone to the ACC, Big 10, etc from the area might land at these schools who want to play in a beefed up league. It could damage Clemson, Florida State, etc but not benefit OU at all. The opposite, in fact, with players from that area.

3.) Let's look at the recruiting rankings from last 6 years.

2016: #16 class
2017: #7 class
2018: #8 class
2019: #5 class
2020: #16 class
2021: #13 class

Average: 10.8

Now lets look at Georgia. A team with no national titles in this timeframe.

2016: #9
2017: #3
2018: #1
2019: #1
2020: #1
2021: #5

Average: 3.3

Now, lets look at Tennessee. A team that has sucked for a long time.

2016: #16
2017: #15
2018: #20
2019: #13
2020: #8
2021: #27

Average: 16.5

An average of 16.5 has yielded a 14-28 conference record.

Color me skeptical that the recruiting landscape is going to change much for OU... SEC-area kids grow up wanting to play for Alabama, Georgia, Florida, Tennesee, LSU, etc.

I am trying to illustrate difficulty.... Teams with loads of talent aren't winning nattys over there. Teams that recruit really darn well are getting their ass beat in that league.

 

[skyvue]

If the SEC, in and of itself, were such a magical force, the conference's worst teams would be better than they are. Where's that big SEC bump in recruiting and on-field success for Mizzou, for example?

I will say this: When we do start SEC play, OU had better get off to a fast start. It doesn't necessarily take very long to lose blueblood status (don't believe me--just ask Nebraska). Go 8-4 or 9-3 three or four years in a row, with no major bowl appearances, and you're all but forgotten. Results like that won't help us attract all that southern talent.

We're stepping out of our comfort zone (and into a conference that has a pretty slimy culture), and we'd better show we can hang from the jump or we may have stepped out onto a slippery slope that leads to a long downward slide.

 

[BCSooners]

You are making some assumptions here that I would question.

1.) Thinking that the better talent is only going to OU. It will also go to Texas and Texas A&M from this area. Texas may have the most to gain. We don't know.

2.) That the beefed up conference won't also help Alabama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, etc. Players who would have gone to the ACC, Big 10, etc from the area might land at these schools who want to play in a beefed up league. It could damage Clemson, Florida State, etc but not benefit OU at all. The opposite, in fact, with players from that area.

3.) Let's look at the recruiting rankings from last 6 years.

2016: #16 class
2017: #7 class
2018: #8 class
2019: #5 class
2020: #16 class
2021: #13 class

Average: 10.8

Now lets look at Georgia. A team with no national titles in this timeframe.

2016: #9
2017: #3
2018: #1
2019: #1
2020: #1
2021: #5

Average: 3.3

Now, lets look at Tennessee. A team that has sucked for a long time.

2016: #16
2017: #15
2018: #20
2019: #13
2020: #8
2021: #27

Average: 16.5

An average of 16.5 has yielded a 14-28 conference record.

Color me skeptical that the recruiting landscape is going to change much for OU... SEC-area kids grow up wanting to play for Alabama, Georgia, Florida, Tennesee, LSU, etc.

I am trying to illustrate difficulty.... Teams with loads of talent aren't winning nattys over there. Teams that recruit really darn well are getting their ass beat in that league.

I guarantee OU will get more players from those areas with the ability to say they’ll play in their region 3-4 times a year. It will also help overall talent, the NFL draft is proof of that.

It’s not just about recruiting, you have to develop and coach the talent. That’s where Texas, Tennessee, ect. have struggled.

Heck LSU dominated to a nat’l championship with a bad coach because they had insane talent & great assistants.

 

[Eielson]

It's insane to me that people on here still think that being in the SEC won't help recruiting. I'm not even sure it's worth discussing further

 

[sheepdogs1]

It's insane to me that people on here still think that being in the SEC won't help recruiting. I'm not even sure it's worth discussing further

.


Did you know television is a fad?

 

[Max Power]

.


Did you know television is a fad?

This internet thing will never work

 

[sheepdogs1]

This internet thing will never work

That too and you can throw on top of that the advent of the automobile.

 

[NickZepp]

Doesn't matter if it helps recruiting. This is about money. With the TV deals the SEC has that's what this is all about. Not just their conference deal which has not been signed. ESPN signed a record deal for the SEC game of the week and championship game that was more than any other conference deal going forward. We still have no real idea what the exact numbers will be for the next TV deal but it's probably gonna be alltogether around 70-90 million range per university in the SEC now. That's the big difference and how it helps not just the football programs but the basketball programs and baseball and softball. OU is going to at east double the pay they are getting each year most likely. A new basketball arena is probably going to happen in the relative near future. Hopefully before LNC turns 50 years old in a couple years. Softball will get new facilities for a program that's already the best in the country. I'm sure we'll se a new baseball stadium in Norman too. That's the real thing that this will help. The only thing standing in the way of any of these is the city council. And if OU is paying more for them it'll let them happen easier

I'm sure competitively OU will be fine against the SEC especially when you have teams like Vandy, Miss State, Kentucky, Tennessee, South Carolina, Missouri, Arkansas that have been pretty terrible for most of the last decade or more.

 

[thebigabd]

If the SEC, in and of itself, were such a magical force, the conference's worst teams would be better than they are. Where's that big SEC bump in recruiting and on-field success for Mizzou, for example?

I will say this: When we do start SEC play, OU had better get off to a fast start. It doesn't necessarily take very long to lose blueblood status (don't believe me--just ask Nebraska). Go 8-4 or 9-3 three or four years in a row, with no major bowl appearances, and you're all but forgotten. Results like that won't help us attract all that southern talent.

We're stepping out of our comfort zone (and into a conference that has a pretty slimy culture), and we'd better show we can hang from the jump or we may have stepped out onto a slippery slope that leads to a long downward slide.

This

 

[152219]

If the SEC, in and of itself, were such a magical force, the conference's worst teams would be better than they are. Where's that big SEC bump in recruiting and on-field success for Mizzou, for example?

I will say this: When we do start SEC play, OU had better get off to a fast start. It doesn't necessarily take very long to lose blueblood status (don't believe me--just ask Nebraska). Go 8-4 or 9-3 three or four years in a row, with no major bowl appearances, and you're all but forgotten. Results like that won't help us attract all that southern talent.

We're stepping out of our comfort zone (and into a conference that has a pretty slimy culture), and we'd better show we can hang from the jump or we may have stepped out onto a slippery slope that leads to a long downward slide.

NU's slide started before they left for the Big 10. Since Solich left Lincoln, NU has lost at least 4 games every season. That is 17 straight seasons and if they lose 4 this year, it will make 18. I have a tough time seeing OU having a poor run for that long.