What would our record be if Calvin Newell didn't transfer?

[bgrch1350]

I honestly don't know the answers to your questions, outside of Grooms I haven't seen any of those guys play a single second of basketball.

Seriously, help me out here, why are Alex Caruso & J-Mychal Reese better players than Jelon Hornbeak & Buddy Hield? And just how much better are they?

B/c those guys are dominating on the AAU circuits, not just in their high school division. They go to a bunch of camps during the summer and perform at a much higher level then Hornbeak and Hield. Our guards are good...but your looking at 2 maybe 3 years or even 4 years for these guys to be solid contributors. Just like Tyler Neal. Oklahoma POY. But ranked as a 2 or 3 star recruit. And right now we are 2 years in with him and look how much he is contributing. Willis was ranked were Hield was and look how much he progressed...hardly at all.

 

[StatGeek]

B/c those guys are dominating on the AAU circuits, not just in their high school division. They go to a bunch of camps during the summer and perform at a much higher level then Hornbeak and Hield. Our guards are good...but your looking at 2 maybe 3 years or even 4 years for these guys to be solid contributors. Just like Tyler Neal. Oklahoma POY. But ranked as a 2 or 3 star recruit. And right now we are 2 years in with him and look how much he is contributing. Willis was ranked were Hield was and look how much he progressed...hardly at all.

So Caruso & Reese are immediate impact guys and Hornbeak & Hield are players needing a few seasons to develop and they will only contribute at a Neal or Willis level? That doesn't sound good. I can see why you are so down. I guess we will have to hope for the best and see how it actually plays out.

 

[stoops4pres]

I am pretty sure he was not a consensus top 100 player but I could be wrong about that. Tyler Neal was the Oklahoma Player of the Year and I am pretty sure he was not ranked.

True, but the talent in Oklahoma isn't as deep as it is in Louisiana.

I don't know for certain, but I find it much more hard to believe that a Louisiana POY that lead their team to a state championship (in the largest classification) wasn't a Top 100 recruit.

 

[DenverSooner]

True, but the talent in Oklahoma isn't as deep as it is in Louisiana.

I don't know for certain, but I find it much more hard to believe that a Louisiana POY that lead their team to a state championship (in the largest classification) wasn't a Top 100 recruit.

Why would you say that? I don't know of any great players from Louisiana (maybe Pistol Pete?). I am sure they exist but I will give you a list off the top of my head from Okalhoma that were descent NBA players (and some were all stars): Alvin Adams, Wayman Tisdale, John Starks, Eaton Thomas, Mark Price, Big Country, Stacy King, Lee Maybury, and Blake Griffin.

Louisiana is very poor and has about as bad a system of generational welfare as anywhere in the country. I just don't think that state is putting out an abnormally high level of talent.

 

[stoops4pres]

Why would you say that? I don't know of any great players from Louisiana (maybe Pistol Pete?). I am sure they exist but I will give you a list off the top of my head from Okalhoma that were descent NBA players (and some were all stars): Alvin Adams, Wayman Tisdale, John Starks, Eaton Thomas, Mark Price, Big Country, Stacy King, Lee Maybury, and Blake Griffin.

I'm not going to get in a long debate about this, because you obviously aren't aware that Louisiana actually has put out players that have had lengthy careers. A simple search on the internet should suffice for you. Top-heavy wise the two states are certainly comparable, but depth year-to-year I would say Louisiana has more talent. At least that's how it was when I played in the AAU circuit, frequently playing in both states.

Louisiana is very poor and has about as bad a system of generational welfare as anywhere in the country. I just don't think that state is putting out an abnormally high level of talent.

You're joking, right? Then explain why Louisiana is always considered to be one of the elite states when it comes to producing talent in football? A poor state with a subpar welfare system affects only basketball players, but not football players?

 

[campbest]

Why would you say that? I don't know of any great players from Louisiana (maybe Pistol Pete?). I am sure they exist but I will give you a list off the top of my head from Okalhoma that were descent NBA players (and some were all stars): Alvin Adams, Wayman Tisdale, John Starks, Eaton Thomas, Mark Price, Big Country, Stacy King, Lee Maybury, and Blake Griffin.

Louisiana is very poor and has about as bad a system of generational welfare as anywhere in the country. I just don't think that state is putting out an abnormally high level of talent.

I don't know...maybe the all time leading scorer in NBA history Karl Malone?

 

[jmizzy4ou]

I don't know...maybe the all time leading scorer in NBA history Karl Malone?

I believe the Mailman may be 2nd, but Kareem is the all time leading scorer. LA has had some great hoopsteras in the past, and their AAU teams usuallly are pretty good state to state.

 

[campbest]

I believe the Mailman may be 2nd, but Kareem is the all time leading scorer. LA has had some great hoopsteras in the past, and their AAU teams usuallly are pretty good state to state.

Correct. Next time just PM the info, so I don't look as stupid and weaken my point.

 

[jmizzy4ou]

Correct. Next time just PM the info, so I don't look as stupid and weaken my point.

:clap:clap

Will do. I actually think you get a pass on that one because you usually bring the heat.

 

[DenverSooner]

I don't know...maybe the all time leading scorer in NBA history Karl Malone?

So you have named one guy from Louisiana Tech that I assume also grew up in Louisiana but that doesn't remotely support the conclusion that Louisiana has a higher percentage of good basketball players than any other place in the country.

 

[DenverSooner]

I'm not going to get in a long debate about this, because you obviously aren't aware that Louisiana actually has put out players that have had lengthy careers. A simple search on the internet should suffice for you. Top-heavy wise the two states are certainly comparable, but depth year-to-year I would say Louisiana has more talent. At least that's how it was when I played in the AAU circuit, frequently playing in both states.



You're joking, right? Then explain why Louisiana is always considered to be one of the elite states when it comes to producing talent in football? A poor state with a subpar welfare system affects only basketball players, but not football players?

I don't think of Louisiana as putting out an inordinate amount of anything (other than welfare recipients - Louisiana does excel at producing welfare recipients), including football players. 247 lists one kid from Louisiana in the Top 100 for football. That is most certainly not an inordinate number of players.

 

[skyvue]

I don't think of Louisiana as putting out an inordinate amount of anything (other than welfare recipients - Louisiana does excel at producing welfare recipients)

Louisiana ranks 34th in the country in welfare recipients per capita. That's a little worse than Oklahoma (42nd), but not so much worse as to warrant such comments.

Both states get significantly more money back from the federal government than they put in, so finger-pointing like this is a questionable practice.

 

[campbest]

So you have named one guy from Louisiana Tech that I assume also grew up in Louisiana but that doesn't remotely support the conclusion that Louisiana has a higher percentage of good basketball players than any other place in the country.

Current Lousiana players in the NBA:
Glen Davis
Tyrus Thomas
DJ Augustin
Chris Duhon
Brandon Bass
Danny Granger
Paul Millsap
Greg Monroe
Marcus Thornton

Oklahoma:
Blake Griffin
Epke Udoh
Shelden Williams

Nothing against Oklahoma, but HS basketball in Louisiana is generally considered a better breeding ground for Division I and NBA talent than OK. Obviously there are a few years that would be an exception.

 

[campbest]

I don't think of Louisiana as putting out an inordinate amount of anything (other than welfare recipients - Louisiana does excel at producing welfare recipients), including football players. 247 lists one kid from Louisiana in the Top 100 for football. That is most certainly not an inordinate number of players.

Because only 100 kids a year get big time football scholarships.

 

[stoops4pres]

I don't think of Louisiana as putting out an inordinate amount of anything (other than welfare recipients - Louisiana does excel at producing welfare recipients), including football players. 247 lists one kid from Louisiana in the Top 100 for football. That is most certainly not an inordinate number of players.

If you think this is the case, then you clearly do not keep up with football. Observe the link, and you'll see that Louisiana produced more Division 1 football prospects than almost every state in the U.S. And that is usually the case year-by-year.

http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1182411

Point being, the theory that there is a correlation between welfare recipients and high school talent is a flawed one. If that were true, Louisiana wouldn't be one of the nation's leaders in producing football talent, and a great state for breeding basketball players. See campbest's post for proof on the basketball aspect. Oklahoma definitely is a competitive state, it's just that Louisiana produces more athletes from a depth standpoint.

 

[stoops4pres]

So you have named one guy from Louisiana Tech that I assume also grew up in Louisiana but that doesn't remotely support the conclusion that Louisiana has a higher percentage of good basketball players than any other place in the country.

No one said they produce more than any other place, just that they produce more than the majority of any other place.

 

[DenverSooner]

If you think this is the case, then you clearly do not keep up with football. Observe the link, and you'll see that Louisiana produced more Division 1 football prospects than almost every state in the U.S. And that is usually the case year-by-year.

http://highschool.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1182411

Point being, the theory that there is a correlation between welfare recipients and high school talent is a flawed one. If that were true, Louisiana wouldn't be one of the nation's leaders in producing football talent, and a great state for breeding basketball players. See campbest's post for proof on the basketball aspect. Oklahoma definitely is a competitive state, it's just that Louisiana produces more athletes from a depth standpoint.

I am not suggesting Oklahoma produces more talent than Louisiana. I would not expect that to be the case either. I would expect the states to produce top athletes on a per capita basis at very similar rates. I would expect the state of Texas to produce substantially more top athletes than Oklahoma or Louisiana becasue Texas has a substantially higher population. Therefore, if all three states are sending 1% of its population to division 1 schools, Texas sends more kids to division 1 schools.

I would also expect to see a lack of discretionary income to adversely impact the number of athletes because discretionary income creates more opportunity. Logically that makes sense to me.

 

[stoops4pres]

I am not suggesting Oklahoma produces more talent than Louisiana. I would not expect that to be the case either.

That's not what you were implying earlier, but fair enough.

I would also expect to see a lack of discretionary income to adversely impact the number of athletes because discretionary income creates more opportunity. Logically that makes sense to me.

You said that they weren't putting out abnormally high levels of talent, and tied the welfare system into your opinion. Despite their subpar infrastructure, they are still an elite state for producing high school talent. Simple as that.

 

[StatGeek]

B/c those guys are dominating on the AAU circuits, not just in their high school division. They go to a bunch of camps during the summer and perform at a much higher level then Hornbeak and Hield. Our guards are good...but your looking at 2 maybe 3 years or even 4 years for these guys to be solid contributors. Just like Tyler Neal. Oklahoma POY. But ranked as a 2 or 3 star recruit. And right now we are 2 years in with him and look how much he is contributing. Willis was ranked were Hield was and look how much he progressed...hardly at all.

Bump

Sorry

 

[oudna]

And since then we've gone to all sorts of new lows.

Rock bottom.