Winning Season

[StatGeek]

What are the odds we end the season with a winning record? Two weeks ago I would have said 90% but right now I'd say its more like 33%. What say you?

 

[seniorsooner]

Damn, this season got really depressing, really fast. If we finish with a losing record I am going to be EXTREMELY disappointed with the job Kruger has done this year.

 

[SoMuchDramaInTheLNC]

Damn, this season got really depressing, really fast. If we finish with a losing record I am going to be EXTREMELY disappointed with the job Kruger has done this year.

I will not be disappointed in Kruger this season. I really think he's doing his best. Some of you are going to hate this, but this season's struggles are ultimately Capel's fault for a. maintaining a loser mentality the past two seasons and b. recruiting too many players who clearly aren't consistent Big XII performers. Like I've been saying, our program's problems go beyond coaching; the expectation to win hasn't been here since early 2009. Remember the beginning of the season when the players kept raving about the confidence Kruger and his staff was giving them? Well, now that the wins aren't coming and there aren't any Coppin States (no offense, Fang) to buffer the tough ones like OOC, I think it's easy for them to get down on themselves because that's what Capel apparently allowed.

Before the Tech debacle, outside of the second halves of the KU games, @Mizzou, and St. Louis, they mostly played their asses off. And I think that the Tech loss will light another fire under them and we'll see better effort; I see them beating OSU, A&M, and maybe, MAYBE Texas on Tuesday, depending on which UT shows up and how ****ed off we are. But I think 6-12 is the ceiling right now, unfortunately.

Bottom line: this is a program that has forgotten how to win. I thought they turned a corner with their win at KSU, but I guess not. Looking forward, I bet they will improve with another year under Kruger next year: say, 18-22 wins (NIT/NCAA bubble), the higher end of that spectrum if Kruger signs another 3-point assassin, then a roster that's largely his (but young) in '13-'14 will struggle again, then '14-'15 will be a breakthrough. This is the unfortunate impact of a ****ty coach on a program: he gets to run us into the ground, then go home to Duke scot-free while someone else cleans up his mess.

 

[jerry]

I will not be disappointed in Kruger this season. I really think he's doing his best. Some of you are going to hate this, but this season's struggles are ultimately Capel's fault for a. maintaining a loser mentality the past two seasons and b. recruiting too many players who clearly aren't consistent Big XII performers. Like I've been saying, our program's problems go beyond coaching; the expectation to win hasn't been here since early 2009. Remember the beginning of the season when the players kept raving about the confidence Kruger and his staff was giving them? Well, now that the wins aren't coming and there aren't any Coppin States (no offense, Fang) to buffer the tough ones like OOC, I think it's easy for them to get down on themselves because that's what Capel apparently allowed.

Before the Tech debacle, outside of the second halves of the KU games, @Mizzou, and St. Louis, they mostly played their asses off. And I think that the Tech loss will light another fire under them and we'll see better effort; I see them beating OSU, A&M, and maybe, MAYBE Texas on Tuesday, depending on which UT shows up and how ****ed off we are. But I think 6-12 is the ceiling right now, unfortunately.

Bottom line: this is a program that has forgotten how to win. I thought they turned a corner with their win at KSU, but I guess not. Looking forward, I bet they will improve with another year under Kruger next year: say, 18-22 wins (NIT/NCAA bubble), the higher end of that spectrum if Kruger signs another 3-point assassin, then a roster that's largely his (but young) in '13-'14 will struggle again, then '14-'15 will be a breakthrough. This is the unfortunate impact of a ****ty coach on a program: he gets to run us into the ground, then go home to Duke scot-free while someone else cleans up his mess.

All Kruger could do is deal with what was left. He still is the right guy to get this thing back to where it needs to be. I think we will take giant steps next year, but with that said recruiting for 2013 is key because we will lose 4 starters next year.

 

[WTSooner]

Damn, this season got really depressing, really fast. If we finish with a losing record I am going to be EXTREMELY disappointed with the job Kruger has done this year.

Just curious, what makes you think Kruger didn't get every ounce he could out of this team? Because you predicted better? Because we won some games early?

If you'd have told me before the season started that we'd lose Newell a few games in, and that Cam and Neal would provide pretty much nothing all season, I would have predicted a pretty bad year.

So unless you blame Kruger for Newell leaving, or Cam and Neal stinking, I think putting ANY of this on him is short sighted.

 

[seniorsooner]

Just curious, what makes you think Kruger didn't get every ounce he could out of this team? Because you predicted better? Because we won some games early?

If you'd have told me before the season started that we'd lose Newell a few games in, and that Cam and Neal would provide pretty much nothing all season, I would have predicted a pretty bad year.

So unless you blame Kruger for Newell leaving, or Cam and Neal stinking, I think putting ANY of this on him is short sighted.

Hmm, so the coach bears no responsibility when his players don't perform? Why do we even need a coach then? It's funny to watch everyone backtrack now. How many of you before the season predicted or thought we would finish with a losing record? Now that it appears to be possible, it's all Capel's fault and Kruger bears no responsibility whatsoever for our success or failure this season. Earlier this year when people were talking NCAAs, it was all Kruger. Funny how that works.

I realize Kruger came into a tough situation, but I at least expected a winning record. So if that doesn't happen, yes I will be disappointed.

 

[jmizzy4ou]

Hmm, so the coach bears no responsibility when his players don't perform? Why do we even need a coach then? It's funny to watch everyone backtrack now. How many of you before the season predicted or thought we would finish with a losing record? Now that it appears to be possible, it's all Capel's fault and Kruger bears no responsibility whatsoever for our success or failure this season. Earlier this year when people were talking NCAAs, it was all Kruger. Funny how that works.

I realize Kruger came into a tough situation, but I at least expected a winning record. So if that doesn't happen, yes I will be disappointed.

A very valid point Senior........

 

[thebigabd]

Dont forget the team lost a guy early who was going to be a 12-13 ppg scorer. That is a huge loss on a team void of guards that can score.

 

[seniorsooner]

Dont forget the team lost a guy early who was going to be a 12-13 ppg scorer. That is a huge loss on a team void of guards that can score.

I don't discount that. But just how many wins is Newell supposed to be worth, exactly?

 

[Max Power]

I don't discount that. But just how many wins is Newell supposed to be worth, exactly?

at Cincy, At a&m, at osu, mizzou at home, maybe kansas at home, baylor at home isu at home, that's 7 games we could have won with another guard that can score to A. get his, and B. free up Pledger

 

[seniorsooner]

at Cincy, At a&m, at osu, mizzou at home, maybe kansas at home, baylor at home. so 4-6

A 12 PPG scorer is worth up to 6 wins? Really??

 

[Max Power]

A 12 PPG scorer is worth up to 6 wins? Really??

who else can score and free up pledger? Not Neal, Not Clark, Not grooms, Not Bliar

 

[WTSooner]

Hmm, so the coach bears no responsibility when his players don't perform? Why do we even need a coach then? It's funny to watch everyone backtrack now. How many of you before the season predicted or thought we would finish with a losing record? Now that it appears to be possible, it's all Capel's fault and Kruger bears no responsibility whatsoever for our success or failure this season. Earlier this year when people were talking NCAAs, it was all Kruger. Funny how that works.

I realize Kruger came into a tough situation, but I at least expected a winning record. So if that doesn't happen, yes I will be disappointed.

We aren't the same team. Not sure why you don't get that. We had Newell back then, and Neal was at least hitting open jumpers. That is two guys that were scoring from the perimeter, something we desperately need.

And I'm not saying "none of this" goes on Kruger. I'm just saying very little of it does. Again, unless you think Kruger could be doing something different to get Cam and Neal playing better. If you don't, then we are simply playing to our true talent level.

As for how many wins Newell would have been worth, over where we are now? I'll say 3-5. I'd just about guarantee we'd be 3 wins better at this point.

 

[garyeb2]

Hmm, so the coach bears no responsibility when his players don't perform? Why do we even need a coach then? It's funny to watch everyone backtrack now. How many of you before the season predicted or thought we would finish with a losing record? Now that it appears to be possible, it's all Capel's fault and Kruger bears no responsibility whatsoever for our success or failure this season. Earlier this year when people were talking NCAAs, it was all Kruger. Funny how that works.

I realize Kruger came into a tough situation, but I at least expected a winning record. So if that doesn't happen, yes I will be disappointed.

Sure, a coach would be responsible if he had players capable of performing and then they didn't. That isn't the situation that Kruger finds himself in. Is it?

What success this team has had, Kruger accomplished with smoke and mirrors. They won some early games against decent teams. Beat K St. twice and has kept this group competitive in losses most of the time.

When Arent exposed himself as a talent no show and Calvin bolted, the die was cast for this team. All that as left was last years team minus Cade and plus Osby and Grooms. That is probably a net positive. But, not enough to move the needle very far.

Using last years team as a reference point. They were the worst team to wear an OU uniform in a generation. The coaching was bad and the players were bad. They proved it. Only 4 conference wins and 15 losses by double digits.

Just because some fans set expectations high and continued to ratchet them up thru the non conference schedule isn't Kruger's fault. He didn't do that. All he has said that the kids worked hard in practice but they lacked toughness and intensity.

A player like Osby would likely find a meaningful role to play on most good teams. Grooms, Pledger,Cam, and Fitz would be off the bench role playing backups for a solid team. Our current bench players would not have been recruited by a decent team.

The coaching is fine. OU needs better basketball players.

 

[coolm]

Please...let's not get to this point.

Come on - everyone KNEW at the beginning of the season that this was probably our destiny for year 1 under Coach Kruger.

The fact that he got them to actually play better than expected should be a POSITIVE ... not something that creates a negative feeling later when reality catches up with them.

We are UNDERTALENTED for this league. Everyone knew it. Everyone should still know it. Some stellar play considering that situation is a gift horse and should just be thanked. It proves we're likely on the right path and that the right coaching choice was made despite a few objections (i.e. - mine).

 

[thebigabd]

A 12 PPG scorer is worth up to 6 wins? Really??

Well, that 12 PPG scorer was capable of scoring 20. Thats a big deal. Nobody else on the perimeter is capable of that. He could hit three's, drive to the rim, hit mid-range jumpers. he had a total offensive game.

I bet, with Calvin, they win 3-4 of those games minimum. Many of these games have been REALLY close without a guy who could score 20.

 

[Krugerfan52]

Hmm, so the coach bears no responsibility when his players don't perform? Why do we even need a coach then? It's funny to watch everyone backtrack now. How many of you before the season predicted or thought we would finish with a losing record? Now that it appears to be possible, it's all Capel's fault and Kruger bears no responsibility whatsoever for our success or failure this season. Earlier this year when people were talking NCAAs, it was all Kruger. Funny how that works.

I realize Kruger came into a tough situation, but I at least expected a winning record. So if that doesn't happen, yes I will be disappointed.

Solid post. I agree. You can't have it both ways. You can't credit Kruger when we win and blame Capel win we lose. They each deserve some credit and some blame in any victory or loss.

 

[Krugerfan52]

A 12 PPG scorer is worth up to 6 wins? Really??

And he wasn't a 12ppg scorer. He averaged 3 ppg in his first entire season, then managed to jack up enough shots against Idaho State and Coppin State to score 18 and 19 in his first two games. But his play was declining each game in that preseason tourney, his minutes were going down and he didnt crack double digits his last two games as a Sooner.

And Newell was on the team when we lost by 20 to St. Louis. So you can't just say that our backup SG is worth 6 wins. Thats ridiculous.

 

[thebigabd]

And he wasn't a 12ppg scorer. He averaged 3 ppg in his first entire season, then managed to jack up enough shots against Idaho State and Coppin State to score 18 and 19 in his first two games. But his play was declining each game in that preseason tourney, his minutes were going down and he didnt crack double digits his last two games as a Sooner.

And Newell was on the team when we lost by 20 to St. Louis. So you can't just say that our backup SG is worth 6 wins. Thats ridiculous.

Hey! That St. Louis team is 20-5.

 

[JBaker]

A 12 PPG scorer is worth up to 6 wins? Really??

Well, we have literally NOTHING to replace him.
It's not like that 12 ppg got spread around elsewhere.
We basically have 4 total guys on this team that can score in Pledger, Fitzgerald, Osby, and Blair.