At this time last year...

[pnkranger]

we were 8-6 with 5 double digit losses under our belts. Our schedule was very similar (though we did have Kentucky in Maui).

I just wanted to celebrate how far this team has come.

If we can:

• win more than 6 games in the big 12
• compete in games we lose (last year, Big 12 opponents defeated us by an average of 15 points, including a couple of 30 point blow-outs.
• avoid an 8 game losing streak

We should have an opportunity to play in the post-season (most likely NIT with our non-conference schedule). I would be very happy with the improvement given that scenario.

PS...My prediction is the Romero Osby is our best player by the close of the season.

 

[skyvue]

we were 8-6 with 5 double digit losses under our belts. Our schedule was very similar (though we did have Kentucky in Maui).

I just wanted to celebrate how far this team has come.

Nice post. There is definitely every reason to both celebrate the progress the team has made and be optimistic going forward.

 

[scrybe]

My prediction is the Romero Osby is our best player by the close of the season.

Isn't that what JC was trying to tell us last season?.

(Disclaimer: That statement was made in fun, in case anyone feels the need to flame).

I agree, pnkranger. It's looking more and more like Romero is gonna be the real deal.

 

[boksooner]

Isn't that what JC was trying to tell us last season?.

(Disclaimer: That statement was made in fun, in case anyone feels the need to flame).

I agree, pnkranger. It's looking more and more like Romero is gonna be the real deal.

No it wasn't.

 

[WTSooner]

Isn't that what JC was trying to tell us last season?.

Maybe. If you assume that Osby regressed this summer, or that Pledger simply made up that much ground. Because Capel didn't say Osby would be the best player by the end of next year, he said Osby was currently the best player. I know Pledger improved, and is playing better, but I have a hard time believing that Capel was correct last year.

Most likely, Osby looked like the best player b/c a) it was practice, and b) he wasn't trying to run OU's stuff, but instead was free to just play.

And I disagree. I still think Pledger will be our best player.

 

[bocabull]

We upgraded our starting lineup significantly with Grooms & Osby over the starters at their position from last season. The other guys are a year older. We're exactly where I expected & predicted us to be all along under Capel other than Cam seems to have regressed a bit.

 

[Krugerfan52]

We upgraded our starting lineup significantly with Grooms & Osby over the starters at their position from last season. The other guys are a year older. We're exactly where I expected & predicted us to be all along under Capel other than Cam seems to have regressed a bit.

Good post.

Only thing I would add for those who continue to act dissapointed is Osby is that despite sitting out a year and getting a new coach and new system, he is one rebound per game away from averaging a double-double.

 

[garyeb2]

Maybe. If you assume that Osby regressed this summer, or that Pledger simply made up that much ground. Because Capel didn't say Osby would be the best player by the end of next year, he said Osby was currently the best player. I know Pledger improved, and is playing better, but I have a hard time believing that Capel was correct last year.

Most likely, Osby looked like the best player b/c a) it was practice, and b) he wasn't trying to run OU's stuff, but instead was free to just play.

And I disagree. I still think Pledger will be our best player.

I uderestimated Pledger alittle. Last year Cade kind of hogged the ball and he probably needed too.

This year Pledger has matured some. Kruger is running some stuff for him and Grooms is getting the offense going in a way that benifits Pledger and the others as well. Grooms make Pledger better just like Osby's presence down low helps Fitz.

If one were to watch top 20 caliber teams play, Osby and Grooms are the only two OU players that resemble the type of athlete on those squads. The better teams do not carry guards that can not handle the ball. They don't carry guards with no left hand. They do not carry guards that can not defend at a high level.

That year off hurts players more than it helps them. Osby will just get better. When M'baye shows up, that will be 3 top 20 caliber players. And his presence will help Osby be alittle better.

As for Pledger, he will stuggle to average 12 against tourney caliber teams. And continue to look pretty ordinary with the ball in his hands when well defended. And while Kruger's switch off and help defenses helps players like Pledger, he is still the worst defender in the 7 man deep. If you want to argue that point, I'll be happy to give you a couple of good examples.

And just a note. If you will quit trying to diminish and short change every other players positive contibutions to the teams early success, I'll stop pointing out your boys shortcomings.

 

[WTSooner]

I uderestimated Pledger alittle. Last year Cade kind of hogged the ball and he probably needed too.

This year Pledger has matured some. Kruger is running some stuff for him and Grooms is getting the offense going in a way that benifits Pledger and the others as well. Grooms make Pledger better just like Osby's presence down low helps Fitz.

If one were to watch top 20 caliber teams play, Osby and Grooms are the only two OU players that resemble the type of athlete on those squads. The better teams do not carry guards that can not handle the ball. They don't carry guards with no left hand. They do not carry guards that can not defend at a high level.

That year off hurts players more than it helps them. Osby will just get better. When M'baye shows up, that will be 3 top 20 caliber players. And his presence will help Osby be alittle better.

As for Pledger, he will stuggle to average 12 against tourney caliber teams. And continue to look pretty ordinary with the ball in his hands when well defended. And while Kruger's switch off and help defenses helps players like Pledger, he is still the worst defender in the 7 man deep. If you want to argue that point, I'll be happy to give you a couple of good examples.

And just a note. If you will quit trying to diminish and short change every other players positive contibutions to the teams early success, I'll stop pointing out your boys shortcomings.

I gave up arguing/debating hoops with you a couple of weeks ago. I defended you at first, but I was mistaken. Sorry, but your hoops knowledge just isn't at the level you think it is. You make ridiculous comment, after ridiculous comment. Pledger probably grades out as one of the top 5 or so guards in the country to date, yet you still diss his athleticism. As if being some kind of track star is a requirement for being a good hoopster. You might want to check out some recent OU star players.....because most of them don't stack up athletically. But they knew how to play ball. Same with Pledger. But I'm done trying to convince you.

 

[garyeb2]

I gave up arguing/debating hoops with you a couple of weeks ago. I defended you at first, but I was mistaken. Sorry, but your hoops knowledge just isn't at the level you think it is. You make ridiculous comment, after ridiculous comment. Pledger probably grades out as one of the top 5 or so guards in the country to date, yet you still diss his athleticism. As if being some kind of track star is a requirement for being a good hoopster. You might want to check out some recent OU star players.....because most of them don't stack up athletically. But they knew how to play ball. Same with Pledger. But I'm done trying to convince you.

Please do stop trying to convince me. I wish you hadn't started. And I'm not trying to convince you of anything. You have already drank the kool-aid.

My point was that at every chance, you want to hop in with a downgrade of the other players. They are all flawed. All except Pledger that is.

My definition of ridiculous is when someone starts comparing a kid that hasn't done anything but lose since he got here with players like Hollis and the other good ones.

 

[WTSooner]

You have already drank the kool-aid.

How can I be drinking the kool-aid when it's my own, original opinion? When I said, before Pledger even graduated high school, that I thought he had a chance to be a better college player than Willie Warren when it was said and done? When I said he might shatter some of OU's 3 point shooting records? I'm not piggybacking somebody else's opinion here. It's my own.

My point was that at every chance, you want to hop in with a downgrade of the other players. They are all flawed. All except Pledger that is.

That isn't true. But it's not my fault that Pledger has been our best and most consistent player this year. Not just scoring the ball either. Pledger isn't the reason we've struggled at times, both during games we've won and games we've lost. Pledger isn't perfect, but he's producing at a HIGH level right now. That is fact. Will it continue? Most likely not to the level he has produced so far, but if you are expecting him to turn into Pledger of the last two seasons, that will be one more thing you end up being wrong about.

My definition of ridiculous is when someone starts comparing a kid that hasn't done anything but lose since he got here with players like Hollis and the other good ones.

Yes, b/c Steven Pledger alone is the ONLY reason this, and the last two OU teams haven't won like Hollis' teams did. And my comment above was JUST about Hollis, none of the other OU guards/players that also fit that same description.

Dude, no offense, but you've been dead wrong about just about everything you've "predicted" about this OU team. Sam Grooms being the lone exception. You were wrong about Arent (BIG TIME). You were wrong about Pledger. You were wrong about the starting lineup. You were wrong about the bench rotation. You were wrong about Fitz. You were wrong about Cam. You were wrong about the style of play. I'm not trying to be a jerk, but you and bigabd have about a 10% success rate on your "predictions". At least with bigabd, I think most of the time he is just trying to get the board talking. But you, you actually believe the nonsense you spew.

 

[garyeb2]

I think you may be right about me and Arent. Looks like Kruger has given up on him for this year. Mayby next year.

"If" I end up being wrong about Cam ending up being a good one, that would put me in a pretty big group. I'm sure that a solid basketball man like yourself knows and understands that players typically make their biggest improvement from their freshman year to their soph. year. And that improvement doesn't really start to materialise until about 1/2 way through their soph year. You did know that didn't you. Cam is already a solid defender and he really just needs to become more consistant scoring. So really, the book isn't written on that subject yet.

Fitz has gotten alot more clever around the basket. He has improved his post moves. He has always been pretty good with that 10/12 ft. jumper.But, I'm not wrong about Fitz. He is slow.He has bricks for feet. He plays below the rim. And he can not defend decent bigs. As long as players like Fitz are our man in the middle, OU will never be a top 25 program again.

And Pledger, my goodness. His production is way up so far. But, it isn't because he suddenly found Superman' cape. Just like I said in earlier post. Pledger has bought in to what Kruger is trying to do. He is trying to do everything ask of him. And that is great. He has matured,Grooms makes him better, and Kruger is running stuff for him.That is it. He is still the same guy.

My position on Pledger is and has been that he is a mid-major talent. If he were in the Summit League or the Big Sky or something like that he would be All Grape Nuts, player of the year, and all of that. Players found at that level and even some of the players in the bottom part of BCS conferences usually don't have the skills to take advantage of his weaknesses.

Top 40 type teams or teams in the top half of BCS conferences. Well, that is a different story. That is when the cape come off. St. Louis and Cincy are the only two teams OU has played that come close to fitting that top 40 category. Let's talk about Pleder's production in those two games. Those two games are not examples of Pledger having a bad game. Those are examples of Pledger game when playing quality opposition. Guards like Hollis and even Austin Johnson were quality defenders and could get their offense no matter the opponent and at the highest level.

There is no evidence what so ever that Pledger can do the same. What little evidence that there is to this point seems to indicate that he cann't. He is slow. He has limited athletic ability. Those qualities are not assets to a basketball player. They are a liability. Aginst quick aggressive defenders he is always a step slow coming around a screen. And when he is open, he is always alittled hurried with his shot. That is why his shotting pct. falls off against quality teams. Coaches with the willingness and ability will always try to take him out of the game offensively. When that happens,Pledger just simply can not do much about it.

And even with you, I shouldn't have to build a ball handling and defensive liability case . Do I? I'm not wrong about Pledger. I'm not wrong because he is just like Fitz. OU will never be a top 20 program again as long as we put players on the floor that are flawed in such a way that the better teams can take so easy advantage of them.

There is a really good article by Malcomb Gladwell in the 5/29/06 issue of the New Yorker magazine. Gladwell writes extensivly about studies involving statistics of players and the mistakes superficial observers make in assigning worth to players.

 

[NormanPride]

I refuse to believe that Capel would have had us looking this organized and working this hard on defense. The addition of Osby alone does not account for our incredible uptick in rebounding and our massive improvement on defense. Those are the biggest changes, and they are 100% coaching.

 

[MsProudSooner]

I refuse to believe that Capel would have had us looking this organized and working this hard on defense. The addition of Osby alone does not account for our incredible uptick in rebounding and our massive improvement on defense. Those are the biggest changes, and they are 100% coaching.

I have to agree. Even Blake's sophomore season, we never played team defense as well as this team does.

 

[WTSooner]

I refuse to believe that Capel would have had us looking this organized and working this hard on defense. The addition of Osby alone does not account for our incredible uptick in rebounding and our massive improvement on defense. Those are the biggest changes, and they are 100% coaching.

Yep.

 

[bocabull]

Osby is the 2nd leading rebounder in the Big XII. He would be the 2nd leading rebounder even if Hillbilly Ford was his coach. It's size & physical ability.

We upgraded the starting lineup and are playing exactly as expected. I said all along when a certain player was gone we would improve by subtraction. The coaching has nothing to do with Grooms & Osby being massive talent upgrades.

 

[skyvue]

I said all along when a certain player was gone we would improve by subtraction.

Boy, were you right. Getting rid of Cade Davis what just what we needed. THAT's why our rebounding and defense are worlds better. Now that might seem counter-intuitive to some, given that Cade was second on the team in rebounds last season, second in steals, and third in blocks (not to mention the team's leading scorer), but it's now clear to anyone with eyes in their head and a lick of sense that he was the problem in 2011.

Coach Kruger's just darned lucky Davis is gone; I'm sure he'd be able to find no use whatsoever for his energy and skills.

 

[SoonerinNC]

Pledger has yet to prove that he can go off on teams like Kansas, Missouri, and Texas. Hopefully he will change that against Missouri tonight.

Fitz seems to get his shots against anyone but forces it sometimes.

Osby appears to be coming on on offense. Tonight will be a big test for him along with the remainder of the team.

Grooms had trouble with the double team against Cincinnati but did a good job of splitting it in the next game. Can he do it against better teams.

Having said all that, this team is significantly better coached than Capels teams. An early indication of how the offense would be with Capel was how hard it was for the other Neal to get shots after a year of being the go to guy on Sampson's last team.

Kruger will get us back to a high level. The limit will depend on how many top recruits he can get.

 

[NormanPride]

I thought we all admitted that Osby was undersized for his position?

 

[Max Power]

Boy, were you right. Getting rid of Cade Davis what just what we needed. THAT's why our rebounding and defense are worlds better. Now that might seem counter-intuitive to some, given that Cade was second on the team in rebounds last season, second in steals, and third in blocks (not to mention the team's leading scorer), but it's now clear to anyone with eyes in their head and a lick of sense that he was the problem in 2011.

Coach Kruger's just darned lucky Davis is gone; I'm sure he'd be able to find no use whatsoever for his energy and skills.

:clap Boca is such an idiot its no longer funny and just sad