Football question

[CoachTalk]

How could we ever compete with a program like Michigan??

If only they were on the schedule...

 

[WichitaSooner]

How could we ever compete with a program like Michigan??

Well to compete with the Michigan team that won the title, we would have needed to, you know, make the playoff that season.

 

[mict085]

Are we saying the defense doesn’t have NFL talent? Is that the argument?

 

[WichitaSooner]

If only they were on the schedule...

Interesting take. Maybe during one of your poker games or biddy basketball scrimmages, you falsely got word that our current OU team scrimmaged 2023 Michigan. If so, let us know how we did.

This post is so typical of some of you. I made a point about how many draft picks championship teams have. Some of you doubted it and asked me to prove it. I provided the specific numbers of the past four champions. Now that you’ve seen evidence that I was correct in my point, you’ve changed the topic to a vague discussion about whether our defense is “elite,” and/or suggested that us beating Michigan two years after their title, when almost none of their same guys are still on their team, somehow discredits the facts I posted. Well done.

 

[WichitaSooner]

Are we saying the defense doesn’t have NFL talent? Is that the argument?

It’s not a difficult argument to follow at all. I was very clear in what I posted: OU needs to get more NFL players on our roster, via recruiting (high school and portal) and development. And ideally, plenty of them will be high draft picks, not just a couple guys picked in the middle or late rounds and a second rounder sprinkled in every few years.

 

[CoachTalk]

Interesting take. Maybe during one of your poker games or biddy basketball scrimmages, you falsely got word that our current OU team scrimmaged 2023 Michigan. If so, let us know how we did.

This post is so typical of some of you. I made a point about how many draft picks championship teams have. Some of you doubted it and asked me to prove it. I provided the specific numbers of the past four champions. Now that you’ve seen evidence that I was correct in my point, you’ve changed the topic to a vague discussion about whether our defense is “elite,” and/or suggested that us beating Michigan two years after their title, when almost none of their same guys are still on their team, somehow discredits the facts I posted. Well done.

Sorry for having friends and a life. Maybe you should try it.

The other poster said... How could we ever compete with a program like Michigan??

I said what I said...

Why do you think we have moved to the SEC, Why do you think we play Michigan h&H?

 

[CoachTalk]

It’s not a difficult argument to follow at all. I was very clear in what I posted: OU needs to get more NFL players on our roster, via recruiting (high school and portal) and development. And ideally, plenty of them will be high draft picks, not just a couple guys picked in the middle or late rounds and a second rounder sprinkled in every few years.

Dont you think this def has that? High picks idk yet but plenty of picks are coming to the NFL draft. Last year was a good start.

 

[WichitaSooner]

Are we saying the defense doesn’t have NFL talent? Is that the argument?

It’s not a difficult argument to follow at all. I was very clear in what I posted: OU needs to get more NFL players on our roster, via recruiting (high school and portal) and development. And ideally, plenty of them will be high draft picks, not just a couple guys picked in the middle or late rounds and a second rounder sprinkled in every few years.

 

[Sooner04]

the OU defense is a top 5 Defense in the country ..

By what metrics are you making that claim? I'm very impressed at the strides made by the D when compared to the "SIEVE" era of Riley, but I'm seeing way too many problems on the back end to call them a top 5 unit. The better offenses we've faced are racking up the yards, and I'm curious if this is tied into advanced analytics that I don't comprehend....nor understand.

 

[Eielson]

It’s not a difficult argument to follow at all. I was very clear in what I posted: OU needs to get more NFL players on our roster, via recruiting (high school and portal) and development. And ideally, plenty of them will be high draft picks, not just a couple guys picked in the middle or late rounds and a second rounder sprinkled in every few years.

Yes, we need more talent on defense to compete at a high level. Completely ignoring that the current defense is top 5 in the country based on most advanced metrics.

I can tell when your complaints aren't plagiarizing Gabe. The lack of any common sense or football knowledge gives it away.

 

[Boom Soon]

By what metrics are you making that claim? I'm very impressed at the strides made by the D when compared to the "SIEVE" era of Riley, but I'm seeing way too many problems on the back end to call them a top 5 unit. The better offenses we've faced are racking up the yards, and I'm curious if this is tied into advanced analytics that I don't comprehend....nor understand.

What five teams have better defenses than OU?

 

[Eielson]

By what metrics are you making that claim? I'm very impressed at the strides made by the D when compared to the "SIEVE" era of Riley, but I'm seeing way too many problems on the back end to call them a top 5 unit. The better offenses we've faced are racking up the yards, and I'm curious if this is tied into advanced analytics that I don't comprehend....nor understand.

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[Eielson]

What five teams have better defenses than OU?

Statistically speaking, Ohio State is the only defense that has clearly performed better.

If "championship-caliber defense" means you have to be #1, then there's a valid argument to be made that the defense is not championship defense. We should go buy the best defensive coach of this century to build our defense into that.

 

[WaymanFan]

I personally believe the best way to quantify a college defense's success...is based on how well they play college defense. Which is elite by every metric.

But we have to base this on when they were picked in the NFL draft? Does Jason White need to hand his Heisman back in? Should Heupel give up his claim to the 2000 national championship? Rocky Calmus and Torrance Marshall were not selected in the top 50, so we couldn't possibly shut out FSU in the Orange Bowl.

Thanks for enlightening us.

Eilson, you're technically correct. It only matters how guys play in college, not the next level. We won 7 titles with that mentality, but we're having an incredibly difficult time winning #8. I don't like making comparisons to the 2000 team because that was "lightning in a bottle". We could not have won that title without the 1999 recruiting class which was not in the top 50 nationally...just can't count on things like that happening again.

We may never again have an offense like 2017 which had a Heisman winning QB throwing to three future NFL 1000-yard receivers while having an offensive line full of future NFL players...and we still couldn't win a title because all the talent was on one side of the ball. As I mentioned prior, we're going to be playing 6, 7, or 8 big games a year going forward and have to win most of them. I just don't know how that will be done without high-end talent. I'm not saying this team does not have that...but it should be obvious we need more...better receivers, better o-line and better d-backs. I think we all hope to get there .

 

[WichitaSooner]

Dont you think this def has that? High picks idk yet but plenty of picks are coming to the NFL draft. Last year was a good start.

Thomas is a likely second rounder. Who else on the defense can you confidently say will be a sure fire NFL player? Some of the young guys may be in two, three, or four years, but that is a lot of speculation. The point is, you need multiple guys being drafted every year, not just every two or three years. I remember after last season, people were saying we would have several guys be drafted in the 2026 draft. Will that actually happen? If so, who do you think they are?

 

[WichitaSooner]

What five teams have better defenses than OU?

OU isn't in the top 5 in scoring defense or total defense in the traditional NCAA rankings, nor are they top five in ESPN's FP defensive ranking, which is one of the more analytical metrics lot of people like to use.

 

[BoulderSooner]

nor are they top five in ESPN's FP defensive ranking, which is one of the more analytical metrics lot of people like to use.

they are 6th in that one

 

[mict085]

Thomas is a likely second rounder. Who else on the defense can you confidently say will be a sure fire NFL player? Some of the young guys may be in two, three, or four years, but that is a lot of speculation. The point is, you need multiple guys being drafted every year, not just every two or three years. I remember after last season, people were saying we would have several guys be drafted in the 2026 draft. Will that actually happen? If so, who do you think they are?

David stone and Jayden Jackson are NFL players and likely day one draft picks, maybe first round.

 

[Eielson]

Eilson, you're technically correct. It only matters how guys play in college, not the next level. We won 7 titles with that mentality, but we're having an incredibly difficult time winning #8. I don't like making comparisons to the 2000 team because that was "lightning in a bottle". We could not have won that title without the 1999 recruiting class which was not in the top 50 nationally...just can't count on things like that happening again.

We may never again have an offense like 2017 which had a Heisman winning QB throwing to three future NFL 1000-yard receivers while having an offensive line full of future NFL players...and we still couldn't win a title because all the talent was on one side of the ball. As I mentioned prior, we're going to be playing 6, 7, or 8 big games a year going forward and have to win most of them. I just don't know how that will be done without high-end talent. I'm not saying this team does not have that...but it should be obvious we need more...better receivers, better o-line and better d-backs. I think we all hope to get there .

The offense undoubtedly has to improve. No argument there. I just can't understand anybody trying to have an honest conversation complaining about the defense right now.

 

[WichitaSooner]

David stone and Jayden Jackson are NFL players and likely day one draft picks, maybe first round.

Okay, so you name two guys who you think will be high picks in 2027 at the earliest. I don't disagree that there is a chance that is true. But again to my point -- we need to build the roster and talent so that we have two or three guys like that every season, plus some additional picks. And notice that I HAVE not argued that we can't do that. The one thing Brent can do is coach defense, and that does help us attract good defensive players. All I said in my post is that we aren't there yet. We need to keep bringing in more and more of those guys. The reason teams like Bama and Georgia and OSU can lose tons of players to the draft every year, but continue to remain in the mix for titles, is because they have other studs waiting in the wings.