LK vs Capel in recruiting

[WTSooner]

I'm not posting this to start a pissing match, just honestly curious. I'm not overly familiar with the 2012 and 2013 rankings, but is LK in on the same kind of talent that Capel was? It sure seems that way. It's still to be seen whether LK can a) bring that talent to Norman, and b) coach it up, but from a strictly "can our coach get into a player's house, and get into their top 5 or so", I think LK is doing a bang-up job so far.

 

[NorthCarolinaSooner]

LK is getting in on some national kids but he is doing what I always hoped Capel would do and that is recruit harder locally. I think LK will go after the big recruits but it seems like he is doing a better job working on solid fall backs if the big fish dont bite. Seems like Capel put a little too much effort on the big ones and scrambled at the end finding bodies. Just seemed that way to me.

 

[Sooner04]

Capel's handling of Oklahoma talent was one of the sadder sides of his tenure.

 

[WTSooner]

LK is getting in on some national kids but he is doing what I always hoped Capel would do and that is recruit harder locally. I think LK will go after the big recruits but it seems like he is doing a better job working on solid fall backs if the big fish dont bite. Seems like Capel put a little too much effort on the big ones and scrambled at the end finding bodies. Just seemed that way to me.

I agree. I think it helps LK that there are A LOT of quality talent in OK and TX that he can recruit. Both blue chip quality, and solid fall back prospects. But we are being mentioned on a couple kids from out east. A kid from NJ I believe, and maybe another one from NC?

 

[WTSooner]

Capel's handling of Oklahoma talent was one of the sadder sides of his tenure.

I really don't think he missed on much from Oklahoma. LK's first 2-3 classes, the OK kids are probably better than anything (Blake excluded) that Capel had to recruit from here. OK as a state doesn't consistently produce OU caliber players. Take advantage when it does, but don't feel obligated to grab kids when the talent isn't there.

 

[Sooner04]

Take advantage when it does, but don't feel obligated to grab kids when the talent isn't there.

I disagree here. I think, with all things being equal between two players, you ALWAYS take the local kid. How many of the kids from back east ended up being complete flameouts? I like to see kids who have some semblance of a clue as to what our program is all about.

 

[bgrch1350]

I disagree here. I think, with all things being equal between two players, you ALWAYS take the local kid. How many of the kids from back east ended up being complete flameouts? I like to see kids who have some semblance of a clue as to what our program is all about.

Who did Capel not go after that you all wish he would have? I just want 1 name of a player that he did not attempt to get that you all seem to wish he would have.

 

[coolm]

I disagree here. I think, with all things being equal between two players, you ALWAYS take the local kid. How many of the kids from back east ended up being complete flameouts? I like to see kids who have some semblance of a clue as to what our program is all about.

agree 1000%

IMO there should always be some locals on this roster.

 

[OKURanger]

agree 1000%

IMO there should always be some locals on this roster.

Me too. And I'll take it one step further and say that OU should recruit primarily KS, OK, and TX players. If a kid from outside these states is really good and wants to play for OU, then great, bring him in. But our roster should be filled with kids who know what OU is all about and want to be a part of our program.

 

[Sam]

Who did Capel not go after that you all wish he would have? I just want 1 name of a player that he did not attempt to get that you all seem to wish he would have.

Amric Fields

 

[j2d2]

I dont care where they are from. It's the quality of the kid, his athletic ability and his commitment to the program I'm interested in. Capel could not judge character very well.

 

[WTSooner]

I disagree here. I think, with all things being equal between two players, you ALWAYS take the local kid. How many of the kids from back east ended up being complete flameouts? I like to see kids who have some semblance of a clue as to what our program is all about.

Without specific names (from out east and here in OK), this is a hard argument to have.

I will say this though, unless I'm missing something, all of those kids from out east were top 100, or top 125 guys. I don't think there was a single top 125 kid from OK that Capel didn't go after. And if there was, there weren't many.

 

[garyeb2]

The question of whether or not someone is a good recruiter, or bench coach, or manager of a program is answered on the floor on game day. With that standard, Capel didn't bring in one "Oklahoma" caliber player. If you want to give him some credit for Blake, fine. If he had, his last two teams wouldn't have lost so many games. And looked so bad doing it. Krueger has a self-imposed ceiling. Remember, he doesn't cheat. Even with that ceiling, Krueger will do what Capel could never do. Bring in players that make the program better.

 

[WTSooner]

With that standard, Capel didn't bring in one "Oklahoma" caliber player.

That is nonsense. He brought in several players that could have, and would have, played at OU just about any year. You are basing your opinion on our win/loss record, entirely. That is silly. You can't draw the line from our win/loss record directly to our entire roster is made up of crap players. Faulty logic.

Capel's problem wasn't the talent he brought in (for the most part), it was a) how he put the talent together, ie, not a complete team, b) his inability to find an impact player last season, and c) his inability to coach up the talent he had, and to put them in a position to succeed.

Your no talent argument will go out the window when over the next two years, a lot of the guys Capel signed will lead us back to the Dance.

 

[garyeb2]

Correct me if you think I'm wrong WT. My lodgic and premise is, the players Capel bought in couldn't beat anyone and looked bad in the process. Therefore, the players are not very good. And your lodgic and premise is, the players that Capel brought in couldn't beat anyone and looked bad in the process. Therefore they are good players. I think that I could build a case that yours was the faulty lodgic.

 

[boksooner]

Correct me if you think I'm wrong WT. My lodgic and premise is, the players Capel bought in couldn't beat anyone and looked bad in the process. Therefore, the players are not very good. And your lodgic and premise is, the players that Capel brought in couldn't beat anyone and looked bad in the process. Therefore they are good players. I think that I could build a case that yours was the faulty lodgic.

No. Your argument is that Capel had a bad win/loss record, therefore every player on the roster was bad. His argument, correct me if I am wrong WT, is that Capel had a bad win/loss record, therefore an indeterminate portion of the roster is bad. You are completely ignoring coaching and team in your argument.

 

[AdaSooner]

LK is getting in on some national kids but he is doing what I always hoped Capel would do and that is recruit harder locally. I think LK will go after the big recruits but it seems like he is doing a better job working on solid fall backs if the big fish dont bite. Seems like Capel put a little too much effort on the big ones and scrambled at the end finding bodies. Just seemed that way to me.

You're spot on in your assessment, except that Capel recruited mostly regionally in the beginning. He targeted recruits in Oklahoma and Texas (particulary Texas), and even embraced high school coaches in both states, something Kelvin did not do well over the years.

In the last two to three years Capel was in Norman, he and his staff seemed to be focused more on going "national," and chasing pipedream recruits like Jones, Barnes and a few others I could name. Nothing wrong with that, providing you have a solid back up plan and the ability to recognize when it's time to cut your losses and move on to Plan B, which as you correctly pointed out, Capel didn't do.

Kruger has the right idea, just as Capel did when he came to OU. The question is, will he continue to spend time trying to sign the top kids in this region in an effort to establish, build and maintain vital relationships with coaches and schools? My money is on a more experienced, and in many ways wiser LK, to avoid the mistakes Capel made.

 

[WTSooner]

Correct me if you think I'm wrong WT. My lodgic and premise is, the players Capel bought in couldn't beat anyone and looked bad in the process. Therefore, the players are not very good. And your lodgic and premise is, the players that Capel brought in couldn't beat anyone and looked bad in the process. Therefore they are good players. I think that I could build a case that yours was the faulty lodgic.

I see it more like this:

Your logic is that the players looked bad most of the season, therefore they are bad players. Everyone of them. Beyond repair.

My logic is that the team had the talent last year to be a low-end NCAA team, if they played to potential, but Capel did a TERRIBLE job of coaching them up, and THAT is why they looked as bad as they did. Not a simple lack of talent.

You didn't really answer my question.....Capel isn't going to have enough scholarships available to "turn over" the roster in the next two years. That means A LOT of the players on the roster will be Capel signees. Capel players will start. Capel players will come of the bench. Capel players will likely lead the team in scoring/rebounding, at least this year. IF this team, or the next team makes the Dance.....IF some of the players you say aren't OU quality players improve.....you are forced at that point to admit you were wrong, right?

 

[WTSooner]

No. Your argument is that Capel had a bad win/loss record, therefore every player on the roster was bad. His argument, correct me if I am wrong WT, is that Capel had a bad win/loss record, therefore an indeterminate portion of the roster is bad. You are completely ignoring coaching and team in your argument.

That is pretty much it. I know OU didn't have the talent last year to win the Big 12, for probably finish in the top 3. But I'll argue until I'm blue in the face that Sampson or LK would have taken last years team to the Dance most likely, and if not, we'd have been a bubble team, and for sure NIT team. No doubt. Last year's team was VERY poorly coached IMO.

 

[daqman]

Me too. And I'll take it one step further and say that OU should recruit primarily KS, OK, and TX players. If a kid from outside these states is really good and wants to play for OU, then great, bring him in. But our roster should be filled with kids who know what OU is all about and want to be a part of our program.

NO no no.
Pipelines.
East coast ballers.