Stevie Clark - Update

Interesting to learn that, thanks. I encounter the word primarily online. I don't generally hear it used in "real life."

You are welcome.

That brings up another curious thought. Do people talk and type using different words. I don't think I do.

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From Merriam-Webster

THUG

Synonyms: bully, gangbanger, gangsta, gangster, goon, gorilla, hood, hooligan, mobster, mug, plug-ugly, punk, roughneck, rowdy, ruffian, hoodlum, tough, toughie (also toughy), yob [British], yobbo [British]

Related Words: cutthroat, scoundrel, villain; assassin, bandit, bravo, brigand, criminal, crook, desperado, felon, gunman, highwayman, lawbreaker, mafioso, malefactor, offender, outlaw, perp, perpetrator, pirate; pickpocket, racketeer, robber, swindler, thief, vandal; juvenile delinquent, tearaway [British]
 
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You are welcome.

That brings up another curious thought. Do people talk and type using different words. I don't think I do.

****

From Merriam-Webster

THUG

Synonyms: bully, gangbanger, gangsta, gangster, goon, gorilla, hood, hooligan, mobster, mug, plug-ugly, punk, roughneck, rowdy, ruffian, hoodlum, tough, toughie (also toughy), yob [British], yobbo [British]

Related Words: cutthroat, scoundrel, villain; assassin, bandit, bravo, brigand, criminal, crook, desperado, felon, gunman, highwayman, lawbreaker, mafioso, malefactor, offender, outlaw, perp, perpetrator, pirate; pickpocket, racketeer, robber, swindler, thief, vandal; juvenile delinquent, tearaway [British]

The word definitely has a related but different -- arguably more specific -- usage nowadays.
 
The word definitely has a related but different -- arguably more specific -- usage nowadays.

Again, not for me and the people I talk to. We do use (speak) the word thug on occasion, and it is used consistently to describe a scoundrel, villain, bandit, criminal, crook, or felon, in our vernacular.

In other words, in this case I must be a member of the one-percent, as the word thug has absolutely zero racist connotation in the circle (and generation) I run in. Absolutely zero.
 
Again, not for me and the people I talk to. We do use (speak) the word thug on occasion, and it is used consistently to describe a scoundrel, villain, bandit, criminal, crook, or felon, in our vernacular.

In other words, in this case I must be a member of the one-percent, as the word thug has absolutely zero racist connotation in the circle (and generation) I run in. Absolutely zero.

That makes two of us. I rarely use the word thug to describe anyone. But in the few times I have used that word in a sentence, the color of someone's skin never entered my mind.

This thread has been a learning experience for me. I doubt if I have ever used that word around any of my black friends. But if I did, they never said anything about being offended. It helps to have friends who know you and your heart better than most of the people you encounter on fan boards.
 
I have seen it called to many white people. I don't care what color you are, you act stupid and you will get called something like thug. Quit whining about a word and quit acting like a punk.

Sent from cool phone
 
Traveler and Ada: You and I are all part of the same generation. I guess we've got a lot to learn. Then again, maybe some of the younger guys on this board could learn a few things from us.
 
Like I said, "thug" when used in the terms we most often see it on this or any sports message board, has a different meaning. That is why I've seen guys like Eddie Najera called a thug. Or the white kid from Mizzou. Were those race-related? Did that have anything to do with drugs?

I don't know why it's so difficult for some of you to realize that some words have different meanings depending on how they are used, who is using them, and in what context.



Agree with this also. There are a few on this board that think every "kid" has to go through a stretch of doing stupid and illegal things. Not everybody did those things. I've never touched drugs. Also never pissed out of a moving car. And I never had anything "at risk" on nearly the level that a Stevie Clark does. Or any of the other top athletes that insist on pissing away (see what I did there?) chances that a lot of less athletic folks would kill for.



I promise you, no matter how many times you deny it, the word thug is used mostly to describe young black males. Being an athlete is secondary. You mentioned 2 exceptions where white athletes may have been called thugs on THIS board. It is very rare. Sky gave excellent examples.

Another example is music/entertainment figures. Justin Bieber has done far more, and far worse than Stevie Clark has done. Show me one outlet where he is/was referred to as a thug? Like I said I'm not blaming white people, anymore than I'm blaming them for the continued use of the N-word. Black America is the main reason both of the terms are used to identify black people in 2014........ IMO

I don't often boast about myself, but I don't take a backseat to many on this subject. Because of my work with inner city kids, I have increased my education and studied these types of trends. I have a BS in Human Services, and a Master's in Sociology, with many hours logged in social work settings. I did a 79 page research paper/professor graded paper on a very similar subject.

Like I said, Many scholars who I consider much more versed in this than myself have written very educated/researched reports on this subject. Most of their conclusion is that THUG is the modern day N-word.

I would challenge you to do what Sky suggested: Scan random message boards, sports news sites, local news sites, etc and find a random story about a black male. Drop down to the comments and within one or two, you will see the word thug used to describe the person, or the black race in general. Many times it's unfounded. Heck, I found an article about Blake Griffin doing the new commercials, and instantly comments below referred to him as a thug, 1/2 n-word, etc..... Heck I have never heard anyone in the hip hop world refer to Eminem as a thug. I have never seen many discuss Little Wayne or Kanye West without calling them a thug.

Just one of those things society has created. Maybe the word is used differently by random posters on OUHOOPS, but the national perception of most is just like Sky has described. I have had this discussion with many of the police officers I work with, including black officers. They fully know the trend and use of the word.........
 
I promise you, no matter how many times you deny it, the word thug is used mostly to describe young black males. Being an athlete is secondary. You mentioned 2 exceptions where white athletes may have been called thugs on THIS board. It is very rare. Sky gave excellent examples.

Another example is music/entertainment figures. Justin Bieber has done far more, and far worse than Stevie Clark has done. Show me one outlet where he is/was referred to as a thug? Like I said I'm not blaming white people, anymore than I'm blaming them for the continued use of the N-word. Black America is the main reason both of the terms are used to identify black people in 2014........ IMO

I don't often boast about myself, but I don't take a backseat to many on this subject. Because of my work with inner city kids, I have increased my education and studied these types of trends. I have a BS in Human Services, and a Master's in Sociology, with many hours logged in social work settings. I did a 79 page research paper/professor graded paper on a very similar subject.

Like I said, Many scholars who I consider much more versed in this than myself have written very educated/researched reports on this subject. Most of their conclusion is that THUG is the modern day N-word.

I would challenge you to do what Sky suggested: Scan random message boards, sports news sites, local news sites, etc and find a random story about a black male. Drop down to the comments and within one or two, you will see the word thug used to describe the person, or the black race in general. Many times it's unfounded. Heck, I found an article about Blake Griffin doing the new commercials, and instantly comments below referred to him as a thug, 1/2 n-word, etc..... Heck I have never heard anyone in the hip hop world refer to Eminem as a thug. I have never seen many discuss Little Wayne or Kanye West without calling them a thug.

Just one of those things society has created. Maybe the word is used differently by random posters on OUHOOPS, but the national perception of most is just like Sky has described. I have had this discussion with many of the police officers I work with, including black officers. They fully know the trend and use of the word.........

:clap:clap:clap
 
The state of Oklahoma has a prisoner re-entry program that DOC uses to re-integrate ex-offenders back into society. The young men who utilize the program are given classes on life skills, improving their job readiness, educational improvement, anger management, etc.... inmates within 1 year of release are offered the program, but not required.

Many of the local counseling agencies, and therapy based agencies help out with the training. One of the learning blocks DOC offers the black/hispanic males is a class called, " Changing How You Are Perceived". I have helped teach this class to inmates who are at a local halfway house in OKC. The curriculum was developed by educated social workers, law enforcement, and religious leaders. It teaches those males how to change their appearance, use proper English, and present themselves as non-threatening.

The pamphlet explains to them that society will see them as gang bangers or street thugs if they: wear sagging pants, wear jewelry in their mouths, and it even discusses the perception of having a neat haircut, versus the unkempt look, or out of control braids/dreadlocks. The class is available to white/asian inmates who ask for it. Black and hispanic males are often forced to go by their PO's.

It is a very good class and helps many young black men understand they will be heavily judged by society, if they continue to embrace a certain culture that features certain looks. The love of the thug culture is a huge problem in inner city America and I applaud the states that are trying to address it.......
 
Traveler and Ada: You and I are all part of the same generation. I guess we've got a lot to learn. Then again, maybe some of the younger guys on this board could learn a few things from us.

Are you sure? Most youngsters these days think they already know it all. ;)
 
Here is a very interesting article on the subject. It was in response to the fallout after the Richard Sherman interview.

http://www.diversityinc.com/news/is-thug-the-new-n-word/



Seattle Seahawks football player Richard Sherman drew unwanted attention to himself on Sunday after an emotional—and some say unnecessary—display during a postgame interview.

Now he is turning the tables on his critics. On Wednesday, he responded to the many people who called him a thug for his behavior, saying, “The only reason it bothers me is because it seems like it’s the accepted way of calling somebody the N-word nowadays. It’s like everyone else said the N-word and they said ‘Thug’ and they’re like, ‘Ah, that’s fine.’ That’s where it kind of takes me aback and it’s kind of disappointing.”

In the interview, on the field immediately after he made a game-saving deflection that sent his team to the Super Bowl, Sherman said this to FOX’s Erin Andrews: “I’m the best corner in the game! When you try me with a sorry receiver like [San Francisco 49er Michael] Crabtree, that’s the result you gonna get! Don’t you ever talk about me! … Don’t you open your mouth about the best or I’m gonna shut it for you real quick!”

On Wednesday, Sherman chose to ignore the many people who in fact used the N-word and instead only addressed those who called him a thug—and there were a lot, even in the mainstream media. Based on closed captioning, iQ Media counted 625 mentions of “thug” on Monday across all media markets, with the simulcast of a Boston sports-radio talk show recording 12 thugs in a two-minute span.

“What’s the definition of a thug really?” Sherman said, referencing a recent National Hockey League game that featured a fight during the opening faceoff. “Maybe I’m talking loudly and doing something I’m not supposed to. But I’m not … There was a hockey game where they didn’t even play hockey. They just threw the puck aside and started fighting. I saw that and said, ‘Oh, man. I’m the thug? What’s going on here?’”

In fact, a microphone on Sherman revealed that after time expired, he ran up to Crabtree, said, “Hell of a game, hell of a game,” and tried to shake Crabtree’s hand. Crabtree shoved him in the helmet before an official escorted Sherman away.


A Stanford graduate, Sherman says he has constantly had to deal with the preconceived notions people have of him as a Black man who grew up in Compton, Calif. Despite attending a high school in a district with a 57 percent graduation rate, Sherman finished with a 4.2 grade-point average and was class salutatorian, earning a scholarship to one of the most prestigious academic institutions in the world. He also grew up idolizing boxer Muhammad Ali, who was not one to shy away from a camera, so perhaps it is no surprise that Sherman displays a healthy bit of bravado.

“I know some thugs, and they know I’m the furthest thing from a thug,” Sherman said. “I’ve fought that my whole life, just coming from where I’m coming from. Just because you hear Compton, you hear Watts, you hear cities like that, you just think, ‘Thug, he’s a gangster, he’s this, that and the other,’ and then you hear Stanford, and they’re like, ‘Oh, man, that doesn’t even make sense, that’s an oxymoron.’ You fight it for so long, and to have it come back up and people start to use it again, it’s really frustrating.”

‘We Haven’t Come as Far as I Thought’

In a Tuesday interview with CNN that aired on Friday, Sherman was more introspective, acknowledging that he may have crossed a line. “I probably shouldn’t have attacked another person,” he said. “You know, I don’t mean to attack [Crabtree]. And that was immature and I probably shouldn’t have done that. I regret doing that.”

He also said his piece about the comments coming from the less civilized corners of the Internet.

“It was really mind-boggling the way the world reacted,” Sherman said. “I can’t say the world, I don’t want to generalize people like that because there are a lot of great people who didn’t react that way. But for the people who did react that way and throw the racial slurs and things like that out there, it was really sad. Especially that close to Martin Luther King Day.

“I learned we haven’t come as far as I thought we had. I thought society had moved past that.”
 
Another example is music/entertainment figures. Justin Bieber has done far more, and far worse than Stevie Clark has done. Show me one outlet where he is/was referred to as a thug? Like I said I'm not blaming white people, anymore than I'm blaming them for the continued use of the N-word. Black America is the main reason both of the terms are used to identify black people in 2014........ IMO

http://www.tmz.com/2014/01/10/justin-bieber-egg-attack-video-tmz-tv/

http://www.laprogressive.com/justin-bieber-thug/

http://bolesblogs.com/2014/02/12/why-does-justin-bieber-want-to-be-a-thug/

There are hundreds more if you Google it. And those are actual articles or new publications, not yahoos on a message board.



I don't often boast about myself, but I don't take a backseat to many on this subject. Because of my work with inner city kids, I have increased my education and studied these types of trends. I have a BS in Human Services, and a Master's in Sociology, with many hours logged in social work settings. I did a 79 page research paper/professor graded paper on a very similar subject.

Maybe you are too close to the subject then? Or maybe you are seeing it from one angle so often, that you cannot see it any other way? While I don't have your experience, I do have the value of having seen this stuff from many different angles. Being a white minority in HS. Being someone that listens almost exclusively to rap and hip hop. Coming from a conservative family. Working in the environment I work in. And the list goes on. When a family member of mine uses the word thug, it is almost assuredly different in meaning then when I use it. Or when a friend from HS used/uses it. Or when the media uses it to describe Kanye, Bieber, or whomever. When people were saying that about Richard Sherman.....some had it wrong (using the thug meaning that a lot of you older folks, and jmizzy, want to use), but others simply meant it as another word for punk, which according to the dictionary definition below, actually fits. Just b/c a word was used historically one way, or is still used in large part one way, doesn't mean there aren't other meanings, or that the word's usage/meaning isn't changing. You should know that, as I'm sure you are around that very thing every day. Words that mean one thing one day, due to a rap song, or whatever, take on an entirely different meaning overnight. And words that were stronger or more powerful decades ago, don't have the same fierceness in meaning now, b/c today's kids and young adults throw around words like that in a much more common way.
 
Really glad neither of the Clark brothers are at OU. We don't need that kind of crap on our teams or campus -'just trouble and drama waiting to happen IMO
 
Jimmy if you've never heard Eminem being called a thug then you haven't had many conversations about him. Also people constantly call Marshall Henderson a thug, deservedly so. I teach at a high school and in no way does race have anything to do whether someone is called a thug or not. Maybe in the 90s that was true but in most instances it has changed.
 
Well said WT. I actually agree 100% with most of what u said.

Maybe I'm not making my point clear. Words definitely take on new meaning. My point is the word Thug has done exactly that, & because a few older posters don't use it as such, doesn't mean it's not so....

A common trend on message boards is for posters to make absolute statements. " I never do that, so it isn't a problem".
" My friends don't say that, so it's not a problem".

I have learned a well presented, new perspective from your post. Thanks for sharing that.
 
Jimmy if you've never heard Eminem being called a thug then you haven't had many conversations about him. Also people constantly call Marshall Henderson a thug, deservedly so. I teach at a high school and in no way does race have anything to do whether someone is called a thug or not. Maybe in the 90s that was true but in most instances it has changed.

Agree to disagree. U missed my point entirely. If eminem is called a thug it was probably cause he earned it. Most black rappers are called thugs regardless....

Your high school represents a very small demographic & sample size. National trends & countless experts disagree with u....
 
Well said WT. I actually agree 100% with most of what u said.

Maybe I'm not making my point clear. Words definitely take on new meaning. My point is the word Thug has done exactly that, & because a few older posters don't use it as such, doesn't mean it's not so....

A common trend on message boards is for posters to make absolute statements. " I never do that, so it isn't a problem".
" My friends don't say that, so it's not a problem".

I have learned a well presented, new perspective from your post. Thanks for sharing that.

Wait. So we're not going to fight about this? Dang it. ;)

For the record, I get what you are saying too. I think a lot of it is in the perspective.

Side question.....what do you think of the NFL wanting to penalize players for using the n-word during games? I would think most of what is used is used by black players towards black players, and not really in what I would consider a negative way. Again, kind of goes back to words meaning different things depending on who uses it, when it is used, and the tone. Thoughts?
 
Agree to disagree. U missed my point entirely. If eminem is called a thug it was probably cause he earned it. Most black rappers are called thugs regardless....

Your high school represents a very small demographic & sample size. National trends & countless experts disagree with u....
Pretty sure Kendrick Lamar will not be seen as a Thug.
 
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Wait. So we're not going to fight about this? Dang it. ;)

For the record, I get what you are saying too. I think a lot of it is in the perspective.

Side question.....what do you think of the NFL wanting to penalize players for using the n-word during games? I would think most of what is used is used by black players towards black players, and not really in what I would consider a negative way. Again, kind of goes back to words meaning different things depending on who uses it, when it is used, and the tone. Thoughts?

I agree. My question is how do they enforce it?? I would bet over 90% of the offenders would be black.

I think the resources would be better spent on educational efforts within the league, trying to educate players(mostly the black ones), on the history of the word & why it shouldn't be used.

I was shocked by the amount of young black kids who use the N-word & know nothing about it's history. Ignorance is the #1 fueling force in racism/racial tension.

Dialogue like this destroys ignorance, but I understand why it's hard to allow it on boards because people get so emotional...

I think the NFL is trying to do damage control after the Dolphin deal.

A lot of it is to appease black America, which is stupid until black America holds itself accountable. IMO....
 
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