Was Capel back today

[KCRuf/Nek]

As much as people are talking about the end of the game I'm surprised no one has discussed the last five minutes of the first half. I'm not exactly sure of the time but we were ahead 28-20 and seemed to have them where we wanted. Over that time we let them back into the game when they were struggling. Maybe the ability to finish and close out will come with time but it is frustrating.

 

[SoonerinNC]

Considering our depth, we should not be suprised that we faded at the end of each half.

And fouls 23 to 14. With the way the Aggies play defense. A lot of bad calls and virtually all against the Sooners. And with them having to foul to catch up at the end of regulation. Nearest thing I have seen to a homer job in a long time. Can only happen in Texas.

We got called every time an A&M player missed a shot.

We have to find a way to maintain the intensity for the whole game. We need Neal, Clark and Arent to give productive minutes. And we need another productive ball handler.

 

[NickZepp]

Look our talent level is still really low. It's tough to finish games with very little offense from the guards. Cam Clark has no half court offensive game. Our point guard can't score. We basically have one guard that can score and 2 post players. Losing Newell probably lost our chances at the NCAA Tournament. If he stayed he probably would be starting by now with how ineffective Clark has been. And we would have another guard that could stretch defenses and make us a lot tougher to beat.

 

[Big Old Booger]

If you will remember, a year ago today with Capel as our coach we had just won a thriller on the road at ISU behind Pledgers 38 to go to 3-3 instead of crumbling down the stretch and going to 2-4. Capel actually never lost a game in OT at OU. I believe he was 6-0. (Correction 7-0)

The difference between last year's 0-3 start and this years 0-3 start was last year we rebounded and won 4 straight including a 4th against Baylor in Norman. Hopefully we can pull the upset again this year and at least salvage 3-4. Otherwise we are staring at 2-5.

With all the same players but adding Romero Osby who was a beast again today, and getting rid of Capel who most think was the cause of our problems, and replacing him with Kruger who we pretty much all agree is as good coach you would think there should be improvement from then to now. But so far in Big 12 play it's not the case.

Well, Capel had gimme games vs Colorado last year that kick started that 4 game win streak. He also had a gimme game vs Nebraska and we lost at home in much the same scenario as the end of the aTm game (yesterday) in regulation.

Kruger doesnt get the luxury of Colorado and Nebraska on the schedule and now we have to play KU, MU, and KSU, probably 3 of the best 4 teams in the conference each twice. Thank goodness we didn't play them twice the last 3 years or our record would have been much worse.

Capel inherited a winning program and we saw what he did with it. Now Kruger inherited a losing program and I will bet you any amount of money we are a winning program when he calls it quits.

 

[AdaSooner]

Look our talent level is still really low. It's tough to finish games with very little offense from the guards. Cam Clark has no half court offensive game. Our point guard can't score. We basically have one guard that can score and 2 post players. Losing Newell probably lost our chances at the NCAA Tournament. If he stayed he probably would be starting by now with how ineffective Clark has been. And we would have another guard that could stretch defenses and make us a lot tougher to beat.

You touched on an issue that hasn't received the attention it deserves.

Grooms inability to score is huge problem right now. It's obvious that every team we play does not see him as a scoring threat when they're in a zone. And, why should they? He's shooting 33% from the field and 22% from behind the arc.

That essentially gives our opponents an extra defender to cheat in the direction of the limited options we have on offense, whether it's to make sure Pledger doesn't get wide open threes, or to double down on our bigs.

That's why Cam, Carl and Tyler have to contribute more on the offensive end if this team is to be successful going forward. Sam is good at controlling and distributing the ball. He's just not a point guard who can be counted on to score, especially against a zone, which is a defense I think we'll see more often.

 

[jerry]

Stalling out until 8 seconds left trying to win the game, same crap, same out come. Drive the freeking ball to the basket and shoot your free throws, even if time left on the clock at least they have the pressure to score.

The best thing that could happen to this board would be if Capel's name was never mentioned again.

 

[WTSooner]

You touched on an issue that hasn't received the attention it deserves.

Grooms inability to score is huge problem right now.

I've brought it up several times. :vitale

It is a problem, mostly b/c he is always on the court with a guy that can't really create on his own (Pledger), and another guard that is struggling on offense as well (Blair, Cam, Neal). OU is really easy to guard right now, and it shows if you watch the games.

This is nothing personal against Grooms, but I don't think OU has the kind of talent year in and year out to get by with a pass first point guard. Pass first might not be the best way to put it, b/c I'd put Quannis White in that category, but he could also shoot it at a high clip, he just wasn't required to take many shots all that often. Most of the really good pass first pg's can either hit open jumpers or finish around the rim. Currently, Grooms isn't really good at either of those. Could we get by with having him at pg if we were more loaded at the 2/3 spots? Probably. But we aren't. And it shows. I'm certainly not putting any more blame on Grooms than I am Cam, they are both equally ineffective right now.

 

[AdaSooner]

I've brought it up several times. :vitale

It is a problem, mostly b/c he is always on the court with a guy that can't really create on his own (Pledger), and another guard that is struggling on offense as well (Blair, Cam, Neal). OU is really easy to guard right now, and it shows if you watch the games.

This is nothing personal against Grooms, but I don't think OU has the kind of talent year in and year out to get by with a pass first point guard. Pass first might not be the best way to put it, b/c I'd put Quannis White in that category, but he could also shoot it at a high clip, he just wasn't required to take many shots all that often. Most of the really good pass first pg's can either hit open jumpers or finish around the rim. Currently, Grooms isn't really good at either of those. Could we get by with having him at pg if we were more loaded at the 2/3 spots? Probably. But we aren't. And it shows. I'm certainly not putting any more blame on Grooms than I am Cam, they are both equally ineffective right now.

That's true, you have. Guess I should have said it's a topic that has been way down the list of importance for the majority of posters.

You're right about our struggles on offense. But I would rather see Grooms pass the ball to a 50% shooter inside or to a guard/wing who is far more likely to make a shot than to take shots with little chance of going in. I understand why he can't stop shooting completely. I just believe he should go back to passing more and shooting less.

 

[NickZepp]

Grooms doesn't really have that benefit because we basically only have Pledger outside. And Fitz doesn't always make his shots too. He's a lot better this year don't get me wrong but for a big guy he also shoots a lot of low percentage shots. Particuarly his hook shots and kinda weird angles he has on some shots inside and he has a decent jumper, but that's probably going in about 30-40% of the time. Which is good for a big but still it hurts the offense. Don't get me wrong on Fitz either, he's been our most consistent scorer in Bgi 12 play inside. But it seems like he wants to make the game a bit harder than it is.

As I said earlier we basically have to rely on Fitz, Osby, and Pledger to score a ton every game. It makes it tough for the offense to really put up points. None of them can have a bad night.

 

[WTSooner]

You're right about our struggles on offense. But I would rather see Grooms pass the ball to a 50% shooter inside or to a guard/wing who is far more likely to make a shot than to take shots with little chance of going in. I understand why he can't stop shooting completely. I just believe he should go back to passing more and shooting less.

Agreed. I think I said this the other night, but I wish LK would implement a little of the Kelvin Sampson offensive philosophy of dictating who can take what shots. This team is a lot like some of the early teams he had at OU, in that we have several guys that can't, or aren't, doing much offensively. Limiting their shots, and trying to get more from the guys that are capable would only help our offense.

I also think we should try to run a bit more. Not sure why we stopped pushing the ball off of steals and defensive rebounds. I get why we stopped pressing and trapping, I knew that was coming. But as quick as Grooms is with the ball, and as much trouble as we have getting good looks in the half court, I think pushing it may produce a few more open looks for us, especially Pledger.

 

[garyeb2]

Assets minus liabilities equalls net worth. Are we forgetting to look at Grooms through that prism? He does most everything a point guard is expected to do very well. Without him this team would be in a heck of a mess.

 

[luckyc1423]

Assets minus liabilities equalls net worth. Are we forgetting to look at Grooms through that prism? He does most everything a point guard is expected to do very well. Without him this team would be in a heck of a mess.

I agree without grooms we would struggle even more...im not sure what everyone on here is talking about...kid adds quickness to the point

he cant shoot, but neither can blare. Grooms is by far our best point guard without a shadow of a doubt.

 

[WTSooner]

I agree without grooms we would struggle even more...

That statement doesn't really prove anything though. It doesn't prove that Grooms doesn't hurt the team in some ways. This team, as limited as they are talent-wise and depth-wise, would miss just about anybody if they just dropped off the roster. Grooms is important b/c he is the only good ball handler on the team. I don't disagree with that. But we also struggle on offense b/c of Grooms as well. Quickness and good ball handling don't mean much when you get in the lane and miss "good looks."

 

[thebigabd]

"The fact that Lon Kruger could pull this off in his first year tells you a little about Lon. We’ve had a pretty good run here, a lot of great coaches, a lot of great people. The Lon Kruger era will be as good as any.” - Kelvin Sampson

What did Lon pull off in his first year?

 

[MsProudSooner]

What did Lon pull off in his first year?

By the way, abd, we are still waiting for your post about the win over KState at home.

In case you've forgotten, you said:

At the end of the day, its an amateur basketball team that none of us even play for. You are taking it way too seriously, and taking people on this forum way too seriously. Lighten up! If they suck, I post about how they suck. If they are good, I post about how good they are. Posting is a direct reflection of the teams performance, and thats how it should be.

Since they played so well against KSU, we've all been waiting for your post about how well they played.

For your convenience, here's a link to the thread:

http://ouhoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=24158&page=3

 

[Sawyer]

Grooms' shooting percentages are pretty horrific, but he's only about 7% lower from the field and from three than Pressey. With the amount he shoots, the difference is really only another made shot every game... Not really that much, and Pressey may be the best point guard in the conference. I am pretty sure Grooms was a much better shooter in juco than this. He's capable of being a competent scorer. Might not be a bad idea to try to get him more shots to get him going a bit. There really isn't much to lose at this point.

 

[AdaSooner]

I agree without grooms we would struggle even more...im not sure what everyone on here is talking about...kid adds quickness to the point

he cant shoot, but neither can blare. Grooms is by far our best point guard without a shadow of a doubt.

I agree that Blair at 30% from the field and 33% from three doesn't do much to improve our shooting stats. That's why I said Grooms should pass more to post players who shoot 50% from the field and to our guards and wings. His back court teammates may not be consistent as scoring options from one game to the next. But they're far more likely to make a shot as a point guard who shoots a dismal 30% from the field and 22% from three point range.

Don't get me wrong, I, too, believe Grooms is our best option at the one. As I said earlier, he does a good job of taking care of the ball and running our offense. His 2.62 assists to turnover ratio (#2 in the conference) is proof of that.

All I'm saying is that I would like to see him go back to a pass-first mindset and think less about getting his own shots. Notice that I said think less about shooting. I am not suggesting that he should quit shooting altogether.

 

[AdaSooner]

What did Lon pull off in his first year?

:facepalm

You're up and down so much, maybe we should call you Yo-Yo.

 

[thebigabd]

:facepalm

You're up and down so much, maybe we should call you Yo-Yo.

What? What did he pull off? I just dont understand the quote.

Usually when the term "pulled off" is used it is because somebody did something extraordinary. They are 12-6, 2-4 heading into the hard part of the schedule. It's not terrible, but I dont think anyone is thinking Lon pulled some great feat here.

 

[garyeb2]

If Grooms was a good shooter, he would have signed with North Carolina. OU is lucky to have him. Grooms presence doesn't hurt the offense, Grooms presence helps the offense. Without him, they couldn't get the ball up court. Without him they don't have anyone to throw it to the open man any more often than they turn it over.

Last game Groom's stat line was pretty good. It wasn't Grooms that shot 33% from the field and missed the money shot. Kruger is getting alot of mileage out of Fitz and that 12/15 ft. jumper. Osby is a legit Big 12 caliber player. Grooms has brought stability and solid point guard play.

And Cam, even though hit can not hit the broad side of a barn, is really good in transition and a very good defender. And since conference play has started, all Pyrite Pledger has brought to the table is his 33% field goal pct. Nothing else.

The bench is weak. The drop off from the starters to CJ, Carl, Tyler, and Arent is just too steep to be very competitive in the Big 12. That is the main reason we have a hard time looking good for 40 minutes.