OU-ISU comparrision

[snydrosooner]

OK so ISU has 2 of the top 5(6) players in the b12. So how do they finish tied for 3rd? Are there other players that much below big 12 talent?

How do the compare to OU roster the team that finished above them with no first team players? If you take The 2 best players off of each roster who is the better team?

This is not neccisarly a knock on ISU, just trying to see if there players (at least 2) are looked at as being so good, how did they not finish better in conference?

 

[CoachTalk]

The players around those 2. OU is a better "team"... would you rather have neal/cousins or ISU 6-7th men..
Spangler or their big

 

[DenverSooner]

Balanced teams have a tougher time getting guys on the all conference team simply because they don't have the numbers of key players on other teams.

I do not think ISU's other players are significantly below the level of OU's players. Ejim, Kane and Niang are all very good players. Hogue is also a very good player. He averages 10.4 points and 8.6 rebounds per game.

 

[IndySooner]

Also, preseason expectations come into play.

 

[WTSooner]

The players around those 2. OU is a better "team"... would you rather have neal/cousins or ISU 6-7th men..
Spangler or their big

Uhh.....

I'd take Ejim for sure over Spangler. Not sure I'd tank Niang over Spangler, but I'd certainly take him over Clark.

I'd probably take Long over Neal, but that is kind of a toss up.

Kane over Woodard.

I think ISU has slightly more talent then we do, but they are even more dependent on the 3 than we are. I feel like OU does other things better than ISU (get to the rim, and to the FT line). The reliance on the 3 point shooting is probably the biggest reason ISU didn't finish better than they did. And they were just one game behind us. Not like they were way back.

 

[WTSooner]

If i were picking a starting team, and a bench guard and bench big man from each roster, I'd probably go with:

Kane
Cousins
Hield
Ejim
Niang

Long/Hornbeak
Spangler

Pretty close. I think OU's depth is a bit better, but ISU matches up pretty well thru 7 guys. And for the record, I counted Cam and Neal as "forwards". If you want to call them guards, they'd compete for that bench guard spot. I just don't think either is a guard in the sense that they can play the 1-3 spots.

 

[allday92]

I would take Clark over Niang. Better scorer, better shooter, averages more rebounds and can guard more positions.

 

[Swans]

Interesting because they are consistently seeded ahead of us by all the bracket pickets also.

 

[CoachTalk]

Uhh.....

I'd take Ejim for sure over Spangler. Not sure I'd tank Niang over Spangler, but I'd certainly take him over Clark.

I'd probably take Long over Neal, but that is kind of a toss up.

Kane over Woodard.

I think ISU has slightly more talent then we do, but they are even more dependent on the 3 than we are. I feel like OU does other things better than ISU (get to the rim, and to the FT line). The reliance on the 3 point shooting is probably the biggest reason ISU didn't finish better than they did. And they were just one game behind us. Not like they were way back.

I'm saying take away the top players that were selected for them and not the ones were selected for us..

 

[NickZepp]

OU's defense down the stretch is the key. OU's defense since the meeting between ISU Feb 1st has been better overall. OU allowed 91 against WVU, 83 against KU(which OU played a pretty good defensive 2nd half) and no more than 74 the rest of the games. ISU has allowed games of 102, 97(3OT), 81(OT), 80, 76, and 74 points in that same period.

 

[DenverSooner]

If i were picking a starting team, and a bench guard and bench big man from each roster, I'd probably go with:

Kane
Cousins
Hield
Ejim
Niang

Long/Hornbeak
Spangler

Pretty close. I think OU's depth is a bit better, but ISU matches up pretty well thru 7 guys. And for the record, I counted Cam and Neal as "forwards". If you want to call them guards, they'd compete for that bench guard spot. I just don't think either is a guard in the sense that they can play the 1-3 spots.

I would have a hard time picking a combined team of 10. I would definitely take your starting 5 plus Clark, Woodard, Spangler and Hogue in no particular order. That would be a pretty amazing 9 deep. Spangler, Ejim and Hogoue are the top 3 rebounders in the league. Kane and Clark are both in the top 20 rebounders. The 3 point shooting would be incredible. Everyone except Spangler shoots better than 32% from 3. Woodard and Kane are two of the best assist guys in the league. You might do something crazy and Take Bennett as your 10th guy for shot blocking and size simply because you don't lack any skills. That would mean passing on Long and Neal who are both really good 3 point shooters.

 

[originalsooner55]

I would have a hard time picking a combined team of 10. I would definitely take your starting 5 plus Clark, Woodard, Spangler and Hogue in no particular order. That would be a pretty amazing 9 deep. Spangler, Ejim and Hogoue are the top 3 rebounders in the league. Kane and Clark are both in the top 20 rebounders. The 3 point shooting would be incredible. Everyone except Spangler shoots better than 32% from 3. Woodard and Kane are two of the best assist guys in the league. You might do something crazy and Take Bennett as your 10th guy for shot blocking and size simply because you don't lack any skills. That would mean passing on Long and Neal who are both really good 3 point shooters.[/
Don't think I would take Niagn over Spangler, but the rest looks good.

 

[IndySooner]

Interesting because they are consistently seeded ahead of us by all the bracket pickets also.

They had much better non-conference wins.

 

[Section31]

Defense is rarely considered when determining who the better player is. I like WTs list, but I wonder if some of the Sooner players are just better all around players when defense, assists, etc are figured in. I'd venture to guess that's why we have a better team. I don't think those ISU players are as well rounded as their Sooner counterparts.

 

[originalsooner55]

Defense is rarely considered when determining who the better player is. I like WTs list, but I wonder if some of the Sooner players are just better all around players when defense, assists, etc are figured in. I'd venture to guess that's why we have a better team. I don't think those ISU players are as well rounded as their Sooner counterparts.

I agree, that has to be the case because if you have 3 of the 5 from. ISU as starters and 2 from OU we should not have beat them like we did, and if we play ISU in the Big 12 Tour., I would venture to say, we beat them again. There is alot that goes into a game besides scoring, which don't get me wrong, you have to score but OU as a team does alot more than just score.

 

[WTSooner]

Defense is rarely considered when determining who the better player is. I like WTs list, but I wonder if some of the Sooner players are just better all around players when defense, assists, etc are figured in. I'd venture to guess that's why we have a better team. I don't think those ISU players are as well rounded as their Sooner counterparts.

Who are you talking about specifically?

For example, I think Niang is a better rebounder than his numbers show. Why? Because he was splitting rebounds with Ejim (basically even with Spangler) and Hogue. Spangler didn't have nearly as much competition inside for rebounds.

Niang was also considerably better, in conference play, than Cam.

There is no magic formula, since we can't compare apples to apples. I just know that when I watch Niang play, I love what he brings to the table. I think he scores it MUCH better than Spangler at this point. I think he can probably rebound nearly as well, but playing alongside Ejim (on ISU and on my OU/ISU team), he wouldn't have to be a great rebounder. Just good.

A lot of it is preference. Different people like to build teams different ways, and with different specialties. So if two players are semi-even, it comes down to what the guy choosing the roster favors. Size? Athleticism? Positional flexibility?

 

[WTSooner]

I agree, that has to be the case because if you have 3 of the 5 from. ISU as starters and 2 from OU we should not have beat them like we did,

That is terrible logic.

Would anybody from TT or LA Tech start for OU? We lost to both.

 

[DenverSooner]

I would have a hard time picking a combined team of 10. I would definitely take your starting 5 plus Clark, Woodard, Spangler and Hogue in no particular order. That would be a pretty amazing 9 deep. Spangler, Ejim and Hogoue are the top 3 rebounders in the league. Kane and Clark are both in the top 20 rebounders. The 3 point shooting would be incredible. Everyone except Spangler shoots better than 32% from 3. Woodard and Kane are two of the best assist guys in the league. You might do something crazy and Take Bennett as your 10th guy for shot blocking and size simply because you don't lack any skills. That would mean passing on Long and Neal who are both really good 3 point shooters.[/
Don't think I would take Niagn over Spangler, but the rest looks good.

I meant none of them in particular order. You could start a lot of different combinations. I think the starting line up would be determined by how they played defense together because you are set for scoring. You have 9 guys that can go for 15 plus on any given day.

 

[DenverSooner]

Who are you talking about specifically?

For example, I think Niang is a better rebounder than his numbers show. Why? Because he was splitting rebounds with Ejim (basically even with Spangler) and Hogue. Spangler didn't have nearly as much competition inside for rebounds.

Niang was also considerably better, in conference play, than Cam.

There is no magic formula, since we can't compare apples to apples. I just know that when I watch Niang play, I love what he brings to the table. I think he scores it MUCH better than Spangler at this point. I think he can probably rebound nearly as well, but playing alongside Ejim (on ISU and on my OU/ISU team), he wouldn't have to be a great rebounder. Just good.

A lot of it is preference. Different people like to build teams different ways, and with different specialties. So if two players are semi-even, it comes down to what the guy choosing the roster favors. Size? Athleticism? Positional flexibility?

Does it have to be Niang or Clark? I would like to see Ejim and Spangler play together. Ejim can step out and hit 3 pointers and create his own shot. Kane is a better 3 point shooter and scorer than Woodard so even if Ejim and Spangler cost you a little on offense, Kane could make it up.

I agree with you that Niang is a really good player. There are easily 10 really good players on a combined team. Guys like Neal, Long and Hornbeak would get cut.

 

[Section31]

Who are you talking about specifically?

For example, I think Niang is a better rebounder than his numbers show. Why? Because he was splitting rebounds with Ejim (basically even with Spangler) and Hogue. Spangler didn't have nearly as much competition inside for rebounds.

Niang was also considerably better, in conference play, than Cam.

There is no magic formula, since we can't compare apples to apples. I just know that when I watch Niang play, I love what he brings to the table. I think he scores it MUCH better than Spangler at this point. I think he can probably rebound nearly as well, but playing alongside Ejim (on ISU and on my OU/ISU team), he wouldn't have to be a great rebounder. Just good.

A lot of it is preference. Different people like to build teams different ways, and with different specialties. So if two players are semi-even, it comes down to what the guy choosing the roster favors. Size? Athleticism? Positional flexibility?

I was just making a general observation. The problem with your logic is you're making assumptions about them based off their situation. If Niang has the ability to rebound it better, he's not doing it. Part of that can be that load being shared OR it could be his lack of desire OR he's just not a talented rebounder. There's SOME reason OU beat them and played them down to the wire in the other game. Seems to me our players must be equally better at different parts of the game or ISU would have at the very least won both games and in convincing fashion in the home game considering each of their players are just better. Again, enjoying watching someone play and subsequently implying that makes them the better player doesn't make sense.

Its like OSU claiming they had the better football team this past year.