Porter to.........Villanova???

SoonerDutch said:
Bold take but props to your conviction.
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How is it bold? Five years, an Elite 8 appearance and four total tourney wins. Made the tourney as a 6-seed and a 2-seed. CW is one for four, made it as a 9-seed, and got bounced in round one. Capel sucked his last two years. His first year, he took over in a tougher spot than Moser because he didn't inherit 3 starters and didn't have the transfer portal to replace the guys who left when Kelvin left. I can't stand Capel and think he was a bad coach, but he managed to have one great and one good season. You can claim it was all due to Blake, but freshman Fears had a better season than freshman Blake, and our results this year didn't match the '08 team.
 
IndySooner said:
And how would my sources close to the OU basketball program be predisposed to like him and speak highly of him? The same people couldn't stand Jeff Capel back in the day. They are the people telling me that unless things change from a support perspective nothing is changing from a results perspective.
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Moser > Capel.

Take Blake Griffin away from Capel, and the program is a bigger dumpster fire than it was when he left it. He left us with two losing seasons in a row and sanctions. After rehabilitating himself at Duke, he landed at Pitt. At Pitt, he has four losing seasons out of seven with one NCAA tournament win and a winning percentage of .516. That includes 17-15 this year playing in a weakened ACC.

Porter's good, but not great. I'd take him over Capel, though.
 
AnotherSoonerInTX said:
Moser > Capel.

Take Blake Griffin away from Capel, and the program is a bigger dumpster fire than it was when he left it. He left us with two losing seasons in a row. After rehabilitating himself at Duke, he landed at Pitt. At Pitt, he has four losing seasons out of seven with one NCAA tournament win and a winning percentage of .516. That includes 17-15 this year playing in a weakened ACC.

Porter's good, but not great. I'd take him over Capel, though.
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Take Fears away from Moser and Moser is looking at no tourney appearance in four seasons and likely two losing seasons in that same time period. We can do this all day. Not saying I'd take Capel back, but let's not act like the highs of the Capel era weren't much higher than what they've been with Moser.
 
cbertus6 said:
Take Fears away from Moser and Moser is looking at no tourney appearance in four seasons and likely two losing seasons in that same time period. We can do this all day. Not saying I'd take Capel back, but let's not act like the highs of the Capel era weren't much higher than what they've been with Moser.
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Yep, love how all the Moser fans want to "take Blake/Buddy away" from Capel and Lon, but don't acknowledge that Moser would almost certainly be unemployed right now if Fears hadn't made a late decision to reclassify.
 
WichitaSooner said:
How is it bold? Five years, an Elite 8 appearance and four total tourney wins. Made the tourney as a 6-seed and a 2-seed. CW is one for four, made it as a 9-seed, and got bounced in round one. Capel sucked his last two years. His first year, he took over in a tougher spot than Moser because he didn't inherit 3 starters and didn't have the transfer portal to replace the guys who left when Kelvin left. I can't stand Capel and think he was a bad coach, but he managed to have one great and one good season. You can claim it was all due to Blake, but freshman Fears had a better season than freshman Blake, and our results this year didn't match the '08 team.
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First off he left OU in ruins and on sanctions lol. I’m discounting “having the best player” in college basketball as well. You frequently discount Moser’s FF run with Krutwig as a fluke, I’ll discount an E8 run with the first overall pick and arguably most talented guy to come through OU.

In what way was the 07-08 definitively better than this season? The 07-08 Team finished 4th in a conference with two ranked teams. They beat a mid-major in the first round. Their final KP was 44. OU’s this season was 40.

Again, I’d agree it’s best for both sides to move on (in an affordable way) but like discounting an all conference guy as “mediocre,” some of these takes about Moser seem emotional.

It’s fair to say Moser is likely gone without Fears (I don’t think the “apologists” have said that) but it seems like it’s painful for the “obsessed” to admit that without a Wooden award winner on the roster, OU hasn’t been better than a 9 seed since 06. LK finished above bottom half in conference play once post-Buddy? Just seems like the environment more than the guy being uniquely bad.
 
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SoonerDutch said:
First off he left OU in ruins and on sanctions lol. I’m discounting “having the best player” in college basketball as well. You frequently discount Moser’s FF run with Krutwig as a fluke, I’ll discount an E8 run with the first overall pick and arguably most talented guy to come through OU.

In what way was the 07-08 definitively better than this season? The 07-08 Team finished 4th in a conference with two ranked teams. They beat a mid-major in the first round. Their final KP was 44. OU’s this season was 40.

Again, I’d agree it’s best for both sides to move on (in an affordable way) but like discounting an all conference guy as “mediocre,” some of these takes about Moser seem emotional.
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The question was results, not sanctions or how he left the program. But if you want to go that route, while Moser is clean, if/when he and his agent finally find a soft landing place, he isn't leaving the program in a good place, either. Four (or more) years of mediocre (at best) results, a constant revolving door of a roster, and a fan base that is becoming less and less interested as we fall further away from national relevance.

And you fail to respond to my point that Blake as a freshman was not as good as Fears. As for that season, the seed and tourney result speak for themselves. You can speculate about what Moser would have done in that year's Big 12, but the reality is that in 17 of 21 seasons, he has sucked beyond belief in his league, so I will go out on a limb and say that would have been the case.
 
WichitaSooner said:
The question was results, not sanctions or how he left the program. But if you want to go that route, while Moser is clean, if/when he and his agent finally find a soft landing place, he isn't leaving the program in a good place, either. Four (or more) years of mediocre (at best) results, a constant revolving door of a roster, and a fan base that is becoming less and less interested as we fall further away from national relevance.

And you fail to respond to my point that Blake as a freshman was not as good as Fears. As for that season, the seed and tourney result speak for themselves. You can speculate about what Moser would have done in that year's Big 12, but the reality is that in 17 of 21 seasons, he has sucked beyond belief in his league, so I will go out on a limb and say that would have been the case.
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Lol did you read my post - the only comparison either of us can make is KP or advanced stats, and this team’s ranking was higher! If you want to take out the Fears year, the 21 season was better in terms of KP.

No surprise coming from a guy calling an all conference player mediocre just to emphasize how poor of a coach PM is lol.
 
SoonerDutch said:
Lol the only comparison either of us can make is KP or advanced stats, and this team’s ranking was higher!
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Why would you rely on KP or advanced stats to compare two seasons that have already happened? We aren't trying to predict the future or determine which team should make the field. We are comparing two things that have already happened. There is a scoreboard for a reason. The 08 team accomplished more than the 25 team.
 
WichitaSooner said:
Why would you rely on KP or advanced stats to compare two seasons that have already happened? We aren't trying to predict the future or determine which team should make the field. We are comparing two things that have already happened. There is a scoreboard for a reason. The 08 team accomplished more than the 25 team.
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Lol, sorry to make this so emotional for you. Just TBC, I disagree the results were better. Give me Porter all day over Jeff. Just my opinion!

Yes, I do agree that the 07-08 team finished 9-7 in a league with two top 20 KP Teams while the 24-25 team finished 6-12 in a league with 7 top 20 KP Teams.

The 07-08 team beat an A-10 team to make the round of 32 and then lost by 30. The 24-25 team lost to a Big East #9 seed and did not make the round of 32.
 
SoonerDutch said:
Lol, sorry to make this so emotional for you.

Yes, I do agree that the 07-08 team finished 9-7 in a league with two top 20 KP Teams while the 24-25 team finished 6-12 in a league with 7 top 20 KP Teams.

The 07-08 team beat an A-10 team to make the round of 32 and then lost by 30. The 24-25 team lost to a Big East #9 seed and did not make the round of 32.
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It's so hilarious how people cannot look at things for what they are. The last two teams have won 20 games playing schedules that our program has NEVER played before.
 
SoonerDutch said:
Lol, sorry to make this so emotional for you.

Yes, I do agree that the 07-08 team finished 9-7 in a league with two top 20 KP Teams while the 24-25 team finished 6-12 in a league with 7 top 20 KP Teams.

The 07-08 team beat an A-10 team to make the round of 32 and then lost by 30. The 24-25 team lost to a Big East #9 seed and did not make the round of 32.
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Maybe you aren't aware of this, but the better season you have, the better seed you get, and hence, the easier opponent. They don't just throw names in a hat.

You asked me my opinion, and now don't seem to like it. If you don't want to start a debate, don't ask the question. But this discussion reminds me so much of what the overall Moser discussion is. No one can actually point to any positive results on the floor (e.g., winning conference records, tournament berths, tournament wins), so they try to rely on theories about what would have been "if only the league wasn't the best ever," "if only the committee didn't screw us," "if only there weren't five bid thieves," "if only two unheralded transfers didn't get hurt," "if only our NIL were better," etc. It has been four freaking years. At what point does he run out of excuses and do the on-court results start mattering more than speculation and theories?
 
IndySooner said:
It's so hilarious how people cannot look at things for what they are. The last two teams have won 20 games playing schedules that our program has NEVER played before.
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Harder SOS in:

2023, 2022, 2020, 2019, 2018, 2017, 2016, 2015


2016 Lon's team played the #1 SOS.

10 of our 20 wins were vs KP 90+ ranked teams. 8 of which in 100+, 7 were 200+, 6...300+
 
WichitaSooner said:
Maybe you aren't aware of this, but the better season you have, the better seed you get, and hence, the easier opponent. They don't just throw names in a hat.

You asked me my opinion, and now don't seem to like it. If you don't want to start a debate, don't ask the question. But this discussion reminds me so much of what the overall Moser discussion is. No one can actually point to any positive results on the floor (e.g., winning conference records, tournament berths, tournament wins), so they try to rely on theories about what would have been "if only the league wasn't the best ever," "if only the committee didn't screw us," "if only there weren't five bid thieves," "if only two unheralded transfers didn't get hurt," "if only our NIL were better," etc. It has been four freaking years. At what point does he run out of excuses and do the on-court results start mattering more than speculation and theories?
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He was 3-7 against Sweet 16 teams. 29% of the schedule was against the top 16 teams in the country. When else in OU history has that ever happened? When is the last time an OU team won three games against Sweet 16 teams?
 
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