What's the minimum length of a rookie contract?

[SoonerfanTU]

A starting group of Noah, Bosh, Deng, Salmons and Rose could line up nicely, though they are gonna miss Ben Gordon's mental toughness. I'm not sure Rose is or isn't going to be that type of guy yet...

Salmons as the SG?

 

[elmocarp]

Salmons as the SG?

If they lose Gordon, I think so, yes. They have a lot invested in Deng and he is a Reinsdorf favorite, I can't see them not working hard to make Deng work as a part of what they are doing. Salmons has a great contract and Heinrich is probably gonna have to go eventually with that big deal he has (in fact, if they traded for Bosh you'd have to think Captain Kirk would be involved). They would lose some ball-handling and play-making, but Salmons can play the position.

 

[Smash Williams]

The Bulls were shopping Hinrich hard before the trade deadline and were trying to dump him for nothing more than expiring contracts, so he can't possibly be in the Bulls' long-term plans. It is hard to imagine a deal with Toronto that doesn't involve Hinrich. The Bulls would also have a great shot at Bosh as a free agent in 2010, but a trade for Bosh this summer would not only eliminate leaving that to the chance of free agency, but it also solves the issue of dumping Hinrich. Two birds, one stone.

 

[Section31]

the market is really weird (like Ben Gordon being the leading scorer for the Bulls every year he has been in the league, but being an undersized-score only shooting guard)

Not trying to hi-jack this thread, but this quote gives me cause to ask you guys this questions since I think you were all on the "don't trade KD; he's the next LJ" bandwagon. If not, I apologize.

How are Gordon's skills or lack thereof any different than KD's? I mean, really. Although KD is bigger, he really is not a prototypical size for the game he plays. He's pretty much one-dimensional. Too slight to guard player's his height, too slow to guard someone his "size". Why point out Gordon's weaknesses without recognizing KD's?

You guys watch a lot of NBA hoop, so I'm curious.

 

[campbest]

Not trying to hi-jack this thread, but this quote gives me cause to ask you guys this questions since I think you were all on the "don't trade KD; he's the next LJ" bandwagon. If not, I apologize.

How are Gordon's skills or lack thereof any different than KD's? I mean, really. Although KD is bigger, he really is not a prototypical size for the game he plays. He's pretty much one-dimensional. Too slight to guard player's his height, too slow to guard someone his "size". Why point out Gordon's weaknesses without recognizing KD's?

You guys watch a lot of NBA hoop, so I'm curious.

You are on a mission.

Durant is a far better offensive player than Gordon, you can attribute to height or his 7'5" wingspan if you want. I don't believe KD is the "next LJ" at all, but he is one of the premier players in the NBA right now. I also would not trade KD for Blake, you don't trade a soon to be 21 year old proven commodity for someone like Blake (at least any worthwhile GM would).

Would you build a team around Durant or Gordon? The question seems to answer itself.

 

[Smash Williams]

Not trying to hi-jack this thread, but this quote gives me cause to ask you guys this questions since I think you were all on the "don't trade KD; he's the next LJ" bandwagon. If not, I apologize.

How are Gordon's skills or lack thereof any different than KD's? I mean, really. Although KD is bigger, he really is not a prototypical size for the game he plays. He's pretty much one-dimensional. Too slight to guard player's his height, too slow to guard someone his "size". Why point out Gordon's weaknesses without recognizing KD's?

You guys watch a lot of NBA hoop, so I'm curious.

Kevin Durant is a very athletic 6'9", 20 years old SF. Ben Gordon is a 6'3", 26 year old SG. Kevin Durant has the perfect length (7'5" wingspan) for an NBA SF. He is longer and more athletic than most SFs, which along with his amazing jump shot makes him almost unguardable. Like McGrady, he is so much longer and athletic than the players who guard him that he can get off his shot almost anytime he wants.

Durant is a better scorer. Durant's points per shot this year (1.35) was better than Gordon's career best (1.31 in '06-'07') and Durant's career PPS (1.27) is better than Gordon's (1.24) even though we're comparing a player who entered the NBA as a 19-year-old and who has only played two seasons to a player who entered the NBA as a 21-year-old and has played five seasons. Not only is Durant a better scorer, but he is just scratching the surface of his potential.

Durant's size also makes him a better rebounder. Gordon averages 3.0 RPG for his career and had a career-best 3.4 RPG this season. Durant averaged 4.4 RPG while playing SG his rookie season, and that average jumped to 6.5 RPG this season (I know I've calculated this somewhere before, but he averaged right around 7 RPG when PJ was fired and Brooks moved him from SG to SF). Durant was third in the league among SFs in RPG (behind LeBron and Gerald Wallace, and Wallace also plays minutes at PF); Gordon was 16th among SGs.

Durant has all of the tools to be a good defender. He is very young and has a long way to go. He just needs to get a little stronger. He is never going to be a bodybuilder, but neither is Tayshaun Prince, and he turned into a very good defender, largely because of his freakish length (BTW Durant has a slightly longer winspan than Prince). For that matter, LeBron was also very undisciplined defensively at Durant's age, and only recently made the full commitment to defense. Again, Durant is 20 years old and nowhere near his peak as a player, whereas Gordon isn't going to get significantly better: he's an undersized SG who will always be too small to guard NBA SGs, and he doesn't do anything but score. Gordon is a very good player, but Durant is on another level. There isn't a player in the league besides LeBron who matched Durant's offensive production as a 20-year-old.

After two seasons:
LeBron-- 24.1 PPG (1.21 PPS), 6.4 RPG, 6.6 APG, 0.69 BPG
Durant-- 22.7 PPG, (1.27 PPS), 5.4 RPG, 2.6 APG, 0.8 BPG

Durant isn't quite LeBron (especially as a distributor, not to mention strength), and I don't expect him to be, but there isn't any other player in the league I would take over Durant right now. Players typically don't come close to peaking as 20-year-olds. Durant significantly improved from season 1 to season 2, and he's going to be the best scorer in the league in his prime.

 

[bocabull]

yada yada yada

no facts in this thread just people trying to defend their inaccurate beliefs

LOL @ the teams have TWO option years

wake up and learn something

 

[Section31]

You are on a mission.

Durant is a far better offensive player than Gordon, you can attribute to height or his 7'5" wingspan if you want. I don't believe KD is the "next LJ" at all, but he is one of the premier players in the NBA right now. I also would not trade KD for Blake, you don't trade a soon to be 21 year old proven commodity for someone like Blake (at least any worthwhile GM would).

Would you build a team around Durant or Gordon? The question seems to answer itself.

Actually, it was a sincere question, because I think they both have flaws in their games (pretty substantial ones at that).

I, personally, wouldn't want to start a team around either, but that's just me.

 

[Smash Williams]

yada yada yada

no facts in this thread just people trying to defend their inaccurate beliefs

LOL @ the teams have TWO option years

wake up and learn something

The NBA's Collective Bargaining Agreement must be wrong:

Each Rookie Scale Contract between a Team and a First Round Pick shall cover a period of two (2) Seasons, but shall have an Option in favor of the Team for the player’s third Season and a second Option in favor of the Team for the player’s fourth Season.

http://www.nbpa.com/cba_articles/article-VIII.php

However, this post is probably pointless since you're obviously just here to troll.

 

[Section31]

Kevin Durant is a very athletic 6'9", 20 years old SF. Ben Gordon is a 6'3", 26 year old SG. Kevin Durant has the perfect length (7'5" wingspan) for an NBA SF. He is longer and more athletic than most SFs, which along with his amazing jump shot makes him almost unguardable. Like McGrady, he is so much longer and athletic than the players who guard him that he can get off his shot almost anytime he wants.

Durant is a better scorer. Durant's points per shot this year (1.35) was better than Gordon's career best (1.31 in '06-'07') and Durant's career PPS (1.27) is better than Gordon's (1.24) even though we're comparing a player who entered the NBA as a 19-year-old and who has only played two seasons to a player who entered the NBA as a 21-year-old and has played five seasons. Not only is Durant a better scorer, but he is just scratching the surface of his potential.

Durant's size also makes him a better rebounder. Gordon averages 3.0 RPG for his career and had a career-best 3.4 RPG this season. Durant averaged 4.4 RPG while playing SG his rookie season, and that average jumped to 6.5 RPG this season (I know I've calculated this somewhere before, but he averaged right around 7 RPG when PJ was fired and Brooks moved him from SG to SF). Durant was third in the league among SFs in RPG (behind LeBron and Gerald Wallace, and Wallace also plays minutes at PF); Gordon was 16th among SGs.

Durant has all of the tools to be a good defender. He is very young and has a long way to go. He just needs to get a little stronger. He is never going to be a bodybuilder, but neither is Tayshaun Prince, and he turned into a very good defender, largely because of his freakish length (BTW Durant has a slightly longer winspan than Prince). For that matter, LeBron was also very undisciplined defensively at Durant's age, and only recently made the full commitment to defense. Again, Durant is 20 years old and nowhere near his peak as a player, whereas Gordon isn't going to get significantly better: he's an undersized SG who will always be too small to guard NBA SGs, and he doesn't do anything but score. Gordon is a very good player, but Durant is on another level. There isn't a player in the league besides LeBron who matched Durant's offensive production as a 20-year-old.

After two seasons:
LeBron-- 24.1 PPG (1.21 PPS), 6.4 RPG, 6.6 APG, 0.69 BPG
Durant-- 22.7 PPG, (1.27 PPS), 5.4 RPG, 2.6 APG, 0.8 BPG

Durant isn't quite LeBron (especially as a distributor, not to mention strength), and I don't expect him to be, but there isn't any other player in the league I would take over Durant right now. Players typically don't come close to peaking as 20-year-olds. Durant significantly improved from season 1 to season 2, and he's going to be the best scorer in the league in his prime.

I just don't see him EVER playing defense, but I could be sorely wrong. He's a wonderful offensive talent.

Good stuff, man. Thanks!

 

[elmocarp]

yada yada yada

no facts in this thread just people trying to defend their inaccurate beliefs

LOL @ the teams have TWO option years

wake up and learn something

Well, I think I've learned something about you...

 

[boksooner]

I just don't see him EVER playing defense, but I could be sorely wrong. He's a wonderful offensive talent.

Good stuff, man. Thanks!

Why?

 

[gracefor24]

LOL @ boca getting dominated AGAIN!

elmo, I see what you are saying now. Totally agree that you see guys most always sign the first extension.

 

[Section31]

Why?

It's just his build (or lack thereof, in some cases) and footspeed.

His height says he's a 3 or a 4. The problem is, he's too slow and weak to guard a three and both too weak and light to guard a four.

His game is more of a two, but there no chance in heck that he'd EVER guard a two.

As I've stated, he could very well prove me wrong, but I just think some guys are not built to be a defender. It's just my uneducated opinion.

 

[boksooner]

It's just his build (or lack thereof, in some cases) and footspeed.

His height says he's a 3 or a 4. The problem is, he's too slow and weak to guard a three and both too weak and light to guard a four.

His game is more of a two, but there no chance in heck that he'd EVER guard a two.

As I've stated, he could very well prove me wrong, but I just think some guys are not built to be a defender. It's just my uneducated opinion.

You could say many of the things about a guy like Tayshon Prince, and he turned into an above average defender. I think Durant's length gives him the potential to be a good defender. He needs the desire to be a defender. It usually takes elite scorers years to get that. Look at Lebron and Melo. They weren't serious about playing defense after 2 years in the NBA.

I'm not saying Durant will ever be an elite defender, but he can be coached up into a better than adequate defender.

 

[campbest]

You could say many of the things about a guy like Tayshon Prince, and he turned into an above average defender. I think Durant's length gives him the potential to be a good defender. He needs the desire to be a defender. It usually takes elite scorers years to get that. Look at Lebron and Melo. They weren't serious about playing defense after 2 years in the NBA.

I'm not saying Durant will ever be an elite defender, but he can be coached up into a better than adequate defender.

Obviously this is a poor reference, but the one aspect that bothered me most when I played was someone's length...was an absolute pain to deal with it.

 

[Section31]

Obviously this is a poor reference, but the one aspect that bothered me most when I played was someone's length...was an absolute pain to deal with it.

I agree, but you and I aren't Lebron and Kobe or MANY other 3's in the league. You HAVE to be able to defend well in the league AND be able to defend YOUR position. If you can't defend your position, then someone else has to and now the defensive scheme is ALL out of whack.

I'll be the first to admit I'm wrong if he turns into an average to above average defender, but it's just something I believe in right now...and it has VERY little to do with my opinion of Blake. It just helps me explain why I think the way I do - even if MANY of you disagree with me.

You guys have been pretty fair with me and I appreciate it. I hope it's because I'm, at the very least, backing up my point of view with SOME facts even if you don't necessarily agree with me.

 

[gracefor24]

I agree, but you and I aren't Lebron and Kobe or MANY other 3's in the league. You HAVE to be able to defend well in the league AND be able to defend YOUR position. If you can't defend your position, then someone else has to and now the defensive scheme is ALL out of whack.

I'll be the first to admit I'm wrong if he turns into an average to above average defender, but it's just something I believe in right now...and it has VERY little to do with my opinion of Blake. It just helps me explain why I think the way I do - even if MANY of you disagree with me.

You guys have been pretty fair with me and I appreciate it. I hope it's because I'm, at the very least, backing up my point of view with SOME facts even if you don't necessarily agree with me.

I think Durant has the potential to guard the 3 pretty well. No way in heck will he ever be able to guard a 2. He is just a little slow footed right now defensively but as he gains strength he should get better. Carmelo was the same way and he is defending pretty well right now.

Durant just needs to learn to play to his strengths. He should be able to give a guy space and still contest shots due to his length. I agree that the biggest thing is just having the desire to defend and working hard.

 

[Section31]

I think Durant has the potential to guard the 3 pretty well. No way in heck will he ever be able to guard a 2. He is just a little slow footed right now defensively but as he gains strength he should get better. Carmelo was the same way and he is defending pretty well right now.

Durant just needs to learn to play to his strengths. He should be able to give a guy space and still contest shots due to his length. I agree that the biggest thing is just having the desire to defend and working hard.

You guys will probably end up being right, but I think comparing him to LJ or Melo is a stretch. They BOTH have the body to guard their position and had it coming in.

 

[gracefor24]

You guys will probably end up being right, but I think comparing him to LJ or Melo is a stretch. They BOTH have the body to guard their position and had it coming in.

Melo definitely didn't have it coming in. He was played at the 4 in college and played down low in the 2-3. He was a terrible defender coming into the league. And Lebron wasn't much better, he hadn't played much defense before coming in to the NBA.

I agree that they both had bodies that fit their positions but Durant does too outside him just being too skinny right now. Like I said, with strength work he will improve his strength and his lateral movement enough to be at the very least an adequate defender.