Why Can't OU Finish 4th in the Big XII

[ArdmoreSooner]

I am feeling a 9-9 conference record. 6-3 at home and 3-6 in road games. Road games are just very hard to win. But if we win at Cincinnati that would put us at 20-10 on the year, and probably gets us in the NCAA tournament. Told me that before the season and I would have jumped all over it.

 

[TINY]

No he is not, but he is solid

I would argue that Grooms is a better PG. AJ was a combo guard. He was not near athletic/quick enough to stay with opposing pgs. He got eaten alive by Ty Lawson in the Elite 8.

Shooting: AJ > Grooms (at this point)
Defense: AJ < Grooms
Handles: AJ < Grooms

 

[WTSooner]

I would argue that Grooms is a better PG. AJ was a combo guard. He was not near athletic/quick enough to stay with opposing pgs. He got eaten alive by Ty Lawson in the Elite 8.

Shooting: AJ > Grooms (at this point)
Defense: AJ < Grooms
Handles: AJ < Grooms

I would say their defense is pretty equal. They go about it in different ways though. Grooms uses ball pressure and quickness. AJ used his length VERY well. I would call them about equal, overall. Two things though.....1) AJ was never healthy, so we never got to see his full potential, and 2) AJ performed over the course of 4 years at a high level. Let's at least let Grooms get through one season before we start arguing he is better than AJ.

 

[sperry]

Grooms is better than Austin Johnson?

I believe so.

 

[Krugerfan52]

I think right now Grooms is playing better than AJ did his first 2 or 3 years at OU. But during AJ's senior year, especially the first 10 games or so in conference play, he was playing at a VERY high level. Not only was he defending, even blocking shots, but he was knocking down big threes right and left. He was hitting deep threes against OSU, Baylor etc and his assist to TO ratio was pretty good.

The first 10 games in Big 12 play he averaged 13 ppg and we were 10-0. He also had a four game stretch during that point where he hit 13 3-pointers. Grooms has only hit 6 threes in 10 games.

I think Grooms and AJ are hard to compare because they are totally different players. Grooms is a quick pass-first PG and AJ was slow footed but long armed and a streaky shooter.

Basically, if you compare their stats upper-classmen AJ has Grooms beat in every category except assists....the most important category for a PG.

As an OU fan, I think Grooms is less frustrating because you know what you are going to get with him. You never knew if AJ was going to kill us or play great and make us unstoppable.

 

[WTSooner]

As an OU fan, I think Grooms is less frustrating because you know what you are going to get with him. You never knew if AJ was going to kill us or play great and make us unstoppable.

WAY too early to be making statements like that, IMO.

Grooms has played 10 games at OU, and he's had a couple of stinkers.

I would say his first two games were less than acceptable (average). He also played pretty bad against St. Louis.

The biggest thing that is going to hurt Grooms is poor shooting. I don't think he'll have many games where he turns it over more than a couple of times, but it really doesn't matter what his assist to turnover ratio is if he goes 2 for 10 shooting the ball. Those 8 empty possessions might as well be turnovers.

I'm glad we have Grooms, but lets not get carried away with what he is giving us through 10 games of fairly easy competition. We need to let the entire season play out before we try to compare what he is doing now against what past OU players have done against tougher competition.

 

[sperry]

WAY too early to be making statements like that, IMO.

Grooms has played 10 games at OU, and he's had a couple of stinkers.

I would say his first two games were less than acceptable (average). He also played pretty bad against St. Louis.

The biggest thing that is going to hurt Grooms is poor shooting. I don't think he'll have many games where he turns it over more than a couple of times, but it really doesn't matter what his assist to turnover ratio is if he goes 2 for 10 shooting the ball. Those 8 empty possessions might as well be turnovers.

I'm glad we have Grooms, but lets not get carried away with what he is giving us through 10 games of fairly easy competition. We need to let the entire season play out before we try to compare what he is doing now against what past OU players have done against tougher competition.

I was just never incredibly impressed by AJ as a PG. Always felt like he was better suited to play the 2 but our roster dictated that he would usually be playing the 1. I think Grooms is a better floor general.

 

[StatGeek]

Why can't OU finish 4th in the Big XII?

Simple, because we are going to finish third!

Boomer Sooner!

:neal

 

[campbest]

5th or 6th is probably the best bet. This team has not had any adversity and a situation where they've lost back to back games (which will happen in conference). Playing a true road game at Cincy next week will tell us a lot.

 

[SoonerSpock]

5th or 6th is probably the best bet. This team has not had any adversity and a situation where they've lost back to back games (which will happen in conference). Playing a true road game at Cincy next week will tell us a lot.

No question the Cincy game affords us an opportunity to learn a lot more about this years team. I expect what we will see will be favorable. Maybe not a victory but a team that compete against quality opposition on the road which will be a big step forward.

 

[garyeb2]

WAY too early to be making statements like that, IMO.

Grooms has played 10 games at OU, and he's had a couple of stinkers.

I would say his first two games were less than acceptable (average). He also played pretty bad against St. Louis.

The biggest thing that is going to hurt Grooms is poor shooting. I don't think he'll have many games where he turns it over more than a couple of times, but it really doesn't matter what his assist to turnover ratio is if he goes 2 for 10 shooting the ball. Those 8 empty possessions might as well be turnovers.

I'm glad we have Grooms, but lets not get carried away with what he is giving us through 10 games of fairly easy competition. We need to let the entire season play out before we try to compare what he is doing now against what past OU players have done against tougher competition.

Really? You mean that same 10 games of fairly easy competition that has generated all of this preening and crowing over Pledger's exploits.

 

[WTSooner]

Really? You mean that same 10 games of fairly easy competition that has generated all of this preening and crowing over Pledger's exploits.

I don't want to be ugly on Christmas, but it takes a special kind of person to diss Pledger at this point. It's OBVIOUS to everybody that Pledger has stepped his game up in a big way. He might not produce like this all season, but I have no doubt he'll end the year with great stats, and likely as our best all around player.

 

[garyeb2]

I don't want to be ugly on Christmas, but it takes a special kind of person to diss Pledger at this point. It's OBVIOUS to everybody that Pledger has stepped his game up in a big way. He might not produce like this all season, but I have no doubt he'll end the year with great stats, and likely as our best all around player.

Whoe Nellie, I didn't say anything to diss your boy. I was just curious if we were using the same standard as when you were discounting Grooms contribution.

To this point against a really soft schedule, Grooms has been a one man press breaker, a guy that takes good care of the ball, and a standout at directing the offense. He has been as big or bigger upgrade over last season's point guard than this years Pledger is over last years Pledger.

Starting with the next game and then on into the conference schedule, things will get alot tougher on all the kids at every position. As to which of the players that will be able to continue on with their current level of production and contribution, well, my money is on Grooms and Osby.

Oh, by the way. A missed shot isn't the same as a turnover. You forgot to factor in rebounds.

 

[Tundrasooner]

AJ was one of the most under-rated Sooners in a long time.

 

[SoonerinNC]

I listened to some of AJ's games his senior year in high school. As I recall he had a number of triple doubles. He would fill up the scoresheet for a half and then basically set up his teammates the rest of the game.

I recall that Sampson predicted that AJ would win the slam dunk contest in their version of Midnight Madness in AJ's freshman season.

After his ankle injury he never had the same speed and spring. Then the back injury that caused him to sit out most practices in his senior year.

No one ever believed that he was a point guard but he started at point guard for four years. Even in his freshman year when he recovered from the injury sufficient to play.

He was a guy you had to root for.