32-31 (guess what that is)

[WichitaSooner]

I guess you're completely unaware of his history, including Loyola?



With minor adjustments we would have been a top half of conference team? If COVID had hit a few days sooner, or Austin Reaves didn't have an all-time legendary performance in the regular season finale, Lon wouldn't have finished in the top half of conference five years in a row. Didn't OU have the worst conference record over that five-year stretch? Perhaps we were 8th or 9th. The cupboard was as bare as it gets when Porter took over.

He had two, arguably three, truly good seasons in a very long career. I am aware of his full history, while you appear to fixate on the only truly good thing on his resume.

As for the status of the roster when he took over, I guess other programs don't even have a cupboard to begin with, since there are hundreds of programs, including dozens of P5 schools, who were far worse off than we were in March 2021.

 

[allday92]

I guess you're completely unaware of his history, including Loyola?



With minor adjustments we would have been a top half of conference team? If COVID had hit a few days sooner, or Austin Reaves didn't have an all-time legendary performance in the regular season finale, Lon wouldn't have finished in the top half of conference five years in a row. Didn't OU have the worst conference record over that five-year stretch? Perhaps we were 8th or 9th. The cupboard was as bare as it gets when Porter took over.

Exactly. The fact that the final four run didn't turn into at least one more sweet 16 or one more serious threat at a Big 12 championship is disappointing.

 

[allday92]

After looking at the coaches at ou, my main standard is winnint 60% of your games. Lon barely eked in at 0.604 at the end, but he did it. Obviously punching a final 4 and getting a star drafted like Buddy is extra praise. But i think thats basically my standard now fwiw

I think it should be 60% of conference games. OU should always have a decent enough record in non-conference games with all of the non P5 schools we play. We need to get back to being a good team in conference and threatening for conference championships. Obviously won't happen in our last year in the B12, but there's no reason this team can't be a top half SEC team in 2024.

 

[BoulderSooner]

I think it should be 60% of conference games. OU should always have a decent enough record in non-conference games with all of the non P5 schools we play. We need to get back to being a good team in conference and threatening for conference championships. Obviously won't happen in our last year in the B12, but there's no reason this team can't be a top half SEC team in 2024.

i don't disagree ..

but i would also remind all that OU has NEVER played in a conf as good as the current one ..

 

[Eielson]

I just think that's crazy. But let me ask, so you think he has some high ceiling or what?

Every time we hire somebody new, we all agree that the first year or two are essentially meaningless, but when rubber actually meets the road, everybody panics.

I'm not saying he'll be amazing at OU. I'm simply saying that while there are quick-fix coaches, Moser was never going to be one of them. It takes time to get his guys and develop them for his system. His portal recruiting has been limited, as it likely would be for just about any coach here unless we step up our NIL, but his HS recruiting has been a major strength thus far. If he continues to grab two guys of Uzan/Oweh and Cooper/Cole caliber from HS each year, I think there's certainly reason to expect this to project upward. From day one he has said he hopes to rely more on HS recruiting than the portal, and I don't think it's realistic to expect him to turn things around with two freshmen and two HS seniors.

If we're still floundering in years 3-4, that's obviously good reason for concern, but you don't fire somebody 1.5 years in unless they've committed a crime or major violation. What kinda coach would want to come here if they didn't feel they had the typical 3-5 years to get things rolling?

 

[steverocks35]

i don't disagree ..

but i would also remind all that OU has NEVER played in a conf as good as the current one ..

That means all the teams around us are getting better and we are staying the same or getting worse

 

[oketex]

People who are thinking we need to hire a new coach need to wake up, two years into his contract with a losing season is not going to get him fired, first because he had an empty bread basket when he got here and second the buy out is to great to run him off after two years. Next year will be the year if he doesn't improve but the real question is how much improvement does he need in year three?

 

[Eielson]

He had two, arguably three, truly good seasons in a very long career. I am aware of his full history, while you appear to fixate on the only truly good thing on his resume.

Name a program that Porter didn't leave better than he inherited it.

UALR (his closest thing to a quick fix)
- Inherited three straight losing seasons including 4-24 before he took over
- Had three straight winning seasons (overall and in conference), which continued the following two years after he left

Illinois State
- Inherited an 8-win program
- Struggled in his four years there and was fired, but Illinois State was projected to finish near the top of conference in year 5, which is exactly what they did. The team then gradually trended downward each year from 25-10 to 12-19 under Jankovich.

Loyola
- Inherited a team that hadn't been to the NCAA tourney since 1985 and only once since 1968
- Had the greatest 4-year stretch in program history including a Final 4 and Sweet 16 run. Handed over a top 25 team to Valentine that once again went to the NCAA tourney.

As for the status of the roster when he took over, I guess other programs don't even have a cupboard to begin with, since there are hundreds of programs, including dozens of P5 schools, who were far worse off than we were in March 2021.

What about April 2021? He had a pathetic roster, and blaming Porter for "losing" guys like Alondes that Lon misutilized or Reaves that went pro is silly.

 

[thebigabd]

Name a program that Porter didn't leave better than he inherited it.

UALR (his closest thing to a quick fix)
- Inherited three straight losing seasons including 4-24 before he took over
- Had three straight winning seasons (overall and in conference), which continued the following two years after he left

Illinois State
- Inherited an 8-win program
- Struggled in his four years there and was fired, but Illinois State was projected to finish near the top of conference in year 5, which is exactly what they did. The team then gradually trended downward each year from 25-10 to 12-19 under Jankovich.

Loyola
- Inherited a team that hadn't been to the NCAA tourney since 1985 and only once since 1968
- Had the greatest 4-year stretch in program history including a Final 4 and Sweet 16 run. Handed over a top 25 team to Valentine that once again went to the NCAA tourney.



What about April 2021? He had a pathetic roster, and blaming Porter for "losing" guys like Alondes that Lon misutilized or Reaves that went pro is silly.

Missouri is a better example... Brand new coach and a total roster overhaul. Missouri has been a dumpster fire program and he has them sitting at 20-8, off the bubble, and looking at a 7-10 seed in the NCAA Tournament.

Brought in 9 transfers and 2 juco guys and is winning right away.

Kansas State is another good example... Entire new roster, but is winning. I guess now the same could be said for Texas Tech.

The truth is.... you CAN put together a winning team in one season in this era, other programs around OU have done it, and OU simply hasn't. Kansas State and Missouri got bigger, faster, more athetic, more skilled, and more talented overnight. OU didn't. It is what it is.

 

[WichitaSooner]

What about April 2021? He had a pathetic roster, and blaming Porter for "losing" guys like Alondes that Lon misutilized or Reaves that went pro is silly.

You're right, he had one scholarship player, took over a team that had finished a mile below .500, and had to bring in an entirely new roster. Oh, wait, that actually is what happened to a couple other coaches in our league.

Also it is funny that so many people on this board LOVE Harkless, and others act like Gibson would be the missing link on this year's team. Yet then people turn around and call the roster he inherited pathetic even though it had both those guys and Hill, who is a very good player. I've not seen one person "blame" him for Alondes leaving, although he certainly could have reasonably been expected to keep Harmon or Manek. The bigger point is that he was in no worse shape than the vast majority of coaches. I think Texas has one guy in its rotation who also played a role two years ago. Same holds true for lots of teams. You're just not in touch with how quickly rosters change in this era if you think he was in a tougher spot than most coaches.

 

[hoopsaustin]

People who are thinking we need to hire a new coach need to wake up, two years into his contract with a losing season is not going to get him fired, first because he had an empty bread basket when he got here and second the buy out is to great to run him off after two years. Next year will be the year if he doesn't improve but the real question is how much improvement does he need in year three?

For me, at least 21 wins

 

[hoopsaustin]

You're right, he had one scholarship player, took over a team that had finished a mile below .500, and had to bring in an entirely new roster. Oh, wait, that actually is what happened to a couple other coaches in our league.

Also it is funny that so many people on this board LOVE Harkless, and others act like Gibson would be the missing link on this year's team. Yet then people turn around and call the roster he inherited pathetic even though it had both those guys and Hill, who is a very good player. I've not seen one person "blame" him for Alondes leaving, although he certainly could have reasonably been expected to keep Harmon or Manek. The bigger point is that he was in no worse shape than the vast majority of coaches. I think Texas has one guy in its rotation who also played a role two years ago. Same holds true for lots of teams. You're just not in touch with how quickly rosters change in this era if you think he was in a tougher spot than most coaches.

I buy your argument about the fluidity of rosters over eilsen. But Eielson has made me feel slightly better about porter's jobs at his former schools i have to admit. But i think we will need a miracle

 

[Eielson]

You're right, he had one scholarship player, took over a team that had finished a mile below .500, and had to bring in an entirely new roster. Oh, wait, that actually is what happened to a couple other coaches in our league.

Also it is funny that so many people on this board LOVE Harkless, and others act like Gibson would be the missing link on this year's team. Yet then people turn around and call the roster he inherited pathetic even though it had both those guys and Hill, who is a very good player. I've not seen one person "blame" him for Alondes leaving, although he certainly could have reasonably been expected to keep Harmon or Manek. The bigger point is that he was in no worse shape than the vast majority of coaches. I think Texas has one guy in its rotation who also played a role two years ago. Same holds true for lots of teams. You're just not in touch with how quickly rosters change in this era if you think he was in a tougher spot than most coaches.

Your rebuttal would make sense if I said that there weren't better coaches than Porter for a quick turnaround, but I've actually said the opposite, so I'm not sure why you're babbling on about this strawman. And I love that you're citing guys like Harkless as a reason to support the inherited roster. What a joke.

 

[Eielson]

Missouri is a better example... Brand new coach and a total roster overhaul. Missouri has been a dumpster fire program and he has them sitting at 20-8, off the bubble, and looking at a 7-10 seed in the NCAA Tournament.

Brought in 9 transfers and 2 juco guys and is winning right away.

Kansas State is another good example... Entire new roster, but is winning. I guess now the same could be said for Texas Tech.

The truth is.... you CAN put together a winning team in one season in this era, other programs around OU have done it, and OU simply hasn't. Kansas State and Missouri got bigger, faster, more athetic, more skilled, and more talented overnight. OU didn't. It is what it is.

You absolutely can turn around a program quickly in this era! Porter just ain't that dude, and we all knew that when we hired him.

 

[WichitaSooner]

Your rebuttal would make sense if I said that there weren't better coaches than Porter for a quick turnaround, but I've actually said the opposite, so I'm not sure why you're babbling on about this strawman. And I love that you're citing guys like Harkless as a reason to support the inherited roster. What a joke.

I can't stand Harkless. I just have seen so much love for him from some of the same people who also seem to be Moser defenders.

 

[cvangild]

Louisville (a b-ball blue blood) is 4-24 this year!!! How can a blue blood like that only win 4 games, especially in the era of the portal?? ANd they play in a WEAK conference, compared to the Big 12!! The ACC currently has FOUR teams ranked 150+ in the KenPom. The last place team in the Big 12 is rated #57 in the KenPom (that team is OU, meaning ALL their confernce opponents are top 50 KP teams) What would OU's record be in the ACC??

As bad as our season has been, it could have been A LOT worse. I know that's not what some of you want to hear, but PM has done more than you think with the current talent level. Does the talent level need to get better? Absolutely..but that often takes more than 2 seasons.

If the portal was the answer for EVERYONE, you wouldn't see blue bloods going 4-24.

 

[WTSooner]

Those classes are better on paper cause of the number of recruits signed. The top of the 2022/2023 class is better. OU hasn't signed 4 top 100 kids in a 2 year span since Capel. And on 247's all time recruit rankings for OU (which tracks back to 03-04) Uzan, Oweh, Cooper, and Cole are all in the top 20.

You are splitting hairs.

2023 - 48 and 93
2022 - 70 and 76
2017 - 23 & 117
2016 - 41 and 121

I'd say they are pretty even, which makes the comment that PM is recruiting better than any coach in the last decade false.

The two highest rated players were from Lon's years. One (TY) by a substantial amount, and the only 5 star. I also wouldn't suggest it as a negative to bring up that Lon's classes had depth. I guess the Portal could be impacting that some, but I'd still argue the above favors Lon's classes or at the very least, I'd call them even. I'll take the consensus 5* kid as the tie-breaker every time.

 

[Eielson]

I can't stand Harkless. I just have seen so much love for him from some of the same people who also seem to be Moser defenders.

He had some flashes under Lon, and seemed like he might thrive on Porter, but he didn't. Team was better without him.

Hill is a solid role player, but ideally off the bench for an NCAA tourney team.

Gibson would be huge for this team. He's not a star, but this team desperately needs another shooter to complement Sherfield. Too often, when Sherfield has a 3-13 night like last night, the other guards follow suit (Oweh and Uzan were 5-16). This team could have easily won 2-3 more games with him, and might have kept us from getting run out of the gym a time or two.

All in all you've got a great 6th, 7th, and 12th man on a NCAA tourney team. Nothing to write home about.

 

[allday92]

You are splitting hairs.

2023 - 48 and 93
2022 - 70 and 76
2017 - 23 & 117
2016 - 41 and 121

I'd say they are pretty even, which makes the comment that PM is recruiting better than any coach in the last decade false.

The two highest rated players were from Lon's years. One (TY) by a substantial amount, and the only 5 star. I also wouldn't suggest it as a negative to bring up that Lon's classes had depth. I guess the Portal could be impacting that some, but I'd still argue the above favors Lon's classes or at the very least, I'd call them even. I'll take the consensus 5* kid as the tie-breaker every time.

That depth you're speaking of is Matt Freeman, Jordan Shepherd, and Hannes Polla and Ty Lazenby. And those classes were 6 years ago.

The fact that Porter was able to get 4 top 100 kids after the 2018-2021 classes is impressive.

 

[WTSooner]

That depth you're speaking of is Matt Freeman, Jordan Shepherd, and Hannes Polla and Ty Lazenby. And those classes were 6 years ago.

The fact that Porter was able to get 4 top 100 kids after the 2018-2021 classes is impressive.

If you say so.