Marcus smart just hit a fan!

[WTSooner]

No way. You are suggesting banning a person from a State University for speech. Are you serious? That violates a fundamental principal of our society. YOU CANNOT POSSIBLY BE SERIOUS!

Agreed.

UNLESS he broke TT's rules. All schools have rules against using profane language. I personally don't think he likely crossed that line. The fan has already said that he didn't say anything vulgar, and didn't use the n-word. As far as I'm concerned, he likely deserves no punishment if that is the case.

 

[dubyac]

And not be put in jail or be civilly liable for it. That's all the protection you get. Any & all types of other private retribution represent the free speech of those the person offended.

yes and smart could've said anything he wanted back to the man... he lost his protections when he laid hands on the guy...

 

[152219]

If the tweet by Gottlieb which showed a conversation between Orr and a Tech friend of Gottlieb's is legit, Orr himself admitted he said something he shouldn't have and he said he feels bad about it. So, must have been something more than simple trash talk.

 

[dubyac]

If the tweet by Gottlieb which showed a conversation between Orr and a Tech friend of Gottlieb's is legit, Orr himself admitted he said something he shouldn't have and he said he feels bad about it. So, must have been something more than simple trash talk.

didn't he also say, it was definitely not the N word and it was not vulgar either...??

 

[152219]

There is a difference between freedom of speech and speech free from consequences. One is protected by the US Constitution and the other is not.

 

[garyeb2]

I swear, some of you guys have completely lost your perspective. How many after the fact arbitrations of whether a player was justified in assaulting a fan can college basketball tolerate?

Would it be OK to have one of these every week? Every Year? There is a macro point to be made here. And the answer to that question is no tolerance.

 

[152219]

didn't he also say, it was definitely not the N word and it was not vulgar either...??

Rumor is that he said "Go back to Africa"....pretty sure that is racially motivated (if that is what he said obviously).

 

[152219]

I swear, some of you guys have completely lost your perspective. How many after the fact arbitrations of whether a player was justified in assaulting a fan can college basketball tolerate?

Would it be OK to have one of these every week? Every Year? There is a macro point to be made here. And the answer to that question is no tolerance.

That is why Smart has to be suspended by the Big 12/Okie State. Minimum 3 games. Wouldn't surprise me if he got 5.

 

[AdaSooner]

I like Ford, I've met him twice and I like him. OSU basketball is at a major crossroad. If you fire someone, you damn sure better get someone better. Especially when that coach is only behind Sutton and Iba when it comes to winning.

The problem is if OSU loses Smart, Nash and Brown...and Ford and Pierre and guys get let out of their LOI's...jeez.

Smart, Brown and possibly Nash will be gone after this season. But I really don't think you have anything to worry about with Ford. As you correctly pointed out, firing Ford could have an adverse effect on the program for the next year or two, maybe more. Besides, it would be costly to get out of his multiple years contract.

IMO, Ford will keep his job and his staff will remain intact, at least through next season. I'm not saying he should be fired, just that he has left himself open to criticism and possibly a reprimand from his superiors for the way he handled last night's incident and for losing control of two key players. The same thing happened at OU a few years back. There was more to it than a loss of control over a couple of bad apples. But that coach eventually lost his job.

 

[WTSooner]

Rumor is that he said "Go back to Africa"....pretty sure that is racially motivated (if that is what he said obviously).

Because Smart said that is what was said to him?

I'm gonna need a little more proof.

Edit: First there were reports that somebody heard Smart telling the coaches he was called the n-word. Now reports it was something different. Make up your mind Smart.

 

[DenverSooner]

Good luck with that.

In a perfect world, perhaps -- and if it's established that the fan used a racist epithet, I'd be all for Tech 86'ing him from their arena permanently. But Smart's behavior cannot be condoned, no matter what the fan said. Thousands of college basketball players have put up with fan nonsense and not lost their cool, and you can rest assured that many of the remarks shouted over the years have been offensive in one way or another.

But how many college players have gone up in the stands and attacked one of those fans?

Again, I have no defense of the fan if he crossed a line, but there's no defending Smart's behavior either.

You can't do that. It is content based and unconstitutional. Can a fan yell Ref you suck? What about Ratboy? What Texas Sucks or worse F Texas? Who gets to decide where the line is? I agree it is wrong but it is our constitutional right to be a racist and express that racism.

 

[152219]

Because Smart said that is what was said to him?

I'm gonna need a little more proof.

I said that was the RUMOR, not that was what was definitely said. Only a few people know for sure what was said.

 

[DenverSooner]

Using loopholes, legal technicalities, and the worst people on earth doesn't exactly help your argument. I think 99.99% of the population, the black letter of the law be damned, would agree that the soldier's dad would be morally, if not legally, justified to hit those freaks from Kansas or jewish people to hit the neo-nazis.


Again, the punishment should be determined by what was said. Any prosecutor or court of law would consider what was said in any potential assault case.

I completely disagree with the Supreme Court decision that struck down intentional infliction if emotional distress damages against the Church. I am simply telling you the Law.

Ra
Egardless of that case, you can't ban speech at a open public forum and I don't see how a sporting event where fans scream obscenities isn't an open public forum

 

[WTSooner]

I like Ford, I've met him twice and I like him. OSU basketball is at a major crossroad. If you fire someone, you damn sure better get someone better. Especially when that coach is only behind Sutton and Iba when it comes to winning.

The problem is if OSU loses Smart, Nash and Brown...and Ford and Pierre and guys get let out of their LOI's...jeez.

That is the price you pay for making poor coaching hires. OU paid it with Capel. We had a couple of crap teams, until we were able to rebuild.

 

[Darwin]

I'll be shocked if Smart gets a one-game suspension.

He set a precedent by going into the stands to shove a fan last night. As I see it, OSU and/or the Big 12 have no choice but to suspend him for multiple games for his actions. The eyes of the country are on the Big 12 and OSU right now. One, or both, has to step up to the plate and deal harshly with this matter to send a message to future college players, as well as would-be college athletes that this cannot and will not be condoned.

Totally agree. The Big 12 and OSU know they are being watched by the nation and member schools. I can't see any less than 4 games being enough. Even though the rest of the season seems harsh, I would not be stunned by that.

 

[Seymore Cox]

Last night I said fire everybody and cut everybody except for Phil Forte

What about Sager?

 

[DenverSooner]

There is a difference between freedom of speech and speech free from consequences. One is protected by the US Constitution and the other is not.

You suggested that Tech should take action against him for his speech. The Constitution does prohibit State action that restricts speech. This isn't a debate. As vile as it is, people have a right to be racist and express that belief.

 

[DenverSooner]

And not be put in jail or be civilly liable for it. That's all the protection you get. Any & all types of other private retribution represent the free speech of those the person offended.

This makes no sense. You can't beat someone when you disagree with their speech. Clearly any and all types of private retribution is not allowed

 

[DenverSooner]

Using loopholes, legal technicalities, and the worst people on earth doesn't exactly help your argument. I think 99.99% of the population, the black letter of the law be damned, would agree that the soldier's dad would be morally, if not legally, justified to hit those freaks from Kansas or jewish people to hit the neo-nazis.


Again, the punishment should be determined by what was said. Any prosecutor or court of law would consider what was said in any potential assault case.

I am using them to demonstrate hoe broad free speech is. They are the perfect examples because they are so outrageous

 

[152219]

You suggested that Tech should take action against him for his speech. The Constitution does prohibit State action that restricts speech. This isn't a debate. As vile as it is, people have a right to be racist and express that belief.

That isn't a state action, but the ability of the school to restrict him from attending future games. You going to argue that is illegal? Because it isn't, as schools and the NCAA have banned boosters from affiliating before and will continue to do so when they deem necessary.

Guess we will see how this plays out.