Do you think this is killing Joe C inside?

[okcsooner83]

NickZepp, great points. OU doesn't have the guards to compete with the top teams in the big 12. College basketball is all about quality guard play.

 

[WaymanFan]

Considering we lost by 30 to Louisville in the 2nd round, it's excusable if some of us forget we actually played in the NCAA that year.

Actually, it's not excusable. OU won their first round game as a #6 seed, beating a #11 seed. Except for 1999, OU had lost every single first round game when seeded #4 or lower since the start of the 1990s. If my math is correct, OU had a 1st round record of 1 - 7 when seeded #4 or lower prior to beating St. Joe's. Included in those 7 losses was an 0-3 record as a #4 seed and an 0-1 record as a #6 seed.

So, based on the facts stated above, how can any OU fan forget that win over St. Joe's in '08? Heck, I drank some champagne, and yelled out: "We finally won a 1st round game seeded lower than #3!!!!!!!"

 

[bocabull]

Now Wayman, don't you know that beating 0-16 Baylor & Texas A&M 4 times and getting into the tournament with 20 wins as a 6 seed is more important than losing every time to cinderella>?

 

[DenverSooner]

You had a good argument going until you said that. The one thing Jeff Capel can be proud of at OU is he won all 4 games in the NCAA Tournament as a higher seed. His two predecessors had an enormous amount of difficulty beating teams "OU should have beaten in the Tournament." Yes, I realize that it's better to get there and lose than not get there at all. However, some of you in your blind hatred for Coach Capel are overplaying your hands with some of your posts, as Denver did with that statement.

I don't hate Capel. I don't even know the guy. I am just stating the simple fact that Capel did not upset anyone in the Tournament when he went to the great 8. He had a great season that year but it was not one of the best seasons in OU basketball. OU did not win the Big XII, did not win the Big XII Tournament and did not make the Final Four. People act like that was some huge accomplishment. I just view it as a good season and it was done with the number pick in the NBA draft.

 

[bocabull]

So we're supposed to sit back and accept mediocrity simply because the conference is better? No thanks. Our expectation should be to finish in the top half of the league every single year, period. It concerns me greatly to think about the programs you mentioned above getting better while ours gets worse. That's not good.

No we are not senior. You and I are both on the same page. We need to improve next season and have recruits coming in to address short comings. If we are in the exact same position 14 months from now we have a problem.

But we won't be. Capel is too good.

 

[seniorsooner]

No we are not senior. You and I are both on the same page. We need to improve next season and have recruits coming in to address short comings. If we are in the exact same position 14 months from now we have a problem.

But we won't be. Capel is too good.

I can handle that. Like I've said before, I really hope you're right. Next season can't get here soon enough.

 

[Sooner04]

Yeah the Big 12 when Texas A&M, Baylor, Kansas State & Missouri were 5 or 6 guaranteed wins. Turn that into 2 or 3 wins which is all it would have been if they weren't all down and where were we? That's why we were constantly upset by worse seeds. The Big XII was horrific.

And Capel just started life without Blake 1 season ago. Started it with 3 McDonalds AAs who did not work out. and is not back to the drawing board. He will fix it. No problem.

I understand the "bad" Big 12 sentiment. And it makes a lot of sense. My biggest beef with Sampson is that his style, while often keeping us on the floor with teams who totally unclassed us, often kept teams in games with us who had NO BUSINESS on the floor with us. Some of those NCAA defeats in the round of 32 (Purdue, Utah) really stung too.

As for point B: I REALLY hope you're right. Me, I'm not so sure. Me, I'm tired of getting blown out.

 

[bocabull]

I hear you 04. But let's think back to exactly a year ago today. Actually, I think this thought deserves a new thread. lol

 

[NickZepp]

I think the top 6 from the Big 12 are as strong as they ever were. But right now teams like Nebraska, Colorado, Tech, Oklahoma State, Iowa State, are real weak. I think all those teams this year are teams OU could sweep if we didn't have such poor fundamentals. Which could mean our talent is bad. But I don't think talentwise we are really that much different from those teams above.

Oklahoma State has less guard play than we have arguably. But I have a lot of respect for Ford as a coach. That team looks so well coached. And they defend, that's something I really haven't seen from this team when it matters. I don't understand what we are trying to do on defense as a team. It seems like we have no real system out there. That's not a talent problem it's a coaching problem.

 

[stoops4pres]

Yeah the Big 12 when Texas A&M, Baylor, Kansas State & Missouri were 5 or 6 guaranteed wins. Turn that into 2 or 3 wins which is all it would have been if they weren't all down and where were we? That's why we were constantly upset by worse seeds. The Big XII was horrific.

I agree with you on your contention that the Big 12 is better from top-to-bottom now compared to Sampson's years. The conference does have more depth.

But to say the conference was "horrific" is incorrect, at least when regarding Sampson's latter years at OU (you could be right about earlier during Sampson's tenure). The Big 12 since 2002 has put out arguably the best tournament results out of any conference; the comparison between them and the Big East for the top is basically splitting hairs.

It was more "top heavy" back then, but that doesn't make it "horrific".