Ou @ ksu

[BigT14]

I honestly think the one thing that is really killing us is a clear vocal leader. We need someone on the floor that can calm everyone down when we're in a tight spot. Someone to fire us up when we need more energy. That is one thing we don't have. That would be HUGE for us to have. Someone has to step up.

 

[Sweetest OU Girl]

If thats the only thing you have to say after my comment then Im just gonna agree to disagree. Not trying to argue with you Norm, but there is a lot more to the game than scoring. and not having her in the game the whole first half against a zone was devastating.

The problem is Sherri does not like to have a set of players learn to play together. So as soon as a group gets comfortable and starts to make good progress, Sherri starts making incredibly puzzling substitutions. It is the craziest thing I have ever seen or heard of in my life. So if a player wants to stay in the game, she needs to miss lots of shots and create lots of turnovers (Sherri doesn't want to hurt her feelings by pulling her - so instead she will pull the one playing best at the moment). Maddie got too successful, so Sherri decided she did not deserve to be on the court.

 

[sybarite]

I honestly think the one thing that is really killing us is a clear vocal leader. We need someone on the floor that can calm everyone down when we're in a tight spot. Someone to fire us up when we need more energy. That is one thing we don't have. That would be HUGE for us to have. Someone has to step up.

I thought that might be Maddie. But, you really need for it to be your point, the person who is directing traffic When we get close, we need a traffic cop to set up a play that will tie the score rather than have no plan. A couple of times, we came back. Gabbi blew one of them by taking a rushed twenty foot shot before we were set up. At the time, Lewis was on the bench, and she took a shot from near the top of the key?--with twenty-five seconds left?

 

[Vinny78]

What I have always said - Sherri just keeps confirming my previous comments

 

[Sooners4Life0101]

The problem is Sherri does not like to have a set of players learn to play together. So as soon as a group gets comfortable and starts to make good progress, Sherri starts making incredibly puzzling substitutions. It is the craziest thing I have ever seen or heard of in my life. So if a player wants to stay in the game, she needs to miss lots of shots and create lots of turnovers (Sherri doesn't want to hurt her feelings by pulling her - so instead she will pull the one playing best at the moment). Maddie got too successful, so Sherri decided she did not deserve to be on the court.

I agree there. I think she is afraid to ruin Gabbi right now by pulling her too. but a spade is spade. If you can't defend, you won't ever be able to defend. Its a very athletic trait that some players have- and some just weren't blessed. Im not trying to bag on Gabbi or Wyatt, but they don't have it on that end- so we have games where teams shoot 90% from 3, and score 130 pts. Its not hard to do against us because we have holes in system. Sometimes the truth hurts, they just are not good defenders and you can't keep running them out there hoping they make 8 threes... Thats not reality.

Defense provides consistency.

 

[Sweetest OU Girl]

I agree there. I think she is afraid to ruin Gabbi right now by pulling her too. but a spade is spade. If you can't defend, you won't ever be able to defend. Its a very athletic trait that some players have- and some just weren't blessed. Im not trying to bag on Gabbi or Wyatt, but they don't have it on that end- so we have games where teams shoot 90% from 3, and score 130 pts. Its not hard to do against us because we have holes in system. Sometimes the truth hurts, they just are not good defenders and you can't keep running them out there hoping they make 8 threes... Thats not reality.

Defense provides consistency.

Some valid points, but I don't think it is just due to the players ability. For years we have played a style of defense that asks our corner defender (near the baseline) to sag in - almost to the lane - and leaves the corner shooter with no one closer than 10-15 feet. It happens all the time. Those are the players who hit lots of those threes. I saw TT do it several times against OSU. Derica plays there a lot, so you see it and tend to think it's her fault, but actually Sherri coaches them to do that. It is the epitome of foolishness.

At the games all the people in the area where I sit have recognized this and 10-15 times every game someone hollers out "get back out there on that outside shooter". It is a waste of energy, because Sherri does not realize that many players can hit a wide open three. Besides, by the time they say it, the three has been nailed. I can guarantee you opposing coaches and players are aware of it.

 

[atlantasooner]

This roster has much bigger problems than no senior PG.
Manning badly needs to be playing the 3. Not the 4.
The gaps at 4 on this roster are massive. Then you have athletes who cannot shoot, and shooters who not athletic enough for top ten hoops. Finally, shooters who are not shooting.
Two relatively proficient posts who cannot play together.

 

[womenssports]

This roster has much bigger problems than no senior PG.
Manning badly needs to be playing the 3. Not the 4.
The gaps at 4 on this roster are massive. Then you have athletes who cannot shoot, and shooters who not athletic enough for top ten hoops. Finally, shooters who are not shooting.
Two relatively proficient posts who cannot play together.

I have never seen them on the court at the same time. Maybe I don't understand your post.

 

[Sooners4Life0101]

Some valid points, but I don't think it is just due to the players ability. For years we have played a style of defense that asks our corner defender (near the baseline) to sag in - almost to the lane - and leaves the corner shooter with no one closer than 10-15 feet. It happens all the time. Those are the players who hit lots of those threes. I saw TT do it several times against OSU. Derica plays there a lot, so you see it and tend to think it's her fault, but actually Sherri coaches them to do that. It is the epitome of foolishness.

At the games all the people in the area where I sit have recognized this and 10-15 times every game someone hollers out "get back out there on that outside shooter". It is a waste of energy, because Sherri does not realize that many players can hit a wide open three. Besides, by the time they say it, the three has been nailed. I can guarantee you opposing coaches and players are aware of it.

We technically play defense right sweetest, every other team mans up that way in college and pros. Thats the help side. The problem is however, that Derica and Gabbi are going to be slow getting out there. If your slow that makes others have to compensate for it... What keeps making me sick is we have the players. They just need to be put in the right position to succeed.

Silver Lining- We aren't even close to where we COULD be and theres a lot of season left. But that doesn't really mean a thing either.

 

[Oliver Hardy]

We used to criticize Sherri for NOT subbing and now some think she's subbing too much.

With this team, playing a lot of subs is probably a good thing because no one line up can get it together.




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[Sooners4Life0101]

This roster has much bigger problems than no senior PG.
Manning badly needs to be playing the 3. Not the 4.
The gaps at 4 on this roster are massive. Then you have athletes who cannot shoot, and shooters who not athletic enough for top ten hoops. Finally, shooters who are not shooting.
Two relatively proficient posts who cannot play together.

You can't play them together, because A. they get tired after two minutes, who you going to put in if they are both tired? and B. We need one for when the other gets in foul trouble. We don't have another 4, but Maddie never gets out muscled on the boards, rarely gets beat on d even by the best scorers- and if nothing else she ether makes you chase her w much bigger player or you are Texas and completely change you lineup to guard her.... It should be our advantage.

But it would also be nice to be able to go big on some rotations, it might help her and us at times- wish we a had another 4. But we don't get all the recruits in the world.... But I definitely believe we have what we need to make a run next season- especially cause we might have some real depth and athleticism at the guard positions... and we can make a good one this year too, but I think TT has to play- and Vivi has to play more.

 

[Sooners4Life0101]

Btw. Watched KSU press conference. All he says the whole times is basically thats as good we have a shot all season- likes to think they are capable of that again. But thats a once year performance.-- Im going to believe its are defenders- and also just a horrible night to play them.

 

[Sweetest OU Girl]

We technically play defense right sweetest, every other team mans up that way in college and pros. Thats the help side. The problem is however, that Derica and Gabbi are going to be slow getting out there. If your slow that makes others have to compensate for it... What keeps making me sick is we have the players. They just need to be put in the right position to succeed.

Silver Lining- We aren't even close to where we COULD be and theres a lot of season left. But that doesn't really mean a thing either.

No one else allows that player to be open by 15 feet. It is not workable. That is why these teams who cannot shoot threes hit 50-60 percent against us and not against others.

It is not related to certain players. TT was the one getting beat on that against OSU. Over and over.

We are playing that defense completely wrong - especially for the players we have. It happens every year about now. Teams don't expect to see that, but after they get to see several game films they all realize we are giving up that shot, and start to work it hard into their offense.

Sherri knows it too, and even mentioned the problem a while back in an interview. That made me hope she would fix it, but she does not seem to realize how to fix it.

 

[soonermike22]

Sorry Sweetest, it was the scheme and other defenders that caused TT to be late to the corners. We were playing the 1-3-1 trap, and on the baseline TT covers from sideline to sideline on the base. It is the point and wings job to not allow skip passes to the corner unmolested, to allow time for the base to get there. No base defender can outrun passes that are not defended in the front. Your criticism should be on the wings not trapping the passer, not on the base defender. That corner 3 is one of the weaknesses of the 1-3-1 trap, and a good team will try to get the ball there quickly from one side to the other. If the front doesn't defend properly, the baseline defender cannot get there, and uninformed fans will think the base defensive players are not good defenders

 

[atlantasooner]

Life0101,
My point was you have two players who are relatively effective. VV and KK. But you cannot put them out in a lineup together. So it's more like one spot is effective.
With no real 4 which has been a recruiting problem since AT left, you are left playing Manning out of position completely.
I don't think Manning is ever going to be this all conference player/savior some posters think she is has the potential to be. I just don't night over night see that ceiling.
I do know that she's never going to reach her potential playing the 4 spot.

 

[sybarite]

So, Maddie needs a male coach to win in Manhattan? Is the reason that the men lost in Manhattan that Lon needs a female coach?

 

[Sweetest OU Girl]

Sorry Sweetest, it was the scheme and other defenders that caused TT to be late to the corners. We were playing the 1-3-1 trap, and on the baseline TT covers from sideline to sideline on the base. It is the point and wings job to not allow skip passes to the corner unmolested, to allow time for the base to get there. No base defender can outrun passes that are not defended in the front. Your criticism should be on the wings not trapping the passer, not on the base defender. That corner 3 is one of the weaknesses of the 1-3-1 trap, and a good team will try to get the ball there quickly from one side to the other. If the front doesn't defend properly, the baseline defender cannot get there, and uninformed fans will think the base defensive players are not good defenders

It wasn't happening in just the 1-3-1 zone. TT gets reckless at times - like she does in some other situations - and leaves her assignment open. It happened several times and they really hurt us on it. She runs away, with no other OU player anywhere in the vicinity, then ends up 15 feet or so from the wide open shooter who easily makes the 3. She wasn't "late to the corner". In fact she was not even in the vicinity of the corner when the shots would go up.

These were passes over the top and from the inside, not from the point. Having played that exact position, I know how to defend it. You cannot forget your assignment and run over to help someone else. It appears to me that Sherri teaches them to do that. Sometimes she expects things from players that they can't possibly make happen.

 

[Sooners4Life0101]

Life0101,
My point was you have two players who are relatively effective. VV and KK. But you cannot put them out in a lineup together. So it's more like one spot is effective.
With no real 4 which has been a recruiting problem since AT left, you are left playing Manning out of position completely.
I don't think Manning is ever going to be this all conference player/savior some posters think she is has the potential to be. I just don't night over night see that ceiling.
I do know that she's never going to reach her potential playing the 4 spot.

I think she will but that's subjective at this point. I think it happens next year, but all she has to do is just start shooting 40-45% again and she will start taking over- (w/gioya) so it could happen at anytime.
I think your making too big of deal about positions as well- Sometimes she's the point, some times she plays as the go to off guard, sometimes she's a stretch 4- She doesn't necessarily have a position. and then she's pulled down the second most boards for us in the conference, she never lets the person she is guarding beat her- so there is not a reason to move her. If she was deficient as a rebounder or deficient as a defender I would agree, but those are strengths- so I can't agree w you. Honestly. I think we need to play TT and Vivi more... But really- if we can just stop having a half where we shoot 35% every game, we wouldn't be having these conversations ether.

 

[Sooners4Life0101]

No one else allows that player to be open by 15 feet. It is not workable. That is why these teams who cannot shoot threes hit 50-60 percent against us and not against others.

It is not related to certain players. TT was the one getting beat on that against OSU. Over and over.

We are playing that defense completely wrong - especially for the players we have. It happens every year about now. Teams don't expect to see that, but after they get to see several game films they all realize we are giving up that shot, and start to work it hard into their offense.

Sherri knows it too, and even mentioned the problem a while back in an interview. That made me hope she would fix it, but she does not seem to realize how to fix it.

Enless there is a serious shooting threat then if your playing man and your two passes away you should be almost between the ball and your man, that'll put you down by the block. Everybody does this

 

[sybarite]

Let's see. Is Maddie a 4? Tonight, she led the team in rebounds. She had 7 in 24 minutes. Vivi and Kay Kay had 8 between them in 39 minutes. Seems that she is a good enough rebounder. Tonight, they didn't credit her with a block. But, they did credit her with a couple of steals. Going back to the TCU game in which they credited her with three blocks and three steals, it's difficult to tell which is which. If someone drives the lane, and she takes it away from them as they try to shoot, which is it? They seem confused. But, she's getting blocks. Her credited blocks were against a guard, Butts, their fastest guard, Alix, and their post. Seems that she can defend the position inside. What's wrong with her as a four?