TCU Gets Notice of Allegations from NCAA

[WichitaSooner]

Why does it have to be somebody specific?

We have how many years (decades) of Lon's career to reflect on? We know what he is. We know what his ceiling is. We know that we've only recruited two HS 4* or better kids since TY's class (Harmon and Manek), according to 247.

I just want somebody with a higher upside. We can argue about "who" later.

You're right, it's pretty clearly established that is ceiling is the Final Four. It's equally well established that his floor at OU is making the tournament 75-80% of the time. But I'm sure there are dozens of guys with higher upside out there who would take the job. Buzz, Boynton, some Conference USA guys -- all those dudes have made a career of taking teams to the FF.

 

[thebigabd]

Why does it have to be somebody specific?

We have how many years (decades) of Lon's career to reflect on? We know what he is. We know what his ceiling is. We know that we've only recruited two HS 4* or better kids since TY's class (Harmon and Manek), according to 247.

I just want somebody with a higher upside. We can argue about "who" later.

I agree with this in principle... it's basically a trap from Kruger supporters, so they can turn around and say "So Kruger has won 500 games and you want to hire someone from C-USA or the Mountain West that is unproven", etc.

Truth is.... that young coach can be better for the future of the program than Lon. But they want to do a resume comparison.

 

[WTSooner]

I agree with this in principle... it's basically a trap from Kruger supporters, so they can turn around and say "So Kruger has won 500 games and you want to hire someone from C-USA or the Mountain West that is unproven", etc.

Truth is.... that young coach can be better for the future of the program than Lon. But they want to do a resume comparison.

Exactly, that is the fallacy in their argument.

 

[BoulderSooner]

You're right, it's pretty clearly established that is ceiling is the Final Four. It's equally well established that his floor at OU is making the tournament 75-80% of the time. But I'm sure there are dozens of guys with higher upside out there who would take the job. Buzz, Boynton, some Conference USA guys -- all those dudes have made a career of taking teams to the FF.

very much this

 

[BanjoCharley]

Truth is.... that young coach can be better for the future of the program than Lon. But they want to do a resume comparison.

Like Capel!

 

[WTSooner]

Like Capel!

I still liked that hire, for what it SHOULD have been. Didn't work out. Can't be scared to make changes for fear of failing. If it happens, it happens. Identify it and move on.

 

[thebigabd]

Like Capel!

Bad hire... but that doesn't mean all hires will be bad. Capel went to an elite 8 and was 25-1 in that season. By the logic applied above, that now becomes his "ceiling"... They said Lon's ceiling was the final 4 because he got there, so Capel must be an Elite 8 coach, because he got there, right?

 

[skyvue]

Why does it have to be somebody specific?

We have how many years (decades) of Lon's career to reflect on? We know what he is. We know what his ceiling is. We know that we've only recruited two HS 4* or better kids since TY's class (Harmon and Manek), according to 247.

I just want somebody with a higher upside. We can argue about "who" later.

Fire your coach first, plan for a replacement later? Interesting approach. Thankfully, it's not one Joe C. is likely to take.

As for wanting somebody with a higher upside than Coach Kruger, I get that. I'll go you one better: I want us to have the best coach in college hoops. But I don't have a clue (and neither do you) how to figure out just who that coach is or how to get him. We can play Pin the Tail on the Coaching Chart and hope we get lucky but there is no coach out there that we could snag who is guaranteed to be better than our likely Hall of Fame coach. Not one. It would be a crap shoot.

I'm reminded of all the guys on OU football boards SCREAMING for months for Mike Stoops to be brought back.

Then, of course, all those same guys spent years *****ing and moaning about Mike Stoops' performance as DC. And not a single one of them copped to the fact that they'd demanded his return.

Heck, we don't even have to include football. I remember all too well how many trashed Sampson relentlessly throughout his tenure at OU. And now we frequently see threads praising him to the skies, with (I didn't keep a list of names but I've no doubt) posts praising him from guys who trashed him when he was in Norman.

 

[WTSooner]

Fire your coach first, plan for a replacement later? Interesting approach. Thankfully, it's not one Joe C. is likely to take.

lol, just b/c I don't have a name to give doesn't mean I wouldn't expect Joe C. to.

Very similar to how I as a fan can take an opponent lightly, but that doesn't mean the team should be.

smh

 

[BoulderSooner]

Bad hire... but that doesn't mean all hires will be bad. Capel went to an elite 8 and was 25-1 in that season. By the logic applied above, that now becomes his "ceiling"... They said Lon's ceiling was the final 4 because he got there, so Capel must be an Elite 8 coach, because he got there, right?

lon has been to multi final 4's

 

[thebigabd]

lol, just b/c I don't have a name to give doesn't mean I wouldn't expect Joe C. to.

Very similar to how I as a fan can take an opponent lightly, but that doesn't mean the team should be.

smh

Right.... it's not your job to hire a promising replacement coach. You are a fan. I threw out some names, but we simply don't have access to the data that Joe C would. We also can't interview these guys, ask them relevant questions, get a feel for their vision, etc. It's an absurd request. Not only do we not have access to that, we aren't paid to conduct that kind of research. That is Joe C's job.

 

[BCSooners]

Bad hire... but that doesn't mean all hires will be bad. Capel went to an elite 8 and was 25-1 in that season. By the logic applied above, that now becomes his "ceiling"... They said Lon's ceiling was the final 4 because he got there, so Capel must be an Elite 8 coach, because he got there, right?

LK has multiple final fours and is a consistent winner. How is Capel doing at Pitt? If LK fell like Capel after Buddy and/or got OU in trouble then I’d say fire him. He’s done neither.

The guy that Wake Forrest just hires would’ve been the only mid-major coach I would’ve liked to see as a replacement, but only if LK retired.

 

[BCSooners]

I still liked that hire, for what it SHOULD have been. Didn't work out. Can't be scared to make changes for fear of failing. If it happens, it happens. Identify it and move on.

So you’d rather take a chance at another Capel while OU is having solid seasons & is staying clear of all the show company scandals? LK has 2-4 years left & is still winning & you’d like to go get an unknown, that’s a good way to be identified as a job to stay away from.

 

[WTSooner]

lon has been to multi final 4's

He's been to 2 in 34 years of college coaching. He's been to one additional Elite 8. So in 34 years of coaching, he's made the Elite 8 or better 3 times.

I wouldn't exactly hold my breath that another Elite 8 or better is coming our way under Lon anytime soon. Especially with recent recruiting. 3 star kids aren't going to get us there.

 

[WTSooner]

So you’d rather take a chance at another Capel while OU is having solid seasons & is staying clear of all the show company scandals? LK has 2-4 years left & is still winning & you’d like to go get an unknown, that’s a good way to be identified as a job to stay away from.

I don't consider finishing under .500 in conference play three of the last four seasons, and right at .500 in conference play the other season, having solid seasons. I know we've continued to make the Dance (barely a couple of times), and I know our winning percentage OOC has been solid, but I personally don't feel like the program is on solid footing. Our HS recruiting continues to go backwards. We're still recruiting WAY too many projects, then watching them transfer out of the program in record numbers. We're continuing, for the most part, to get transfers in that aren't all that highly thought off. Reaves and possibly Gibson being slight exceptions to that. Constant roster turnover. Don't even know if Gibson is going to be eligible next year, and if not, I'm not sure we're a tourney team, which absolutely wastes the senior seasons for Manek, Reaves, Williams, and Kur.

The program may be stable in that I don't see a 10 win season on our horizon, but it's not stable in some of the ways I'd like it to be. Our inability to recruit the caliber of HS kids that we need to remain a top 25 program continues to lead to us reaching for transfers and roster plugs. Been that way basically since Buddy and his class left. That isn't good. I feel like, to some extent, the game is passing Kruger by.

And that keeping us out of trouble crap is just that. There are PLENTY of coaches out there can do better than .500 in the Big 12 without cheating.

Edit: BTW, I'm already on record as saying that as long as Lon gets us to the Dance, Joe C. isn't going to put any pressure on him. We BEGGED Lon to come to OU. Lon isn't going to get fired. Which leaves me pretty "meh" about OU basketball, b/c it means we're going to limp along for the next few years until Lon is ready to retire.

 

[thebigabd]

LK has multiple final fours and is a consistent winner. How is Capel doing at Pitt? If LK fell like Capel after Buddy and/or got OU in trouble then I’d say fire him. He’s done neither.

The guy that Wake Forrest just hires would’ve been the only mid-major coach I would’ve liked to see as a replacement, but only if LK retired.

So there is literally one coach out there from the lower levels that you think could do better than Lon? Seriously, one guy?

Your opinion of the program is very low.

 

[red recluse]

tcu...louisville...lon needs to go. lol.

 

[BCSooners]

I don't consider finishing under .500 in conference play three of the last four seasons, and right at .500 in conference play the other season, having solid seasons. I know we've continued to make the Dance (barely a couple of times), and I know our winning percentage OOC has been solid, but I personally don't feel like the program is on solid footing. Our HS recruiting continues to go backwards. We're still recruiting WAY too many projects, then watching them transfer out of the program in record numbers. We're continuing, for the most part, to get transfers in that aren't all that highly thought off. Reaves and possibly Gibson being slight exceptions to that. Constant roster turnover. Don't even know if Gibson is going to be eligible next year, and if not, I'm not sure we're a tourney team, which absolutely wastes the senior seasons for Manek, Reaves, Williams, and Kur.

The program may be stable in that I don't see a 10 win season on our horizon, but it's not stable in some of the ways I'd like it to be. Our inability to recruit the caliber of HS kids that we need to remain a top 25 program continues to lead to us reaching for transfers and roster plugs. Been that way basically since Buddy and his class left. That isn't good. I feel like, to some extent, the game is passing Kruger by.

And that keeping us out of trouble crap is just that. There are PLENTY of coaches out there can do better than .500 in the Big 12 without cheating.

Edit: BTW, I'm already on record as saying that as long as Lon gets us to the Dance, Joe C. isn't going to put any pressure on him. We BEGGED Lon to come to OU. Lon isn't going to get fired. Which leaves me pretty "meh" about OU basketball, b/c it means we're going to limp along for the next few years until Lon is ready to retire.

I’ve said numerous times conference record could be better, but that’s not the whole season which is what I look at. I think recruiting is solid based on today’s landscape. You say that their are plenty of coaches that can do better in the Big12 that don’t cheat? KU, BU, OSU, TCU are all in trouble or have recently been in trouble. UT does the least with their talent, by far, in the conference. And still the conference is tougher than its ever been.

Transfers are the way things are right now, every program is going through this. Bienemy is the one transfer that I’m surprised or disappointed that left. Thomas, M’baye, Reaves, Gibson are better than any player that has transferred out, McGusty was a huge pain or he’d be the exception.

In what way is the game passing Kruger by? He has good defenses, attacks mismatches, has good BLOB & OOT plays. A more fluid half court offense is something I would say needs to be better. The program is stable because we aren’t seeing 10 win seasons? Lol OU has made the past 3 tournaments & 7 of last 8.

We can argue about this even more, but it’s just going to lead to our past arguments on the subject. I’m glad to consent that we disagree and aren’t going to change each other’s mind.

 

[BCSooners]

So there is literally one coach out there from the lower levels that you think could do better than Lon? Seriously, one guy?

Your opinion of the program is very low.

I said there’s one that I think would. All the others would be crapshoots, which I don’t think the program is near taking that chance.

7 of last 8 seasons have had tourney appearances, FF, Sweet 16. All doing this after cleaning up the program & keeping it clean. That’s hard to do today. So I don’t know what your opinion of the program is, but I’m very satisfied for LK to finish up in the next 2-4 years going this way.

 

[thebigabd]

I said there’s one that I think would. All the others would be crapshoots, which I don’t think the program is near taking that chance.

7 of last 8 seasons have had tourney appearances, FF, Sweet 16. All doing this after cleaning up the program & keeping it clean. That’s hard to do today. So I don’t know what your opinion of the program is, but I’m very satisfied for LK to finish up in the next 2-4 years going this way.

Interesting.