What would our record be if Calvin Newell didn't transfer?

[OklaSooners]

We are 15 and 15 now. I've got to think he would have made at least a 3 game difference. I think we would have been 18 - 12 or 19 - 11

 

[DenverSooner]

To me it is not even worth thinking about. He mislead OU fans by saying he had family issues and quit on his teammates.

 

[jerry]

To me it is not even worth thinking about. He mislead OU fans by saying he had family issues and quit on his teammates.

Agree.

 

[WTSooner]

To me it's worth thinking about, only b/c it will give us a truer indication of where our team was this year. Newell is fairly easily replaced, so really, simply by adding a capable body next year, we're saying we should be 3+ games better, simply on that fact alone. Makes me feel a little better about the job LK did this year, knowing that he didn't have a true 2/3 coming off the bench all season. I've asked this before, to no answer, but what other major D1 team can say that this year?

 

[DenverSooner]

I agree that OU is going to be substantially improved next year. Adding M'Baye, Hield and Hornbeak is going to make a big difference.

 

[garyeb2]

To me it is not even worth thinking about. He mislead OU fans by saying he had family issues and quit on his teammates.

Really, well I beg to differ. There is a back story there that no one within the program cared to talk about. And I certainly don't know what it was.

Kruger ran Calvin off. Kruger would grind on him relentlessly every day in practice. He was held to a higher performence standard than anyone else. I remember one day during a scrimmage, Blair turned the ball over on four consecutive possesions and not a word was said. On those same four possesions Calvin got two steals, hit a 3, and had a turnover. Kruger stopped the action and gave Calvin an earfull over the turnover.

His teamates, the stiffs that have been around the program alittle longer and cann't beat anyone, treated him like the team mascot. Calvin didn't like it and had he had an obvious chip on his shoulder.

Now, I'm a Kruger fan. And he has biten off a pretty tough job.Whoever he recruits, whoever he runs off, and whoever he keeps around to work with is his decision. And I support it. But, like I said, there is an unknown backstory. Placing and proportioning blame is guesswork without knowing it.

 

[Chiefdaddy]

Does anybody know the real story here? Has Kruger ever mentioned anything other than the family stuff? There is no doubt that Calvin was improved this year and could have really helped us.

 

[stoopified]

We are 15 and 15 now. I've got to think he would have made at least a 3 game difference. I think we would have been 18 - 12 or 19 - 11

That is about I figure.My thinking is that he could have averaged about 10 ppg(he was aveaging 13ppg) and that would have put us with 5 possible wins and a tie(which of course would have meant OT). Even if you only speculate that we salvage 3 of those games that puts us at 18-12.

 

[bgrch1350]

To me it's worth thinking about, only b/c it will give us a truer indication of where our team was this year. Newell is fairly easily replaced, so really, simply by adding a capable body next year, we're saying we should be 3+ games better, simply on that fact alone. Makes me feel a little better about the job LK did this year, knowing that he didn't have a true 2/3 coming off the bench all season. I've asked this before, to no answer, but what other major D1 team can say that this year?

Its obvious that with Newell we could have won several more games...How many more is a question that cannot be answered but he brought a lot to this team...Not just bench scoring but additional guard support which we lacked in a big way.

As for Newell being easily replaced next season is a big statement and one that I think is totally wrong. So far we are bringing players that were similar to what Newell was last year. A player that averaged 10mpg and only 2ppg last season.

 

[WTSooner]

As for Newell being easily replaced next season is a big statement and one that I think is totally wrong. So far we are bringing players that were similar to what Newell was last year. A player that averaged 10mpg and only 2ppg last season.

Hield and/or Hornbeak will be every bit as good as Newell was would have been this season. Anybody that expected Newell to continue at the clip he started at is out of their mind. He'd have cooled down, and I expect one of the new guys to be able to match what he would have done, next year.

 

[BigTime]

Really, well I beg to differ. There is a back story there that no one within the program cared to talk about. And I certainly don't know what it was.

Kruger ran Calvin off. Kruger would grind on him relentlessly every day in practice. He was held to a higher performence standard than anyone else. I remember one day during a scrimmage, Blair turned the ball over on four consecutive possesions and not a word was said. On those same four possesions Calvin got two steals, hit a 3, and had a turnover. Kruger stopped the action and gave Calvin an earfull over the turnover.

His teamates, the stiffs that have been around the program alittle longer and cann't beat anyone, treated him like the team mascot. Calvin didn't like it and had he had an obvious chip on his shoulder.

Now, I'm a Kruger fan. And he has biten off a pretty tough job.Whoever he recruits, whoever he runs off, and whoever he keeps around to work with is his decision. And I support it. But, like I said, there is an unknown backstory. Placing and proportioning blame is guesswork without knowing it.

There is an unfortunate back story that I heard involving Calvin wronging some of his teammates that I heard as well.

Best of luck to him at South Florida. Wish he wouldn't have left midseason.

 

[NickZepp]

To me it's worth thinking about, only b/c it will give us a truer indication of where our team was this year. Newell is fairly easily replaced, so really, simply by adding a capable body next year, we're saying we should be 3+ games better, simply on that fact alone. Makes me feel a little better about the job LK did this year, knowing that he didn't have a true 2/3 coming off the bench all season. I've asked this before, to no answer, but what other major D1 team can say that this year?

This is so true. We basically didn't have another guard that could shoot about 30% from 3 outside of Pledger. Adding one of those will improve us so much next year. I'm not sure M'Baye adds a lot to the team next year even if he ends up being great because we'll have a lot of good inside scoring with Fitz and Roe. You just won't be able to add a ton more scoring than we were capable of there next year unless we get another guy or two that can hit some 3s and force teams to play us man to man more. That's gonna be the real key to next season. If we just add M'Baye as the only meaningful guy, we may not be a bunch better even with everyone coming back because we will still be relatively easy for teams to scheme against.

Also adding another shooter will help Pledger and really Clark's game out a bunch. And it'll help our penetrating PGs game out a ton too.

 

[skyvue]

I expect one of the new guys to be able to match what he would have done, next year.

I hope you're right, but let's not forget they'll be true freshman. Expecting a lot from a freshman is asking for disappointment. There's no telling what we'll get from those guys next season.

As for Coach Kruger supposedly riding Newell, most any coach will tell you that some players need support and encouragement (coddling, some would call it), while others thrive while being ridden harder.

That's not to say Coach Kruger necessarily read Newell correctly; perhaps he took the wrong approach. But it's a leap to assume there was a "backstory" behind Coach Kruger's coaching relationship with Newell.

 

[garyeb2]

No Skyview, that is not correct. There was an obvious and severe friction between Kruger ands Newell from the time practices opened up to the public until Calvin left.

I went to those practices and I saw it. It was no great surprise that Calvin went away. It was that severe. Kruger probably handled it just right. It is the players job to fit in with the new staff. Not the other way around.

 

[WTSooner]

No Skyview, that is not correct. There was an obvious and severe friction between Kruger ands Newell from the time practices opened up to the public until Calvin left.

I went to those practices and I saw it. It was no great surprise that Calvin went away. It was that severe. Kruger probably handled it just right. It is the players job to fit in with the new staff. Not the other way around.

Two things.....

1. If what Big eluded to is true, no wonder there was a riff. If Calvin somehow "wronged" this teammates, I imagine that is something that wouldn't sit well with an old school coach like LK. So maybe that "tough love" was LK's way of having Newell "earn" back some trust.

2. Didn't you say all summer and during fall practices how Newell looked great, and the staff had him running with the 1's a lot of the time? Just how tough could they have been on the kid if that were true?

 

[garyeb2]

Two things.....

1. If what Big eluded to is true, no wonder there was a riff. If Calvin somehow "wronged" this teammates, I imagine that is something that wouldn't sit well with an old school coach like LK. So maybe that "tough love" was LK's way of having Newell "earn" back some trust.

2. Didn't you say all summer and during fall practices how Newell looked great, and the staff had him running with the 1's a lot of the time? Just how tough could they have been on the kid if that were true?

You can imagine and mayby whatever you want. I'm just saying that there were issues with Calvin that were unrelated to his on court performance. It was obvious to everyone in the gym. He is gone isn't he?

As far as running with the 1's, that is simple. He was the best #2 on the team and it wasn't close.

 

[bgrch1350]

Hield and/or Hornbeak will be every bit as good as Newell was would have been this season. Anybody that expected Newell to continue at the clip he started at is out of their mind. He'd have cooled down, and I expect one of the new guys to be able to match what he would have done, next year.

Your putting some high expectations on some guards that arent ranked very high. Even Pledger who is a top notch guard right now averaged 16mpg and 3.8ppg as a freshmen. Crocker as a freshmen averaged 21mpg and 6.4ppg. Newell averaged 10mpg and 2.1ppg. And Davis averaged 12mpg and 3.3ppg.
Hield and Hornbeak fall into the same category as these recruits.

And to actually think that you think these 2 freshmen are going to be that good right out of the gate is insane. And even more insane that you think that they would be better than Newell next year.

 

[MercedeSooner]

3-4 wins. We were in a ton of games late and couldn't find a way to make baskets when it counted.

 

[NickZepp]

3-4 wins. We were in a ton of games late and couldn't find a way to make baskets when it counted.

Yep there were a lot of games maybe 6 or 7 games where we were in it till the last few minutes but couldn't make a shot to keep us in it or win it.

 

[JBaker]

As far as running with the 1's, that is simple. He was the best #2 on the team and it wasn't close.

:facepalm

The fact that this is still your analysis should lead everyone to take what you saw in practices with a giant grain of salt.

So I'm not sure I should believe Kruger had it out for Newell anymore than I believe Arent is going to be a major contributor.