March Madness and Covid-19

[SoonerBounce13]

For the 8 billionth time, death is not the only possible life-changing bad outcome from catching Covid-19.

https://www.google.com/search?q=long-term%20effects%20of%20covid-19&cad=h

nobody says it is. It is a very new virus. It is impossible to really know what the long term effects are. I would imagine it is similar to over corona viruses though

 

[sheepdogs1]

nobody says it is. It is a very new virus. It is impossible to really know what the long term effects are. I would imagine it is similar to over corona viruses though

We hear each day how something might be possible but without true definition, and clarity would be helpful. I gather many of the stories written without valid results are just playing the hypothesis role and helps bring attention to the authors/web sites/periodicals/newspapers, etc. And most people would likely prefer a side effect versus the loss of their life.

 

[steverocks35]

We hear each day how something might be possible but without true definition, and clarity would be helpful. I gather many of the stories written without valid results are just playing the hypothesis role and helps bring attention to the authors/web sites/periodicals/newspapers, etc. And most people would likely prefer a side effect versus the loss of their life.

Yes, I would prefer 20% decreased lung function rather than death, but that wouldn't make it any less life-changing or easy to deal with.

 

[coolm]

Unlikely to be believed by the right.... My family members (who are very much Trump people) were telling me that the cases don't matter, because thats what Trump said... Now they are telling me the deaths aren't real. That people who are getting killed in traffic accidents and stuff are being counted as Covid deaths.

So:

The cases don't matter
The hospitalizations don't matter much
The deaths are fake

exact same thing I encounter.

 

[coolm]

I dont understand the mental process of you doubters and minimizers.

do you think you are saving lives or something? you are literally killing people by appealing to their idiocy and intentionally confusing them.

don't you feel ANY responsibility for that?

is your desire for normalcy THAT important to you that you just overlook the deaths you are causing??

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I dont understand the mental process of you doubters and minimizers.

do you think you are saving lives or something? you are literally killing people by appealing to their idiocy and intentionally confusing them.

don't you feel ANY responsibility for that?

is your desire for normalcy THAT important to you that you just overlook the deaths you are causing??

Can you be more specific on whom you are addressing?

 

[sheepdogs1]

Can you be more specific on whom you are addressing?

What are the chances of the MSM being included in this dubious group as they were the chief downplayers of the virus's effects early on. And since their early stance was predicated on opposing the administration that shows their true colors and the value they place on the lives of the innocent (pigs are to be slaughtered I gather). The "eminence front" that are people. They have no shame.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

I don't downplay the virus at all. I downplay some of the reaction to the virus though.

I never saw you comment on the fact that Ohio has more deaths per capita than florida. Now that may very well change. But it seems premature to make assumptions as if they are fact without the data to prove it. Ohio was listed as one of the best states in how they responded. They have more deaths per capita than the so called worse state. What does that tell you?

 

[thebigabd]

I dont understand the mental process of you doubters and minimizers.

do you think you are saving lives or something? you are literally killing people by appealing to their idiocy and intentionally confusing them.

don't you feel ANY responsibility for that?

is your desire for normalcy THAT important to you that you just overlook the deaths you are causing??

There is a huge conflict in my family right now about this..... Like many families, we have this big family text message thread with like 12-15 of us on it.

4 or 5 of us are like-minded... and the rest are not only not like-minded, but deep in Trump territory. They were never like this for Bush, not even close. They've gone off the Trump deep-end.

That being said, they are for sure doubters and minimizers, as you described it. Here is how the convo went down:

• "Hey I heard GT Bynum may require masks"- my liberal cousin
• "No way in hell I will cooperate with that"- my Trump sister
• "Well you kinda half to"-my liberal cousin
• "not gonna happen"- my Trump sister (with a bunch of agreements from the Trump brigade)
• "What is your problem with the mask? how did a mask become political?"- me
• "Because it's not as bad out there as you think it is"- my mom
• "Based on what?"- me
• "They are doing so much testing, so of course they are finding more cases, but the vast majority of people its nothing. Plus, the deaths are heavily bloated. I heard that they are counting deaths from other things as a Covid death if the person tests positive for Covid"- my mom
• "Who did you hear that from?"- me
• "News, and other places"- my mom
• "ok, so you think there is a virus?"- me
• "Yes"- my mom
• "But you don't think its that dangerous?"- me
• "Yea, I don't think its nearly as dangerous as they make it sound"- my mom
• "But you have nothing concrete to really base that on?"- me
• "Things I read and heard"- my mom
• "ok, but don't you think its better to err on the side of caution and just wear a mask? It can't be that big a deal"- me
• "no, because thats what they want you to do. This is all about Trump losing the election. They want schools closed, they want the economy tanked, they want people unhappy wearing masks, etc so they will vote for change"- my Trump sister, with lots of agreements from the Trump brigade

This happened last night in our thread.... You can clearly see their Trump influence... Trump, the biggest narcissist on the planet, has convinced people that even the virus is ALL ABOUT HIM. It's an attack on him.

I doubt my family is unique... You probably have this kind of thing going on all over the place. I know it is in my wifes family too.

 

[thebigabd]

Oh yea, I forgot to make my point coolm.... You asked if they feel any responsibility for it. The convo got HEATED last night when that insinuation was made...That you not wearing a mask and spreading it around was selfish.

They said "we are tired of hearing that... thats the problem with your side. If we don't have the same opinion, then we are mass murderers, and that is just ridiculous. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion?"

We respond.... "buuuuuttttt, your opinion is making people sick, hurting the economy, and killing people"

They respond.... "but we don't think thats true"

When the difference of opinion is who makes a better meatloaf, my mom or my aunt, that is one thing... But when the difference of opinion is potentially causing someone to get sick or die, how do you accept it? How do you respond with "well, they won't wear a mask, social distance, take any precautions in public.... and I respect their right to do so".

That's the conclusion my family seems to want us to come to... to just respect their opinion that it's a hoax and move on.

Not sure that's possible.

 

[stormspencer]

Florida reported 132 Covid-19 deaths today, breaking the old record for deaths in a single day from the virus.

This is not a surprise or any kind of revelation. We all know how reporting has worked throughout this virus, especially at the beginning of weeks. With the amount of positive cases that they were having, deaths were obviously going to go up. But this will be nothing like the NY or NJ catastrophes.

On a side note, Florida ED visits for COVID and %-positivity rate actually peaked last week. Yet, there will be more deaths to follow in the coming days and you will certainly be here to remind us.

 

[sheepdogs1]

There is a huge conflict in my family right now about this..... Like many families, we have this big family text message thread with like 12-15 of us on it.

4 or 5 of us are like-minded... and the rest are not only not like-minded, but deep in Trump territory. They were never like this for Bush, not even close. They've gone off the Trump deep-end.

That being said, they are for sure doubters and minimizers, as you described it. Here is how the convo went down:

• "Hey I heard GT Bynum may require masks"- my liberal cousin
• "No way in hell I will cooperate with that"- my Trump sister
• "Well you kinda half to"-my liberal cousin
• "not gonna happen"- my Trump sister (with a bunch of agreements from the Trump brigade)
• "What is your problem with the mask? how did a mask become political?"- me
• "Because it's not as bad out there as you think it is"- my mom
• "Based on what?"- me
• "They are doing so much testing, so of course they are finding more cases, but the vast majority of people its nothing. Plus, the deaths are heavily bloated. I heard that they are counting deaths from other things as a Covid death if the person tests positive for Covid"- my mom
• "Who did you hear that from?"- me
• "News, and other places"- my mom
• "ok, so you think there is a virus?"- me
• "Yes"- my mom
• "But you don't think its that dangerous?"- me
• "Yea, I don't think its nearly as dangerous as they make it sound"- my mom
• "But you have nothing concrete to really base that on?"- me
• "Things I read and heard"- my mom
• "ok, but don't you think its better to err on the side of caution and just wear a mask? It can't be that big a deal"- me
• "no, because thats what they want you to do. This is all about Trump losing the election. They want schools closed, they want the economy tanked, they want people unhappy wearing masks, etc so they will vote for change"- my Trump sister, with lots of agreements from the Trump brigade

This happened last night in our thread.... You can clearly see their Trump influence... Trump, the biggest narcissist on the planet, has convinced people that even the virus is ALL ABOUT HIM. It's an attack on him.

I doubt my family is unique... You probably have this kind of thing going on all over the place. I know it is in my wifes family too.

Change the subject to religion, sports, abortion, food, etc and you're likely to get people taking sides. The subject matter is just an excuse for people to take the sides as they see fit, for people are people, and there is nothing you can do about it.

 

[steverocks35]

This is not a surprise or any kind of revelation. We all know how reporting has worked throughout this virus, especially at the beginning of weeks. With the amount of positive cases that they were having, deaths were obviously going to go up. But this will be nothing like the NY or NJ catastrophes.

On a side note, Florida ED visits for COVID and %-positivity rate actually peaked last week. Yet, there will be more deaths to follow in the coming days and you will certainly be here to remind us.

You've been touting the low death numbers for days and now you're moving the goalposts.

 

[sheepdogs1]

Oh yea, I forgot to make my point coolm.... You asked if they feel any responsibility for it. The convo got HEATED last night when that insinuation was made...That you not wearing a mask and spreading it around was selfish.

They said "we are tired of hearing that... thats the problem with your side. If we don't have the same opinion, then we are mass murderers, and that is just ridiculous. Are we not allowed to have a different opinion?"

We respond.... "buuuuuttttt, your opinion is making people sick, hurting the economy, and killing people"

They respond.... "but we don't think thats true"

When the difference of opinion is who makes a better meatloaf, my mom or my aunt, that is one thing... But when the difference of opinion is potentially causing someone to get sick or die, how do you accept it? How do you respond with "well, they won't wear a mask, social distance, take any precautions in public.... and I respect their right to do so".

That's the conclusion my family seems to want us to come to... to just respect their opinion that it's a hoax and move on.

Not sure that's possible.

If you had a choice of standing next to an individual who is virus free and not wearing a mask or standing next to someone who is wearing a mask, but has the virus, which of the two would you choose?

 

[steverocks35]

By the way, Florida's positivity rate has been hovering around 20% for about 3 weeks now. That's an incredibly high number, and it means they aren't testing nearly enough people.

 

[coolm]

Oh yea, I forgot to make my point coolm.... You asked if they feel any responsibility for it. The convo got HEATED last night when that insinuation was made...That you not wearing a mask and spreading it around was selfish.

I feel your pain dude. It's a quandry. Luckily my immediate and semi-immediate family is all in agreement. It's the outliers in Kentucky and some in Indiana and Michigan who remain skeptical and take the approach you articulate.
And, of course, it seems like everyone around me in OKC.

Bounce - you're using too much information. the ohio governor's approach is to show a front of solidarity for safety while still maintaining some tolerance for his detractors (like that Sheriff Joe or whatever his name was). He says it is in the hope that HIS focus will be enough to make a high enough percentage of people follow his view so that they get a foothold on the problem. Will it work in the end? I dont know. We have a mixture of micro and macro such that getting too deep into either blurs a good decision. At that point I always defer to safety. Thats why I think he's doing the best job.

Who am I pointing my finger at? any of you who claim it to be overblown or a hoax or knee jerk or unnecessary. any minimization. we are still in need of performing the FIRST step for SWIMS procedures: stop the spill. We havent done that yet so we can't get to step 2.

 

[steverocks35]

If you had a choice of standing next to an individual who is virus free and not wearing a mask or standing next to someone who is wearing a mask, but has the virus, which of the two would you choose?

How would you know the difference?

 

[stormspencer]

You've been touting the low death numbers for days and now you're moving the goalposts.

Moving the goalposts to what/where? I'm not sure where you are going with this. If you're implying that the three particular states you have recently begun to targeted inquisition (Florida, Texas, Arizona) have low death numbers and low death rates (comparatively speaking), I guess it depends on what you consider "low death". For example, Florida's daily death total over the last fourteen days: 45, 67, 67, 18, 29, 47, 63, 48, 120, 93, 95, 45, 35, and 132.

Compare those numbers from a population standpoint with what you saw in NY, NJ, Mass, Michigan, Connecticut and Pennsylvania.....and draw your own conclusions.

 

[steverocks35]

Moving the goalposts to what/where? I'm not sure where you are going with this. If you're implying that the three particular states you have recently begun to targeted inquisition (Florida, Texas, Arizona) have low death numbers and low death rates (comparatively speaking), I guess it depends on what you consider "low death". For example, Florida's daily death total over the last fourteen days: 45, 67, 67, 18, 29, 47, 63, 48, 120, 93, 95, 45, 35, and 132.

Compare those numbers from a population standpoint with what you saw in NY, NJ, Mass, Michigan, Connecticut and Pennsylvania.....and draw your own conclusions.

Moving the goalposts to "well the deaths won't reach New York/New Jersey levels." You don't know that.

I'm not going anywhere with it. I have pointed out repeatedly that deaths lag hospitalizations which lag cases, and that huge surges in cases, like we are seeing all throughout the South and Southwest will lead to increased hospitalizations and then increased deaths. You seem to think that the big increases are due to increased testing, although the positivity rates tell us that isn't the case, and now the deaths are starting to tell us that isn't the case as well.

You seem bound and determined to minimize this crisis in the face of all the evidence to the contrary.

 

[SoonerBounce13]

There is a huge conflict in my family right now about this..... Like many families, we have this big family text message thread with like 12-15 of us on it.

4 or 5 of us are like-minded... and the rest are not only not like-minded, but deep in Trump territory. They were never like this for Bush, not even close. They've gone off the Trump deep-end.

That being said, they are for sure doubters and minimizers, as you described it. Here is how the convo went down:

• "Hey I heard GT Bynum may require masks"- my liberal cousin
• "No way in hell I will cooperate with that"- my Trump sister
• "Well you kinda half to"-my liberal cousin
• "not gonna happen"- my Trump sister (with a bunch of agreements from the Trump brigade)
• "What is your problem with the mask? how did a mask become political?"- me
• "Because it's not as bad out there as you think it is"- my mom
• "Based on what?"- me
• "They are doing so much testing, so of course they are finding more cases, but the vast majority of people its nothing. Plus, the deaths are heavily bloated. I heard that they are counting deaths from other things as a Covid death if the person tests positive for Covid"- my mom
• "Who did you hear that from?"- me
• "News, and other places"- my mom
• "ok, so you think there is a virus?"- me
• "Yes"- my mom
• "But you don't think its that dangerous?"- me
• "Yea, I don't think its nearly as dangerous as they make it sound"- my mom
• "But you have nothing concrete to really base that on?"- me
• "Things I read and heard"- my mom
• "ok, but don't you think its better to err on the side of caution and just wear a mask? It can't be that big a deal"- me
• "no, because thats what they want you to do. This is all about Trump losing the election. They want schools closed, they want the economy tanked, they want people unhappy wearing masks, etc so they will vote for change"- my Trump sister, with lots of agreements from the Trump brigade

This happened last night in our thread.... You can clearly see their Trump influence... Trump, the biggest narcissist on the planet, has convinced people that even the virus is ALL ABOUT HIM. It's an attack on him.

I doubt my family is unique... You probably have this kind of thing going on all over the place. I know it is in my wifes family too.

people are dumb

There are truths on both sides though